Age 60 informal poll

[filejw]

cat, Not quit true on the medical . Some country's are some are not.

 

[Klako]

There are holes all over this Age 65 argument. It is nothing more than abrogation of seniority rights against the junior pilots. It’s a money and job grab.

If this POS passes, then it's to the back of the bus!! It’s the only fair way since we were all hired under AGE 60 RETIREMENT!!

AA767AV8TOR

New from our APA Prez:

In the air beyond age 60?

By RALPH HUNTER

Special to the Star-Telegram

What a crock of horse S%#t!

Ralph Hunters’s article is nothing but but pure APA propaganda, a pathetic example of twisted logic. It is becoming clear that as a result of recent actions by the ALPA and APA, the so-called legacy carriers like United, American, Northwest and Delta are condemned to the death throws of extinction. Greed, ineptness and blindness to reality will also destroy the likes of the ALPA and APA. The old guard pioneers of the golden age of aviation should be raging mad in their graves at the miss deeds of today’s big airline union politics.

You call it "a money and job grab". Yes, that is what we have now. The senior more experienced pilot is unjustly robbed of his job just to placate junior pilots who smell blood every time a senior pilot nears age 60.

 

[Black Hawk]

68? How can you say that? That's age discrimination!! It ain't fair, I'm gonna sue!!! Seriously, as soon as you pick a number like 65 or 68, you're gonna have the 64 or 67 yr olds whining about discrimination.

Let em sue. Look at all the whining we're hearing on this thread and how little of it has to do with flight safety. Even if the rule changes ALPA can still negotiate a forced retirement at age 60 if they determine flying past that would impact flight safety adversely. They do that with rest requirements and other issues as well. The FAA just sets minimum standards to comply with. If ALPA and some airlines want to exceed those minimum standards then that's fine.

 

[b757driver]

Anybody else think this is a silly argument? After November foreign carriers will be flying into US airspace with pilots over sixty including some US citizens.The writing is on the wall it won't be long after that and we will have the same rules.

Yep, I do!
It's on the cards and it WILL happen - maybe not this year but within the next 12-18 months.
It's time for us, the "great" (such as it isn't) American airline industry to get it's head out of the sand and see what's happening outside these borders. Virtually every Western country will have the 65 rule by year end and there will be Captains - including US citizens flying foreifne-registered aircraft into US airspace.
As someone once said, change is hard for some people and some find it harder to accept.
Time to wake up to reality and realize this has ABSOLUTELY nothing to do with safety but everything to do with ME. ME, ME ie. greed!
It's going to happen, so you might as well get used to it.
If you want to retire at 60, then that is YOUR perogative, but don't tell others what they should and should not do. You do NOT know their circumstances nor reasons why they might opt to work past 60.
It's a free country, I think, so, let the individual decide, not ALPA or some other union.
Finally, we all know how and why this 60 rule was brought in. And it wern't for safety reasons. It was politics and we all know how noble that profession is :0 !!

 

[pilotyip]

repeat of an old thread, but it fits here. Age 60 was forced on the pilots back in 1958. ALPA was still fighting to get it repealed up until about 1970. This rule had nothing to do with safety; it was a deal between two W.W.II USAF Generals, AAL's C.R. Smith and Pete Quesada (sp.?) the first head of the FAA. It was to get rid of high paid pilots at the top of AAL the seniority list. It was done in the name of safety, because who can be against safety. It is like motherhood and patriotism

 

[b757driver]

someone say politics??

repeat of an old thread, but it fits here. Age 60 was forced on the pilots back in 1958. ALPA was still fighting to get it repealed up until about 1970. This rule had nothing to do with safety; it was a deal between two W.W.II USAF Generals, AAL's C.R. Smith and Pete Quesada (sp.?) the first head of the FAA. It was to get rid of high paid pilots at the top of AAL the seniority list. It was done in the name of safety, because who can be against safety. It is like motherhood and patriotism

Like I said, politics, pure and simple!
And everybody (well, some of us) were led to believe that it WAS in the name of safety.
And we all know that politicians and CEOs always tell the truth and nothing but the truth....lol !!!

 

[filejw]

YIP is right on the money history and all. And I'm an old guys who is afraid of the change as I think the IRS will change the pension rules. Just like he said. Me Me Me.

 

[Andy]

Andy: With answers like this do you think anyone will believe anything you write now. Then why not quit now if the age-60 rule changes, or at 55, or 59 1/2 or 62 or 65? What is so magical about age 60. Please answer this question please. Thank you.

Nice edit job on my response; you should consider running someone's political campaign. You've got a real talent for creative editing.

I don't know what's magical about 60; you'd have to dig up the research on it. I would, but the only problem that I see with 60 is that it's too old. Based on the FAA data that I've posted, I would be in favor of reducing the retirement age to 55. Pilots over 55 are a definite safety risk.
If you've got issues with the age 60 rule, dig up any FAA documents from the 50s that discuss the change and their safety rationale behind the change. I've already done a lot of research and posted multiple links. You've done none of that; you're just winging it, trying to find a plausible reason to cover your greed and lack of integrity.

If this is truly a 'cause' that you be fighting for, is it safe to assume that you will continue to champion this effort after January 28, or will you join the rest of the 59ers who have recently 'seen the light,' only to disappear once there is no personal benefit to them?

 

[Andy]

Here we go again, experienced Hero Pilot from ALOHA forced to retire. Must make room for new pilots. Can they equal this captain?

http://starbulletin.com/2006/08/27/business/story02.html

Newsflash: EVERYONE'S REPLACABLE. Even you.
Are you really able to fit through a cockpit door with an ego that large?

 

[Andy]

A person’s age must not be the sole determination of one’s ability to safely perform the duties of an airline pilot.

I wholeheartedly agree with you. Now, what's your brilliant solution to get rid of unsafe pilots?
In my experience, most pilots would never call it quits; their egos are too large to admit that the physical and mental abilities are diminishing. Heck, one of the studies cited by the paper that you posted a link to verified that vis a vis aging pilots' visual acuity.

Come up with a REAL solution, not just another 'arbitrary' number.