ABX buys Pace

[hvydriver]

LJ,

We can keep flying the current schedule.

 

[erichartmann]

LJ,

We can keep flying the current schedule.

It has been my understanding that Astar has no spare airframes. Is this so? If so, how does Astar propose to service the DC-8 station(s) now "uncovered" by the loss of the airframe to be returned to lessor?

On another note, I heard one of your A-300's did a high speed abort last Tuesday at ILN, but had not heard why. Any idea what happened?

 

[LarryinTN]

looks like ABX added a director to the board that is experienced with mergers and acquisitions.

Should be an interesting week...

 

[erichartmann]

Should be an interesting week...

In many ways!

Glad I'm not on reserve.

 

[hvydriver]

It has been my understanding that Astar has no spare airframes. Is this so? If so, how does Astar propose to service the DC-8 station(s) now "uncovered" by the loss of the airframe to be returned to lessor?

You understand wrong.

On another note, I heard one of your A-300's did a high speed abort last Tuesday at ILN, but had not heard why. Any idea what happened?

Yes I do, but since it's an ongoing investigation, it's not appropriate to comment on it yet.

 

[erichartmann]

Yes I do, but since it's an ongoing investigation, it's not appropriate to comment on it yet.

That suggests it was not cut and dried; i.e. an obvious failure such as loss of an engine, fire warning etc.

 

[hvydriver]

That suggests it was not cut and dried; i.e. an obvious failure such as loss of an engine, fire warning etc.

No, the abort was cut and dried. There was, shall we say, a somewhat less than stellar response from folks on the ground, and leave it at that, ok?

 

[erwaz]

The real question is who is going to do the flying from the loss of 21 ABX aircraft and 1 Astar DC8 at the end of August!

 

[B737Dvr]

The real question is who is going to do the flying from the loss of 21 ABX aircraft and 1 Astar DC8 at the end of August!

I thought that the loss of the 21 aircraft was replaced by the 767's that ABX got, meaning that the 8's were replaced by some 767's, or do I have it wrong?
Anyone know how many of the DAL 12 767's have been converted or have started? If ABX wants to do some pax flying, then how many 767's do they have available for that?

 

[LarryinTN]

The real question is who is going to do the flying from the loss of 21 ABX aircraft and 1 Astar DC8 at the end of August!

The ABX aircraft that are being removed from the DHL system were not flying any DHL routes. They were all spares. DHL in releasing those aircraft is reducing the number of spares that they are carrying and freeing them up for us to use on non-DHL work.

Two of the DC8s are already scheduled to take over a couple of charters from the MIA 767 domicile which frees them up for a new SJO/LAX/MEX/GDL/GUD trip. Not sure if that trip is for DHL or if it's a non-DHL charter.

The DC9 has actually picked up a couple of cities since July.

 

[goastar]

Noticed the 72s are picking up HRL, and DAL layovers, and adding OKC,and LBB as through stops in Oct. Thats an increase of 2 layovers for the 72. ATL now terminates in GSO, and PHL now terminates in ROC. I would guess ABX is doing ATL and PHL. Don't know what our 8's or airbuses are adding or subtracting. Don't forget who we all work for, this is just where the darts landed today.

 

[abxaviator]

No, the abort was cut and dried. There was, shall we say, a somewhat less than stellar response from folks on the ground, and leave it at that, ok?

I believe the initial query was simply waht may have happened with regard to the aircraft; I also heard there were injuries to the crew during egress, I hope they are well and will recover quickly.

 

[Jurassic Jet]

Noticed the 72s are picking up HRL

When are you guys starting HRL? It shows on our Sept bid packs all month.

Are you sure you wouldn't rather have LRD than HRL???

 

[goastar]

Looks like Oct 3, and I think we would rather have neither. I think it would be alright to cut TX in half and give that back to the mexican americans.

When are you guys starting HRL? It shows on our Sept bid packs all month.

Are you sure you wouldn't rather have LRD than HRL???

 

[Clipperskip]

HRL and LRD

Looks like Oct 3, and I think we would rather have neither. I think it would be alright to cut TX in half and give that back to the mexican americans.

I do not know how your HRL and LRD lines will be built in October but they were fairly popular for the DC-9 guys at ABX. Both flights had 36 hour layovers and even though the destinations may not be the greatest the long layovers made them easy on the body. The two trips with 36 hour layovers were also responsible for creating approximately 8 lines. That is quite a bit of flying. We will miss them dearly but we have learned the hard way not get too attached to any trip because of DHL's ever-changing flight operations plan.

 

[erwaz]

Astar does not do 36 hr. layovers because we have a domestic certificate in addition to flag and supplemental certificates. When ABX buys Pace, ABX will get a domestic certificate and your 36 hr. layovers will be gone.

 

[Clipperskip]

36's

Astar does not do 36 hr. layovers because we have a domestic certificate in addition to flag and supplemental certificates. When ABX buys Pace, ABX will get a domestic certificate and your 36 hr. layovers will be gone.

Don't count on it Tazz! There is more to it than that....

 

[lahyatt]

Well it is the 9th has anyone heard anything??

 

[abxaviator]

2nd Quarter Statement was released after market close today. NO mention of Pace. Conference call is 10am tomorrow, maybe then? If not, I guess the rumor may be just that?

 

[av8rnate]

Just got through listening to the conference call. According to JH there was NO acquisition, but they are aware of the rumour. I suppose that's all it was.

 

[B737Dvr]

what a big puff of smoke!

Yeap, I just got done listening to the concall myself and I was amazed that Joe was asked directly if there was an acquisition. I find it curious why he hesitated, but eventually said no flat out. So there it is.
It was said that the biggest constraint on ABX's procurement of non-dhl based business was the lack of aircraft availability. From what I heard on the call, of the 12 DAL 767's bought; 2 were brought online in jun of 05', 2 will be brought online this year(1 for the full Q4 and the other for half of it, for you ABX guys), and then Joe was asked his guess on the other 8.....to which he replied that he hoped to get 6 in 2007 and the last 2 in 2008.
The other big question is the avialability of hanger space for additional business. In reference to the flat panel mod question Joe got, her basically said there was no pipeline for it, just a big market potential for the 75/76's out there already and it's commonality to the 737NG family. This could also be constrained by the lack of hanger space in which to do the mods, so that could also be holding back any possible pipelines.
IAI, according to the call is the only modifier for the 767's and Boeing expect to have their facility up and running in Q2 of 2007, which explains why Joe hopes to have 6 done next year.
Well as far as the Pace deal.....he said that with their new board member, they have worked on development of new non-dhl business this summer and will continue to do so in the fall.

from the above flat out rejection of an acquisition and the delay in getting aircraft done....i don't really expect any developments on the pace deal in the near future, the only thing i see pushing that up to this year, would be the announcement of a DOD, CRAF type deal, where abx will use the 767 in the pax configuration, and then utilize the pace pax certificate to get this going quickly......so in the meanwhile we all wait........

any thoughts anyone?

 

[abxaviator]

Just goes to show, a rumor is just that until it isn't, eh?

 

[goastar]

"Don't forget who we all work for, this is just where the darts landed today.[/quote]

In todays news HRL,LBB,OKC,postponed indefinitely. Enjoy your continued 36hr layover.

 

[erichartmann]

Astar does not do 36 hr. layovers because we have a domestic certificate in addition to flag and supplemental certificates. When ABX buys Pace, ABX will get a domestic certificate and your 36 hr. layovers will be gone.

First, ABX could have a domestic certificate now if management wanted it. They prefer to opearate under the supplemental certificate for what I suspect are economic reasons. I was told the record keeping provisions of a domestic certificate are far more onerous than those of the supplemental.

Second, it's not so easy as just aquiring the certificate.

Third, 36 hour layovers are enshrined in our contract. Management is required to use them if a suitable follow on trip exists.

Last, of course, the aquisition of Pace has apparently not taken place (yet).

I think it suggestive that Hete hesitated before saying no.

 

[B737Dvr]

First, ABX could have a domestic certificate now if management wanted it. They prefer to opearate under the supplemental certificate for what I suspect are economic reasons. I was told the record keeping provisions of a domestic certificate are far more onerous than those of the supplemental.

Second, it's not so easy as just aquiring the certificate.

Third, 36 hour layovers are enshrined in our contract. Management is required to use them if a suitable follow on trip exists.

Last, of course, the aquisition of Pace has apparently not taken place (yet).

I think it suggestive that Hete hesitated before saying no.

Pace also continues to operate under supplemental rules, although they are approved for Domestic ops...for the same economical reasons.

The fact that Joe hesitated could be due to many different reasons, but ultimately, I don't think anyone is affected unless some sort of MAJOR announcement is made concerning any new contracts (ie. DOD, CRAF etc).

The only affect any new biz like flat panel mods, new mx with more hanger space etc etc..... will be to the bottom line and for mx people.

In my opinion, the only thing that will affect crews on either side, would be some sort of MAJOR announcement (like a new DOD, CRAF contract) going into effect asap...thereby utlizing pace's pax certificates....(thats when things would get interesting)....but unless something like that happens, any new freight biz would have to wait till the new 767 come off the line, which puts this all out of the near future pipeline........

If this acquisition is just a signature away, i say again, unless some sort of MAJOR pax flying announcement is made, then people on either side will remain unaffected and this would just be a boost to the bottom line's earning capability......

any thoughts?

 

[inplaneview]

In regards to Pace and other rumors...I'd bet something significant is in the works. Reference Joe's specific comment on merger and acquisition when he introduced Fritz Reed in the press release:
"Fritz Reed has a broad background in corporate legal and financial management and consulting, with particular experience in strategic and business development, including mergers and acquisitions. I am looking forward to his contributions as we expand and diversify our base of business at ABX Air."

 

[erwaz]

Don't be surprised if Astar And ABX merge.

 

[Narco-leftseat]

Don't be surprised if Astar And ABX merge.

I won't be surprised at all, DHL loves to have multiple carriers, but let's face it, The competition in the US consists of two of the best run, best managed, most efficient companies in the World....you know who they are.

Of course DHL loves the leverage they posses to replace an airline with rising labor rates. (Morelike refusal of concessions) I think the costs of staffing two loading systems, two maintenence departments, two scheduling departments, two planning departments, two dispatch departments, two security departments, two training departments....you get my drift.....Has cost them greatly. Although DHL doesn't pay directly for these departments, it is reflected in the cost that is passed on to them.

Once again folks, DHL has been financially spanked and put to bed by trying to outsmart/outplay the best folks in the industry who operate one cohesive, yet fully represented carrier a little bit down the river from ILN....