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AAI contract

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gt1900

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 12, 2005
Posts
609
Figured we could start a new thread based on the AAI TA that the union signed... Also, lets just post truths, and not rumors or speculation, or things you heard from other people.. Heres what I saw today. Don't quote me exactly because I only looked for about 2 minutes, but these are some highlights..

Capt Pay at the end of the 4 year contract.
Year 12...$167/hr (or pretty close, cant remember exactly
Year 15...$180+/hr (again, don't remember the exact number, just remember it was more than $180)

FO pay.
1st year... Same with o change through the life of the contract
3rd year.. At signing date.. $68/hr (+plus some change, again, dont remember exactly).... At the end of 4 years around $71/hr
15 years.. Right around $100/hr

*Fo pay came up, but its still not as good as Frontier/Alaska

Retirement 12.5% into the B-Fund (don't know if that started at the day we would sign the contract or at the end of 4 years)...

Scope.. I belive it was nothing over 88 seats.. Plus, the union guy said something else about a CASM or something not being able to be too high... Again, this is really blury but I'm pretty sure the 88 seat thing is correct..

There is some retro pay/ retro bonus or whatever you wanna call it.. Though it didn't look like a he!! of a lot..
 
no matter what the pay rates and other things are. I vote NONONONO. no seats over 70 for anyone but airtan pilots. please guys, look across the street at delta and ask them if they should have ever given up 50 seats much less 70 seats. just say NO!
 
ngsp said:
no matter what the pay rates and other things are. I vote NONONONO. no seats over 70 for anyone but airtan pilots. please guys, look across the street at delta and ask them if they should have ever given up 50 seats much less 70 seats. just say NO!
Click to expand...
Copy Dat! It's a NO for dis cat!
 
gt1900 said:
Retirement 12.5% into the B-Fund (don't know if that started at the day we would sign the contract or at the end of 4 years)...
Click to expand...

Look again, the B-fund remains at 10.5%. The Company has added a 2% match (401k) graduated over three years. That was really generous!!!
 
Big NO here. Whats up with this crap about not getting paid until the aircraft moves or has been sitting for 5 minutes. Another thing how can AP say this will be a short agreement, were looking at 6 years minimum under this POS. I'm shocked that after three years the best they could do is bring back a consesionary agreement.
 
I'm shocked that after three years the best they could do is bring back a consesionary agreement.

I'm shocked that you guys still hire scabs and then ask them to run your union.
 
NO, if anybody going to fly 86 seat airplane it is going to be us. I just dont understand what the BOD thinking, I wouldnt even wipe A$$ with it, my A$$ is above this piece of sh!t.
 
RIDETHELIGHTING said:
I wouldnt even wipe A$$ with it, my A$$ is above this piece of sh!t.
Click to expand...
Nice...

Good thing we can download it electronically... saves me the trouble of wasting paper to print it. Speaking of which, do you think the Association will even bother printing copies to disperse at the road shows?

SHAMEFUL! And THIS is what people have been on 100-hour buyout for HOW LONG have given to us?

Vote NO, recall the NC, put a new NC in, put AP on notice that he's next if he doesn't grow a pair, and immediately ask the mediator for release into self-help. Ought to get somebody's attention...
 
totally unacceptable...the pay raises suck...even more when the work rules are considered they are even less of a pay raise....NO

<---------------------
 
Sub-service restrictions- greater than 60 aircraft reduces to 8% total flying. Greater than 80 aircraft reduces to 7% total flying and greater than 100 aircraft unchanged.
nSub-service operator allowed to operate up to 86 seats.
qSub-service cannot include carriers that operate aircraft with greater than 106 seats or greater than 114,000 lbs
nOther than turbo-props, sub-service carriers may not exceed 15% of company ASMs unless AirTran has greater than 60 aircraft in which case it will be 15.5%, greater than 70 aircraft not to exceed 16%, 80 aircraft 16.5%, 90 aircraft 17%, 100 aircraft 20%.

IT's official this is a turd.
I vote No!
I only made it to the second slide before I had to make my decision.
 
Did ya see what they did to the retiree health insurance. Before the company would pay their portion until medicare and now they only do it for 12 months. How would you like to be the guy retiring next month. Complete Bul***it
 
This thing sucks balls. Big NO from me.

Scope sucks, pay sucks, start of pay sucks, emergency sick bank going away sucks, reserve days on/off sucks, no commuter clause sucks, well it all pretty much sucks.

When can we vote no?
 
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No increase in per diem? WTFO? How we gonna feed the FA's....or tip the van driver for em ?....We get such great deals at the hotels we stay at...pleeeeez ...paid 30 bucks for my pizza and my 3 brews in HPN a couple months back. SWA...FOR EXAMPLE..GOT THE DEAL IN DTW with the fellas...cost me 3 bucks..for 3 beers...much better deal....

13 hr..and 2 for 1 duty rig...I guess that might work ?...a typical day is about 5-7 hrs credit on the 717 ?..

FO pay..too low probably ..Scope...well...I think we should fly em all....70 seats with a low CASM percentage.dunno...seems this should limited and force it to be NPA AirTran pilots...even if we need super small narrow body language ..

Shut the door and don't push for 5 minutes ....whatever..crap..that's about how long it takes anyway...we will be watchin the clock....duhhh..silly games we must play...why not give us brake release like everyone else...got to make it stupid.

Otherwise...8 yr CA...142.69...Not bad...but certainly not real good....

6400 signing 'lump sum'....not sure what to think of that..

With Mid Ex deals looming..it seems we can do a bit better....I duuno...I just want weekends off and work 2 trips a month...go fishin don't ya know there eh....
 
mnboyev said:
SWA...FOR EXAMPLE..GOT THE DEAL IN DTW with the fellas...cost me 3 bucks..for 3 beers...much better deal
Click to expand...

SWA does not negotiate with the hotels we stay at. They leave this up to our SWAPA hotel committee and they decide where we stay and sign the deals on SWA's behalf. This is not a contract provision, just a sign of trust that we have with the company and them to us.

This keeps us happy and they actually do a fantastic job finding us nice places.
 
Vote YES so Mesa and Skywest can benefit from your contract....WELCOME to MESA and S*taco and Skywest to bid on your flying !!!

No pay until you leave the gate??? OK change Airtran to Skybus... NO and NO
 
Did anyone mentioned that 737-700/-800 is now the same pay scale?
Also there is a new pay scale created for airplanes with less than 100 seats. Let me guess...88/hr for capt?

AirTran knows that they will loose money operating 50 seat subservice...done that. They know that they will break-even with 70 seaters, or they would already have them on property now. Our current scope allows them to do so upto 20% of our flying.

So as long as we don't let them subservice anything over 70 seats, our jobs should be safe...from farmers anyways.
 
As a side note, please take advantage of KG's survey that was in everyones boxes to let him know how you feel. It would sure be good to send him the message that way in addition to a resounding NNNNNNNNOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
This negotiating committee had a tremendous opportunity going for them (merger+shareholders' meeting) and still were manipulated into emerging with a concessionary contract!

I think they need to all step down, and make way for some guys with the testicular fortitude and negotiation experience they are so clearly lacking.

AP- we appreciate your efforts, but ever since the Christmas debacle, you have been on the wrong path . . . .it's time to step down and save us the effort of a recall. That is the best thing you can do for your fellow pilots.

TW
 
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Scope is a deal breaker on its own. Anything over 50 seats must be flown by us. Period!

Giving up 4 hour min day for 4.5 average? NO

Changing pay from doors closed to rolling? NO

Computation of pay based on average flown same three month priod in year prior versus scheduled? NO

Loss of Emergency Sick Bank? NO

Reserve overhaul? NO

Training section? NO

12 hour day gone? NO

Addition of 15 year pay scale? NO

These are just a few that come to mind. And all of that for what? A pay raise that almost keeps up with inflation. I get that this is a give and take and with the exception of section 1 (non negotiable), I might be willing to give on the other things if there was anything to take.

Depressingly, I was just speaking to a 9 year captain who was trying to sell me on how this mgt. team has kept every promise that it has made to the pilot group and how we should just trust them on the scope thing. I am just being paranoid he said. He was planning on voting yes. Bums me out.
 
It all seems to be a loss in every part of the TA. Are there any positives in this thing? Or is it all concessionary?
 
Glad to know how much our company values us as dedicated team players. A NO vote would have been more difficult if the company would have at least thrown in Frontier rates plus a bigger bonus. I believe everybody is finally unified. Time to make the new bus stickers. "Do not wave at our crewmembers, they are pissed!"
 
I don't work for AAI and I can understand that you are upset but don't be too quick to criticize or throw out your negotiating committee. As long as you have a membership vote you can vote down the TA. Sometimes the company and the union have a differing opinion on what the pilots will accept. One strategy is that the union can send a TA out for a vote (probably knowing that it will get rejected) to send a message to the company. The company always seems to think that they know the pulse of the pilot group better than the union and they are always wrong....now you have proof if the TA is rejected. It's not uncommon for a first TA to get rejected then tweaked upward for another vote. Also, be sure to view any TA as a whole and avoid being a "single issue voter." For example: scope at 50 seats; you may be able to get it (doubtful) but at what cost......pay, per-diem, scheduling? Also remember that the company has the upper hand to some extent because the NMB has essentially stopped releasing parties from mediation. You have to decide if it's better to get something now or wait a long time and maybe not do much better anyway. Anyway, good luck....I'm sure some of the small BS items can be easily corrected for a second vote but you will never get everything you want. If you intend to vote NO do your negotiating committee a favor and drop them a line detailing exactly what you see as the problems and why. This is helpful. Best of luck to you guys, you'll do fine in the end.
 

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