Air Wisconsin pilots win!!

[Black Hawk]

AWAC was either pretty lucky or the management team was incredibly brilliant to have survived the UAL situation and find a place for their 70 jets so quickly. I hope you get what's due from management but they also did a good job of keeping AWAC afloat in a situation that could have easily put everyone out on the street. Black Hawk (AWAC short timer)

 

[hoover]

I just wonder about the future. When the USAir contract expires, or if they declare bankruptcy again, will AWAC find itself back in the same position it started in (i.e no flying contract and costs way above their competitors)?

 

[Black Hawk]

I just wonder about the future. When the USAir contract expires, or if they declare bankruptcy again, will AWAC find itself back in the same position it started in (i.e no flying contract and costs way above their competitors)?

Maybe. There isn't really a high level of security available in the airline business these days. AWAC certainly needs to diversify.

 

[HAirQ4]

Congrats all you Whiskeys! Gives us at Qx some more power for the ongoing talks.

 

[J32driver]

I think that they thought that they had a deal with United, affirmed or otherwise. I've met the 3 amigos. I saw one or the other one almost every day. I just don't think they were lying.

They intentionally deceived the pilot group.

The money from the pilot's concessions was supposed to be passed on to UAL. It wasn't, and the Amigos hid that fact from the pilot group for almost 1 year. The only reason we found out about it is because UAL ultimately rejected the contract. When UAL rejected the contract, the Amigos got caught redhanded holding a big fat bag of cash that was supposed to belong to the pilots. And they said, if you want it back, sue us!

Make no mistake about it. If UAL and AWAC would have come to an agreement at that 1 year point instead of splitting, the Amigos would have handed that big bag of cash over to UAL and pocketed the interest for themselves. The pilots would have never found out that the Amigos made money off of the concessions before that money was passed on to UAL.

I don't believe the Amigos set out to defraud the pilot group. I think they got burned by UAL at the outset and then tried to sweep it under the rug never for an instant thinking they would lose the UAL flying. When the did lose the flying, everything came tumbling out into the open for the world to see.

 

[rightrudder]

When I first found out that we didn't get the UAL deal, I did wonder how that they missed that little loophole in bankruptcy laws. But I just don't believe that they lied to us. I think that they thought that they had a deal with United, affirmed or otherwise. I've met the 3 amigos. I saw one or the other one almost every day. I just don't think they were lying. I could be wrong, but I think they were lied to by UAL.

If you saw one of the 3 amigos almost everyday, you must be in management. Your previous posts now make sense.

 

[rightrudder]

As a former AWACer, I can't let this one stand. No one "screwed" you. You and your fellow pilots AGREED to the concessions to help keep the company going. While the concessions didn't go for the stated purpose, it can't be denied that they were instrumental in getting a flying contract with USAir. If not for that, you'd have been on the street a year ago. Or more likely, you never would have been hired in the first place, judging by your screen name.

The thing that gets me is you probably weren't even around for the concessions. You were flying for ACA/Indy Air when all this began. So where do you come off complaining about it?

This is a good example of a post by someone who is not a line pilot.

 

[Rottweiller]

They intentionally deceived the pilot group.

The money from the pilot's concessions was supposed to be passed on to UAL. It wasn't, and the Amigos hid that fact from the pilot group for almost 1 year. The only reason we found out about it is because UAL ultimately rejected the contract. When UAL rejected the contract, the Amigos got caught redhanded holding a big fat bag of cash that was supposed to belong to the pilots. And they said, if you want it back, sue us!

Make no mistake about it. If UAL and AWAC would have come to an agreement at that 1 year point instead of splitting, the Amigos would have handed that big bag of cash over to UAL and pocketed the interest for themselves. The pilots would have never found out that the Amigos made money off of the concessions before that money was passed on to UAL.

I don't believe the Amigos set out to defraud the pilot group. I think they got burned by UAL at the outset and then tried to sweep it under the rug never for an instant thinking they would lose the UAL flying. When the did lose the flying, everything came tumbling out into the open for the world to see.

EXACTLY!! They thought they could try and shaw up the UAL deal behind closed doors however UAL wouldn't play and they got exposed through UAL's own court papers.

Now management (owners) have to pay the penalty and that penalty includes 3+ years of interest on the money they basiaclly stole from pilots, FA's, mechs etc for that matter, and I hope they all follow suit now there is a
precedence been set.

I have no sympathy for ATW, they have been exposed for what they truely are THIEVES!!

 

[TCBKING]

If you saw one of the 3 amigos almost everyday, you must be in management. Your previous posts now make sense.

Sounds to me like he is a dispatcher. I doubt he is in management. Just trying to make himself look like a big shot, Hob Knobbing with the owners. It would also make sense with his comments.

 

[Crossky]

As a former AWACer, I can't let this one stand. No one "screwed" you. You and your fellow pilots AGREED to the concessions to help keep the company going. While the concessions didn't go for the stated purpose, it can't be denied that they were instrumental in getting a flying contract with USAir. If not for that, you'd have been on the street a year ago.

As a current AWAC'er, I can't let your post stand. You yourself write that 'While the concessions didn't go for the stated purpose, . . .' ; what do you call that besides getting screwed? Fondled?

Our pilots responded quickly (and foolhartedly) to United's demands for a concession. Within a month after MEC negotiations started, we voted YES and had the votes counted. We could have done the same thing for US Airways, why couldn't we have? Even if we had voted NO the first time (always a good decision especially when you're being rushed in negotiations) the pilots would've likely voted yes for concessions later down the road.

 

[crashpad]

Our pilots responded quickly (and foolhartedly) to United's demands for a concession. Within a month after MEC negotiations started, we voted YES and had the votes counted. We could have done the same thing for US Airways, why couldn't we have? Even if we had voted NO the first time (always a good decision especially when you're being rushed in negotiations) the pilots would've likely voted yes for concessions later down the road.

Loooking back....Do you feel your MEC was being straight with the pilot group, or were they in the pockets of the Tres Cojones?

 

[masedogg19]

You were there weren't you?.....What do you think?

 

[DiverDriver]

AWAC was either pretty lucky or the management team was incredibly brilliant to have survived the UAL situation and find a place for their 70 jets so quickly. I hope you get what's due from management but they also did a good job of keeping AWAC afloat in a situation that could have easily put everyone out on the street. Black Hawk (AWAC short timer)

I can see why you and others would think along those lines. But here's a counter arguement. Had AWAC just gone and done a deal for CRJ-700s like UAL wanted (and awarded like candy) then they wouldn't have had to find a new home for their 70 CRJs! The 3 Amigos could have done a deal but they wanted their margin. Fine. But they didn't have a new deal with UAL like they told us they did. Then UAL says that AWAC had been paid the same all along and they were tired of it and put our flying up for bid. So, I see it a bit different. Yes, brilliant move and they made a sh!t load of $$ off the stock. But it wouldn't have been necessary had they just done what UAL wanted and gotten the 700s. Then again. Maybe this is exactly what they wanted to do. Have an opportunity to shake out the top seniority and lower their operating costs by lowering average seniority.

Just a thought.

 

[Crossky]

Loooking back....Do you feel your MEC was being straight with the pilot group, or were they in the pockets of the Tres Cojones?

I don't know, I was a pretty new 9 month probie. That's a pretty tall conspiracy order to swallow. I think they believed that Big blue was able and willing to farm out flying to lower cost bidders, and that has proven true.

I'm surprised you haven't wacked the other crashpad, goes by the name 'Crash Pad'. Can't have that now.

 

[lifeguard]

Can someone please give me the dates again of when the new {concessionary}contract was voted on and the date it went into effect? Will the pilots who worked there at the time the concessionary contract went into effect but no longer work there now get back pay?

 

[DirkkDiggler]

Was voted on mid April 2003. Went into effect Oct. 1, 2003.

 

[DiverDriver]

We don't know what the "remedy" will be yet. They have 14 days from last Friday the 9th to talk about a remedy. I doubt very much something will be reached and it will go back to the arbitrator for a final resolution.

 

[b19]

Good Job. You help to set the standard for the rest of the industry at the regional level, hell all of us could learn from your pilot group about having the courage to stand for your own personal self worth and staying united. Congrats and I hope we all follow your lead.

 

[masedogg19]

nevermind

 

[CAPT. NEW YORK]

Justanumba...love the avatar!!! That is a great movie, one of my favorites!