ACA Furloughs

[Herman Bloom]

That is exactly why Mesa isn't a Comair or Airwisky. Comair, if anyone remembers, had a pathetic contract before the strike. And it's also sad that those Mesa folks you spoke with don't realize that 1) they might not have the opportunity to "move on" and that 2) their attitude towards the whole situation is precisely WHY they won't be able to move on. Really ironic.

 

[Speedtree]

46Driver,

I have to strongly disagree with you. United's financial situation may be driving people to do stupid things but it is not the reason Mesa should accept their TA.

UNITED IS NOT LOSING MONEY ON ACA, SKYWEST, AND AIRWISCONSIN

we make UAL money while making a decent living. Sure United would like to take us for more and/or find someone to do it cheaper, but helping JO screw us out of a perfectly good relationship doesn't sit well with me.

I agree with Herman Bloom. You guys might never leave Mesa, especially if you drive the better guys into the ground. I want to work for a strong airline industry where we are at least paid a reasonable wage for the service we provide. If I had to work for someone like Mesa I would leave the industry. I can make more money at McDonalds, have more time off, and not have the responsiblity of people's lives in my hands.

Don't reject the TA for us. Do it for yourselves.

 

[dondk]

Apathy continued

Like I said.. I do not agree with the position, but these are guys with 3-4 years into Mesa. Upgrades have slowed to stopped, movement to the jet is slow from the prop's. But.. from a guy who already has invested 3-4 years at a barely aceptable wage they cannot afford to strike first of all. Secondly, what do they think they can get? A comair or Air Willy wages? Not with JO at the helm.

Their arguments were simple.. it will cost them more in lost wages then what they will get from a strike. It may take some of them years to recoup the losses from a strike.

Mesa, as an airline is simply not worth it. No one wants a career at Mesa, and those who are there for the long term are on the top of the food chain already.

Now.. JO throws out Freedumb, signs on with J4J, gets UAL, add's routes, jet's and more. So do they give up the growth and job security for what may amount to a couple of bucks? Most of them are counting thier days to bolting to the Jet Blue's, SWA, Air Tran or others.

I agree that with them signing a below par contract will hurt us all, but how do you fight apathy?

 

[RJPilott]

Re: apathy

I

The concensus I got... why go on strike for an airline like Mesa? It's not a Comair, Air Wisky or anyone of great value.

If they ratify this TA, there may not be anyone else worth of value to go to....

No one can compete with their horrible work rules, pay, benefits, etc without giving concessions of their own.

 

[Jeepman]

IF MESA IS NOT WORTH IT & THATS NOT WHERE YOU WANT TO BE THEN TELL J.O. TO STICK IT & REJECT THE TA!!!! THEN APPLY AT ANOTHER AIRLINE!!!!

IF YOU DON'T DO THIS YOU MAY BE STUCK AT MESA FOR LONGER THAN YOU THINK AND REGRETTING THAT YOU DIDN'T RAISE YOUR QUALITY OF LIFE WHEN YOU HAD THE CHANCE!!!!

 

[AirBoard]

Re: apathy

I spoke with a few Mesa pilots recently about the issue of the TA. These were guys who I worked with while at Mesa.

The concensus I got... why go on strike for an airline like Mesa? It's not a Comair, Air Wisky or anyone of great value.

And never will be with that attitude!

All of the guys had the same opinion. It is not worth thier time to go in strike as NONE of them are looking at a career at Mesa.

Of course, with Delta, UA, American, Continental, Northwest, and USAirways doing so much hiring it should only be matter of picking up another 500 PIC time.....

While I think the TA is a joke, I can also see thier point(s).

I can't.

Although the "promise" of Freedumb going under and those 70's and 90's coming over AND they are one fo the few regionals still growing, what would you do?

Well, I guess that depends on how one feels about their brother and sisters in this industry. Can you hold your head up high when you know you've grown at the expense of other regional jobs?

Why go on strike when it really is not going to do anything for THIER career's.

Ohhh, but it is. For theirs and everyone elses. How can they not see that?!?

 

[CRJ puppy]

It IS extremely simple:

You fight apathy by NOT aquiescing (sp?)...i.e., by NOT voting for the TA.

It is really quite simple.

Don't you value yourself more than that?! (<-- sorry, rhetorical question as it is painfully clear that you do not.)

 

[Publishers]

fold'm

As the song goes, "Know when to hold'em, you got to know when to fold'em.

Unfortunatley the crowd who is yelling the loudest for taking a tough stance are usually not the people who will be on the street.

The re-alignment of the industry is far from decided. One thing that is evident is that labor costs will be reduced and the product offering in the future different than today.

 

[skybuda]

First of all I will say that I voted this damm TA down, with that being said I do plan on being out of work in the next 6-9 months. Now it is time to work on plan B, if it is Mc D or the big K let it be. I know that I am calling JO bulff but I it like taking a hit on a 12 not like Comairs doubling down on a 10. Eveyone out there saying that he can't ramp up freedom to take over mesa in a short time, I am sorry to say I think he can. As soon as this TA is voted down and the frist 300 notices go out, I can see those freedom seats start filling fast. In a year there would be no peoblem for him putting 50 or so jets on line.

To all the wise ones that just keep spouting off VOTE NO VOTE NO, which alot of us did. Where is our leverage going to come from, you know that we will never get released to strike, Airways is still BK, America West got a fed loan, and Bush is in office. Add that to our Meadator in for a heart bypass, it is just going to give JO and Freedom a larger head start. It has already be said that if it isnt taken then we start from a blank sheet of paper, I guess in another 12 months or so after all the JO delays and we vote on the second TA there maybe 300 of us left.

Lastly two get it off my chest: I know that many of the people that keep saying vote no vote no with be the fist to start the thread, "Mesa got what they deserved, and are gone" and with that sedement out there how many guys do you think are going to give a rats ass. Blast these guys day in and day out, and then because they have the ice cream that you need to eat they are spose to be your best friends and listen. Kind of like when the wife keeps nagging to take the trash out and it goes in one ear an out the other.

Just my 2 cents
lets hope for a NO vote tommorow and see where it goes from there

 

[cocknbull]

What don't Mesa pilots understand. If United baggage throwers can fight for wages better then many regional pilots then certainly Mesa pilots can fight for better wages. Your worth is set by you and not management. If you believe that worth as a pilot is crap then that is what you will get. You will not gain any ground on getting into big jets and higher wages by accepting this TA. All that will happen is more flying will be taken from pilot groups that have worked hard to earn their pay, and give it to low ball whores like MESA. There will be no high paying 737 jobs at Delta, just a bunch of low paying jobs flying 90 seaters for MESA. I hope you will see that your future is not in a 777 making 300,000. It is in a 90 seater making 42,000. Do MESA pilots really think that a pilot group as distinguished as Delta, American, and United is going to want to hire a bunch of whores with no self worth. I don't think so. If you are a MESA pilot who feels that your self worths higher then the TA and is willing to fight for what is yours than I apologize for my strict critique.

I guess the best place at the casino is at a poker table with a bunch of Mesa pilots.

 

[Mayday911]

If the TA is voted down, that does not automatically mean a strike will happen.

As for Freedom taking over if the TA is voted down, I say that JO will start an airline in the future that is a Freedom like entity to use against you in your next round over negotiiations. You don;t believe me? Yhen a history lesson is in order. Look at the situation at American Eagle. They signed a 16 year no strike clause, with pay based on industry average (with favorable caps for management), They did this to expand and to combine all of the Eagle carriers (Flagship, Executive, Wings West, and Simmons) into one giant regional carrier. In a word or acronym, SCOPE. While the pilots at Mesa think that their SCOPE language is iron clad, I bet there are thousands of labor lawyers out there that will be willing to work for big corporate bucks in order to crcumvent that supposed binding agreement.

I guess this is all kinda a waste of time since the ballots are already in. I have been writing letters to Duane Woerth in hopes of getting him to not sign this agreement if it is passed. And I urge that all members of ALPA do the same.

Mayday

 

[RJPilott]

I know that many of the people that keep saying vote no vote no with be the fist to start the thread, "Mesa got what they deserved, and are gone"

Actually, I'll be one of the first to cut a check for you. Thanks for the NO vote. Just look at it this way, if you do vote down this TA, you can get a job as a FA and have better QOL and pay than you would have if you voted it in while waiting on a job for an airline with a real contract. Freedom is going to have a VERY tough time operating when and if this TA is voted down. Freedom pilots are going to have to live in domicile or JO is going to have to pay for their DH's if he has commuters for pilots. Its horrible you guys are in the position you are in, but you guys do have a chance to be heros....

 

[eaglefly]

Well, I NEVER thought I'd see the day when we at Eagle would be able to pass the baton to another pilot group for the worst contract EVER ratified.

Our contract blows the Mesa contract out of the water. Sadly, another pilot group now has to learn the hard way that the ramifcations of the tragedy that they will thrust on themselves will FAR outweight the temporary protections and advantages.

They should have learned from others mistakes.

They'll have nobody to blame but themselves.

Welcome to your nightmare Mesa. Brace for your future.

 

[B1900DFO]

Are you saying it passed???? Say it ain't so.

 

[Palerider957]

There's a lot of wisdom on this thread.

I think we are all in the job where we will remain for quite some time, there is NO light at the end of the tunnel re: getting to the majors. We need to fight to make our current pay and working consitions as good as they can be.

To say Meas pilots don't feel it's worth fighting for, they are sealing their own demise. I'll say it again, NO ONE IS GOING ANYWHERE ANYTIME SOON, your at the company (and probably in the seat) where you're going to stay for a few years.

If my wages dropped with no prospect of recovery, and more days off were eliminated--I think I would change careers. This is a cool job, but at some point you have to have self respect, not to mention feed your family. To the Mesa guys, your management is directly trying to take food out of the mouths of your kids, that may be worth a strike.

Good luck Mesa pilots....