Air-Inc Seminar - DCA Sept 03. You goin?

[Treme]

Well, who's going to Kit's latest love-fest?

It's time for the Washington Seminar again and now the SOB is going to take advantage of the unfortunate circumstances surrounding our industry by offering, you guessed it, a "Furloughed Pilots Workshop".

Sheesh. What a slug.

Anyhow, here are the airlines in attendance this time around.

Alaska, ATA, SWA, AirNet, AirTran, Comair, Horizon, Jetblue, USA3000, Tab Express

and, i'm sure we'll get yet another motivational speech from US Airways unofficial representative -- Captain Lonnie Robinson.

 

[dashtrasher]

when and where??

 

[Treme]

Looks like the weekend of Sept 19th in DC.

 

[FlyForFood_NOT]

I don't think I'm going. Kinda tired of hearing Kit's corny as# speeches on how there WILL be a shortage of pilots in 5 years, and how you've made that first step towards your 121 job by "being here on the Air Inc seminar." Yeah, what a thief!!!!

One could say, then why did I go here in the first place?
Because he promises lots more than you find at those shows.

Here, an example for those who dont believe:
"AirNet will be there, hiring!" yeah, right, you come up to them and they tell you "umm, we don't collect resumes here because you have to apply online. Here is our business card."

Some of the airlines on the list don't even show up, they just leave you a box to drop your resume in (Mesa, and a few others on different shows...)

It just gets me frustrated that someone's getting rich on BS-ing people like that ... I think I'll save my $150 and spend it on new resume paper and envelopes. That's just how I see it ...

 

[FlyForFood_NOT]

oh yeah, Tab Express is attending? wow! where do I sign up?!?!

You guys know what their recruiters do? They literally leave their Tab Express post, take their resumes and go stand in lines with all the rest of the pilots attending the seminar. What a scam Tab must be if you see that happening. No shame what-so-ever.

But yeah, Kit's still standing strong advertising "they'll be there!."

Ahh, pathetic

 

[Badger]

Kit scum

This man is the lowest form of scum. I detest that I went to one of these things last year. Gee thats great that Tab express is 'recruiting'.... ask them how much it'll cost you to get 'recruited'.

What is the kickback to these airlines in attendance? I'm certain there is a payoff for them or they would not waste resources attending his scams.

I went to a job fair (non aviation) last week. I've gotta say what a delight it was to not be expected to pay AND have employers show genuine interest. (AND be offering positions 3x what commuter/regionals start at with Co. cars etc.). This is when you realize how broken this industry is.

Don't support Kit D's extortion, his speeches are without merit, history has demonstrated that, he is truely an enemy of aviation.

I couldn't believe he put that US Airways guy up there to talk last year, that's when I realized it was a joke. (furloughed back to a hire date of 1987 or 88).

If you pay this man..you will feel ripped off...you will feel raped when you leave.

 

[Caveman]

I pretty much agree with all the negative comments about Darby, however recent history has shown that the best way to get an interview these days is to get some face time with a recruiter. At Comair, for example, the best way to get an interview over the last year or so is to show up at one of Darby's parties and personally hand your resume to the recruiter. There are several folks that frequent this board that had no luck getting an interview with us until they went to the Air Inc seminar. Now they work for Comair. I believe Skiddriver is one of them. Love or hate Darby if it were me I'd pony up the $150 just to get to talk to a live recruiter from an airline that was actually hiring. In a 'normal' hiring market I wouldn't attend, but these ain't normal times.

Skiddriver, I hope you don't mind me dropping your name. If you get flooded with PM's forward them to me and I'll 'answer' em!

 

[FlyForFood_NOT]

Hud
very true, but there is a difference between Kit's fair and other job fairs.

Kit promises all those airlines to be there, and half of them don't show up, or tell you to apply online, or simply tell you you don't meet their competitive hours - come back again (and before you read that they're mins are still 1200tt - so you go because it's worth the $150)).

Your point would be valid maybe if Kit told all those people paying $150 a pop before hand. Then yes, don't like paying - don't go. But the way he advertises is just one big scam, and that's what he catches people on. Look at his ads, all those airlines he says "attended previously" were pre sept 11, and the list looks big, why would he say that I wonder...

And Caveman, yes, you're right, there are those lucky ones too that made their $150 worth gold...

 

[New2Flying]

Air Inc. Seminar

I agree with many others that feel that Kit Darby is a crook. Like $150 is "pocket change" to people that are furloughed now or just starting out. How many thousands of pilots has he taken advantage of over the years by charging his fees to belong to his organization?

There is another organization out there who has up-to-the-minute information about the airlines, their hiring practies, etc. The website is www.fltops.com and is operated by a Line Captain from Northwest. You can read his newsletter free and the cost to join to have most indepth access is $12.95 for the first month and $4.95 a month after that. A lot cheaper than Air Inc. He covers everything from wannabe's to low timers to major airline pilot info. If anyone out there is an AA pilot, he negotiated a deal with APA to get them to pay for either the initial sign-up or the following months, so take advantage of that. Go to his website to find out the info cause I do not remember what I read.

 

[prodigal]

There's always more than one side to every story. . .
I attended the seminar at DCA last year, and got an interview and job offer from Comair as a direct result of going to the job fair. It was definitely worth whatever I spent to attend."



Ditto for me. That's how I got my interview and job with Comair. So it was definitely worth it to me. Funny thing is, I almost didn't go because of all the negative stuff I'd read here. And I'm sure all those hundreds of others in line with me did not get interviews. And once there I almost didn't stand in that long line for my 2 minutes with the recruiter because of the seemingly bad odds.
But you have to have enough faith in yourself and you've got to plant a lot of seeds and eventually one will bear fruit. I looked at it as an investment, and a relatively small one compared to what it took to get here.
Now having said all that, I did feel a little taken adavntage of by AirInc. (before the call from Comair, of course) but I went of my own free will knowing the odds and the cost. It's up to every individual.

 

[New2Flying]

Just A Question

For those hired by Comair at the Air Inc. seminar, had you applied with them before and gotten no response? If you did apply before, how many times did you update your application with the airlines you applied for? Did you have any letters of recommendation on file with any of the airlines you applied for?

I think any steps that people take to further their chances of being hired are good. The objection I have to Kit Darby is that I have watched for years in this industry of his taking advantage of people and not really giving them the skills it takes to get hired. I realize he runs a business, but integrity has to be the most important thing in business. I hope those that go to his seminar are successful, but understand you are one of hundreds or thousands that are looking for that golden opportunity.

I have been on the Pilot Hiring Committee at my airline for a number of years. I saw a lot of mistakes being made that were easily corrected if someone was just prepared. I saw resumes with typos, contact info that was not up-to-date, etc. Have a good resume and an outstanding cover letter with your qualifications prepared by a professional and try to get some interview training. Career Fairs are different than regular interviews. You have about 2 minutes to make a good impression. Have a 30 second commercial put together to say who you are, what your goal is and what your quals are. As I posted on another thread, I had a resume done years ago when I was furloughed in 1992 by a woman who did pilot hiring for my airline for 3 years. She is great, understands our industry and is very helpful. Here is a direct link to her website that deals with pilot hiring. www.awriteresume.com/pilot.htm When we were furloughed, she made a personal call to David Neeleman, (now CEO of JetBlue) and asked him to hire as many of our pilots as possible at Morris Air. That to me is someone who cares! I went there for a few years before getting called back, but many of my friends now are sitting pretty at SWA. (maybe I should have stayed!)

Good luck to everyone! I know things are tight right now, but it will turn around. By the way, I heard that Alaska Airlines is now going to go to a completely automated system on the web with their hiring process. It will be their own system, so no longer will those companies that submit for you will be valid.

 

[trainerjet]

Re: Just A Question

By the way, I heard that Alaska Airlines is now going to go to a completely automated system on the web with their hiring process. It will be their own system, so no longer will those companies that submit for you will be valid.

It has been some time now since Alaska has used UPAS (one of those companies that submit for you). It's true that we will be going to our own online application at some point in the future when we begin recruiting again.

As a side note, attending the various job fairs (Air Inc., Women in Aviation, Organization of Black Airline Pilots, etc) has always been an excellent way to get noticed by the recruiters at Alaska Airlines.

 

[New2Flying]

Application Process

>>It has been some time now since Alaska has used UPAS (one of those companies that submit for you). It's true that we will be going to our own online application at some point in the future when we begin recruiting again.<<

I know that UPAS has been used by several of the airlines for years, but the trend is going, (as you have said about Alaska) for the airlines to stop the outsourcing, which is costing them money and utilize their own inhouse systems.

I also agree with you about going to different seminars. Just do not have expectations of getting hired from them. While it happens with some individuals, it will not happen with everyone. Use it as a learning experience. One more note...go to the booths of the airlines that you do not necessarily want to work for first and practice your 30 second commercial on them. The last thing you want to do is go "cold" to the employer you really want to fly for and stumble on your words!

 

[prodigal]

Comair

In my case, I had been sending in resumes for over a year with no response; no LORs. At the job fair I was not given a "mini-interview" backstage. I just stood in line and got my 2 minutes just like everyone else, then left. As I said, I left there thinking they were not interested in me. So it goes to show you that you never can tell. You've got to give yourself every chance, do your best and NEVER give up.
Of course, I cannot know for sure why they chose me for an interview, but I believe it is because my honest sincerity in really wanting to work for Comair came through. I think they're all about attitude and desire. Read Orel Hirshheiser's book. He talks about when he was on the mound nothing else existed in his universe except the next pitch. That's a candidates job as well, when you get your two minutes. That's your "pitch." Make it count.
Good luck!

 

[Publishers]

various

Just a couple of small things,

Outsourcing did not cost Alaska or anyone else anything. When UPAS was set up by ALPA, it did not cost the company, it cost the applicant. It usually cost more to do your own.

When you go to one of these, make sure you are competitive and secondly know something about the carrier. Lead with your strength-- I have 1200 pic multi engine turbine or whatever. I am type rated in the 737, Don't make them look for what you know they really want to know.

Know their name, find it out before you get to the head of the line.

Do your homework.

 

[mar]

Vultures circling the hungry and thirsty

"Outsourcing did not cost Alaska or anyone else anything. When UPAS was set up by ALPA, it did not cost the company, it cost the applicant. It usually cost more to do your own."

Words by Publishers.

You know, that's really the slap in the face isn't it?

That an organization like ALPA, supposedly looking out for the best interests of pilots, would set up a scam like UPAS.

Pilots making money off of pilots. Just like Kit Darby.

It's all pretty sick and twisted if you ask me.

Boo.

 

[Publishers]

right

well the fact is that ALPA dropped a pile of their members money on the project.

The original intention was that it would act as a central clearinghouse for their airline members to use while the pilots could keep their information current. The concept might have been OK but the execution left a bit to be disired.

The short version is that they lost their rear ends. They then sold UPAS to AEPS right when things started to go south. When Delta quit hiring and TWA was aquired by American, UPAS lost all its members and AEPS owed ALPA.

They then took over AEPS which they do not know what to do with either.

 

[Ted Striker]

Alaska

I don't think Alaska is going to be there. They don't mention anything about it on their website and they have pre-announced the other conferences they were going to be at.

 

[House_X]

Darby is the B.T. Barnam of Aviation...and Air Inc. is his snake oil.

Even when times were good, I felt the whole Air Inc. thing was a scam. There are a few publications that are worth buying, but I give credit to the writers. The magazine is basically always obsolete thanks to the internet. I used to like the other airline job career magazine...I forgot the company that published it.

It's interesting to see how more people are catching onto Darby's snake oil. Doesn't he own a Citation?

 

[ArcherB]

You guys that got offered interviews with Comair as a result of the Job Fair what kind of time did you have. I am in a similar situation where I have had my resume walked into Comair and have applied many times but still have heard nothing.