1000 hr turbine mins

[bugchaser]

When an airline requires 1000 hr turbine PIC, is any turbine time included? I know multi turbine would be more valuable, but what is the value of a bunch of single engine turbine PIC. Will soon have more than the 1000 turbine but will mostly be single. How will that be looked at by airlines? Thanks

 

[StarChecker]

I've heard Southwest doesn't care what type A/C the turbine time is in. JetBlue has a weight restriction. It's on their website.
Good luck.

 

[flx757]

FYI..the 1000 hrs in aircraft over 20,000 that jetBlue requires doesn't have to be turbine or PIC. Although they do have a seperate requirement for 1000 hrs turbine, the weight restriction doesn't apply to that.

 

[fredflyer]

bug,
As far as I know, if they say turbine PIC, then single is as good as multi. If they wanted multi PIC, they'd ask for it. As far as jetBlue goes, I had about 500 PIC multi-turbine, and 700 PIC single-turbine, and it got me in, so they don't descriminate between multi and single in that respect (as far as min quals go). And the other guys are right, they want 1000 hours turbine PIC, which can be in any size airplane, then they want 1000 in airplanes greater than 20,000 lbs. (not necessarily PIC) (I'm actually not sure if the weight is 20k, it was 10k when I applied but they may have changed it)

 

[PilotoHalcon]

I am not sure if a 24000lb helo would count toward the Jet Blue minimums.
j

 

[SkiHerkDrvr]

Jet Blue specifies 1000 hours in airplanes with a 20,000 or higher MTOW.

 

[Snoopy58]

Bugchaser asked

> Will soon have more than the 1000 turbine but will mostly be single. How will that be looked at by airlines?

Let me offer a couple of thoughts particularly as your time relates to the mins at SWA. First, 1000 hours in turbine cropdusters absolutely meets the 1000 turbine PIC requirement. If you meet the other requirements (2500 total time, ATP, 737 type, etc), you WILL be put on the list for an interview. (No guarantees how long the wait may be.)

That said, your app will look considerably different from the majority of apps that SWA gets. Most guys have either military, 121, or corporate backgrounds. Some have some cropdusting, but not many got their 1000 t-pic that way. The good news is that SWA does NOT use a cookie-cutter for making job offers. You do NOT need to "conform" to all the standard stereotype expectations (including navy suit, white shirt, red tie, plain-toe black lace-up dress shoes, black briefcase, blah blah blah) to get the nod!

The warning, though, is that you will have some things to "prove" to the interviewers / decision board that may go a bit beyond what a military/121/corporate guy has to show them. These 3 environments all operate mostly (or all) IFR, have considerable structure, generally lots of CRM experience (or leading a flight, for single seat military guys -- different but similar), and deal with a great deal of automation. You will do yourself the most favors by emphasizing how you function well in such an environment (doesn't need to be 1000 hours in that environment, but you want to convince them that you won't flail when you get out on the line in the jet).

Even if it isn't a lot of hours, being able to relate how you've done well with high performance aircraft in the IFR environment will reassure guys that you'll be able to pass IOE. CRM is CRM and doesn't need to be in a high performance aircraft, but you'll want to have several examples of working with another pilot in the cockpit to show that you can do that well. Being able to discuss the regulations & structure that you work within (working with a chief pilot to solve a problem, consulting a regs/policy manual for guidance, etc) will dispel the fear that you just "go out VFR & do whatever you feel like."

Please understand that I'm NOT suggesting that ag flying is in any way undisciplined, but the differences between the stick-n-rudder flying you do in VMC & low altitude with some fairly aggressive yanking and banking at times and the structured, highly procedural, crew-centered, FMC-intensive, "keep it smooth for the paying passengers" environment are significant.

If you are looking to apply to SWA and are planning on getting the type, you'll probably do yourself some favors by brushing up on IFR procedures & sharpening your instrument scan... The type rating school I went to could generally teach most guys who came to them to fly the sim well enough to pass the checkride, but some folks had a severely hard time with it; they tended to be mostly VFR pilots.

Several other places besides SWA have a sim ride as part of the interview; you might benefit from an hour or two with an instructor in such a sim getting used to "flying" in that enviroment. For guys who already fly one "heavy," I tend to think that buying time is "the exact same" sim you're going to interview in is a waste of $, but a simulator is a big video game & you do NOT get all the same cues flying it that you do flying an aircraft. Similar, overlapping skills, but if you've never flown a sim for a "heavy" aircraft before, you don't want to do it for the first time on an interview that matters to you!

All that said, I will respectfully disagree with the poster who said that you have to go to a regional first before your app will have any chance at a major like SWA or FedEx. While 121 time will certainly give you valuable experience in all the things I mentioned above, it is not the ONLY way to do it, and you may well have everything you need in your background to convince an interviewer that you can do well in training and IOE & become an asset to the company.

Two suggestions: if you're geographically close to one of the type rating schools, it might be a good thing to go chat with them about your background & what it takes for someone like you to be successful at SWA (or wherever your interest lies). I'll plug Higher Power (www.jetcrew.com) here -- great people who absolutely know their stuff. They see people with diverse backgrounds go through their programs & tend to have a good feel for who can do well & who will be severely challenged by the structure & IFR involved. Second, interview prep people like Rob Beeks ([email protected], iirc) also have seen enough people go through the process that he also can probably give you a good evaluation of how your experience & background would stack up.

Best of luck to you, and feel free to PM me if anything I said here is unclear or you'd like further clairification.

cheers,

Snoopy

 

[Ty Webb]

For the most part, single-engine turbine time is counted the same as C172 time when it gets down to the application process.

Why do I say that?

Get a copy of any airline application. They all contain a flight-time breakdown sheet. Look at how the columns add up . . . usually, single-engine turbine time ends up being added right along with single engine piston time.

When a company says "turbine time" it doesn't really have much to do with the way that the engine makes its power; it is more of a convenient way to say:

"Time operating in the enroute and high-density terminal areas under IFR, in a high-performance, pressurized aircraft, flown in an crew environment, utilizing the discipline of CRM, and SOP'S, while adhering to standard profiles".

Or something to that extent.

Now, I am sure some people are thinking, "Well, what about a PC12 . . . or some other high-performance single-engine turbine aircraft?". All I can say is "look at the application".

If you do get a chance to interview, plead your case, but if you want an airline job, I would focus on getting the kind of experience that they are looking for, not trying to decide how to fit what you are doing into their "box".

Ag flying looks like a blast. I would also like to fly a Caravan from MIA to Nassau every day, but I wouldn't want to hang my hopes of an airline job in this competitive market on doing either.

 

[atpcliff]

Hi!

One of our pilots knows a ton of FedEx guys, and the 1000 PIC turbine is exactly that. This guy has a lot of caravan time, and his FedEx buddies said it counts as it IS 1000 PIC turbine.

One of the reasons the airlines did this, was to let F-16 and naval (and now AF) flight instructors in who fly a single turboprop.

If it doesn't count for a specific airline, I'm sure you will know it, as they will specify so much PIC Multi-airplane, or so many pounds MGTOW, etc.

Cliff
GRB

 

[Ty Webb]

You may want to look into that a little more closely, Cliff. Fedex had a MTOW requirement in there . . . . don't know if they dropped it, or not.

Regardless, a quick look at most airline's Flight Time Break-Down sheet will show you exactly how they count single turbo-prop time, and for most of them, it's the same as a C210.