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Ehh...Bag handlers can be replaced. It doesn't exactly take a lot of training to sling bags. If they aren't happy with their pay, let them go find someone else that pays unskilled labor so well as SW.
 
Nice attitude about fellow Union employees. They have actually produced data showing their productivity advantages over the stations that Swa has contacted out.

Be careful, pretty soon someone might say to you, "eeee why do we have to pay you 12,000 a month when we can get an Indian/ Chinese pilot for 2000 a month." Watch out for that karma.
 
"Hey, there's a loose thread on your sweater."

"I'm not gonna worry about it, it's in the armpit."
 
Be careful said:
Good luck with that, hell they can't even find qualified pilots within their own country, why are they paying US pilots so much to fly in China and India??
 
Good luck with that, hell they can't even find qualified pilots within their own country, why are they paying US pilots so much to fly in China and India??

There are numerous flight schools here in the US that are cranking out Chinese students in great numbers. It is a huge business. Be careful, karma is a bitch..
 
China has a billion more people than the U.S. Plus the population of Texas.
Their middle class isn't like ours, but it is finally growing -
Every 1% of their population that joins the middle class is another 14 million people who need and want air service.
India has 1.27 billion people. Just a tiny mountain range away.
Those pilots are needed at their home. It's not cockiness, it's A fact that our pilots post 9/11 standard of living is some of the lowest in the world and in aviation history.
There was a lag, but the idea that there are tens of thousands lining up to fly in the United states for less just isn't bearing out anymore.
 
India pilot pay is near US pilot pay parity anyway (certainly nowhere near $2,000, even for new-hire F/Os). I have a few friends who fly for big airlines there. We're always comparing contracts. We have some better attributes and so do they. But they save waaaaaaaay more than we do because India aviator pay is higher than physicians in many cases (granted, not all), yet most of their society is still dirt poor. The little things in life are ridiculously cheap, usually 10-20x cheaper that Stateside (example, haircut is 80 cents). Everyone has drivers, cooks, nannies, etc too so they never waste leisure time doing household work. Meals are always ready, homes always spotless and clean, and they party w/o stress because driver picks them up for the club in their personal BMW.

Still, I'd take living in the US over India any day. No comparison besides the hired help and other accoutrements.
 
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I saw the anti-SWA "lost luggage ad" that the ramp personell's union took out in the USA Today. It was rather pointed, especially toward GK , but I'm not sure about the tone of the message. I'll try and summarize from what I remember of the text.

We used to lose very little luggage, now we lose a lot more bags. GK is a meanie and we don't like how he runs things because he's concerned about profits and not us. We handle your luggage, but it's GKs fault, not ours. SWA is making lots of money - so give us a raise. Hope you get your baggage.
 
I saw the anti-SWA "lost luggage ad" that the ramp personell's union took out in the USA Today. It was rather pointed, especially toward GK , but I'm not sure about the tone of the message. I'll try and summarize from what I remember of the text.

We used to lose very little luggage, now we lose a lot more bags. GK is a meanie and we don't like how he runs things because he's concerned about profits and not us. We handle your luggage, but it's GKs fault, not ours. SWA is making lots of money - so give us a raise. Hope you get your baggage.

The baggage folks, FA's and pilots are all in the same boat. Already well compensated pay wise, but steadily losing financial ground in health care costs, COLA and taxes. The company wants part time station operations, minimum block hours flown for FA's and scope/code relief from the pilots. That's where the rubber meets the road. As the stalemate continues, they will continue to chip away at our current contracts through company controlled items until, they absolutely need relief or work groups give in.
 
I saw the anti-SWA "lost luggage ad" that the ramp personell's union took out in the USA Today. It was rather pointed, especially toward GK , but I'm not sure about the tone of the message. I'll try and summarize from what I remember of the text.

We used to lose very little luggage, now we lose a lot more bags. GK is a meanie and we don't like how he runs things because he's concerned about profits and not us. We handle your luggage, but it's GKs fault, not ours. SWA is making lots of money - so give us a raise. Hope you get your baggage.

Less staffing on more connects, same ole technology on more connecting flights, and bigger airplanes on same or less staffing. Throw in a couple of events where they didn't hit the severe weather program even close to on time, and there are legitimate complaints -
I promise I'm a kool aid drinker, but I do like to deal in reality.
 
Comparing baggage handlers with other groups especially crews is absurd

What an elitist. Why don't you learn some history about unions and solidarity and check in again once you're caught up.
 
There is only so much money coming into a company, to maintain profits at the proper level and when revenue is not growing as fast as expenses cuts have to be made some place.
 
There is only so much money coming into a company, to maintain profits at the proper level and when revenue is not growing as fast as expenses cuts have to be made some place.

You might want to do a little research about how much money is being made before you spout off your anti-union, defeatist garbage.
 
You might want to do a little research about how much money is being made before you spout off your anti-union, defeatist garbage.
Hey Merry Christmas to you too, long time no see. So when the luggage handlers put up a picked line will the pilots and FA's cross it?

BTW: I thought you were getting out of aviation
 
Hey Merry Christmas to you too, long time no see. So when the luggage handlers put up a picked line will the pilots and FA's cross it?

Swapa wouldn't know what to do. The AFA on the other hand is a different story, but whether the rank and file would listen or not is a different story.
 
There's no AFA at Southwest. The TWU also represents the Flight Attendants if that's what your getting at, so there would probably be some in-house unity between two factions of the same union (both TWU on the ramp and In-Flight).
 
Bleh...:rolleyes: Baggage handlers here at SWA are some of the best paid in the industry. If they think unskilled labor deserves still more, maybe they should look elsewhere. I'm sure some of the factories or mills might be hiring.

Or get an education and a professional job.
 
Hey Merry Christmas to you too, long time no see. So when the luggage handlers put up a picked line will the pilots and FA's cross it?

You won't see any strike. The NMB would never release the TWU, at least not without knowing that a PEB is in the bag.

BTW: I thought you were getting out of aviation

I've got a little time left. And I'll still post here to annoy you and wavey. ;)
 
That particular post doesn't annoy me at all PCL

I do love how some here think they can be anti-union for unskilled labor and yet pro union for us.
That's rich.

The bar just keeps moving for conservatives. Now it's not ok to bust your tail all day doing productive work that needs to be done- one must be an educated professional to progress financially in their eyes.
And you wonder why so many are choosing to sit on the couch. Maybe because it pays the same poverty wage.

Go on then. I'll be here advocating that good workers do deserve a living wage.
The irony is then you'll blame me and other liberal's for the welfare state when the culprit is republican disdain for honest pay for an honest day's work.
 
Amen!
 
Socialist nonsense. You deserve what you can negotiate, and if you are too lazy to learn a skill or profession, then you don't leave yourself with very much negotiating power. Decisions have consequences.
 
That particular post doesn't annoy me at all PCL

I do love how some here think they can be anti-union for unskilled labor and yet pro union for us.
That's rich.

You keep saying stuff like that, Wave, acting like there's absolutely no middle ground, just to frame conservatives to fit the argument that you want to make. I know you won't admit it, but it IS possible to be pro-Union (for all work groups), like me; without being in the extreme "unions-can-do-no-wrong," like PCL. However, being pro-Union doesn't mean that all unions are always right.

The bar just keeps moving for conservatives. Now it's not ok to bust your tail all day doing productive work that needs to be done- one must be an educated professional to progress financially in their eyes.
And you wonder why so many are choosing to sit on the couch. Maybe because it pays the same poverty wage.

Now who's exaggerating?

Anyone who works should get paid. They should get paid what their group can negotiate, based on the market value of their labor. Some skills are valued more highly than others; hence those people can command higher wages.

Our rampers actually make pretty good money for what is essentially unskilled manual labor. My little brother used to be a ramper for us, and his first full year (he started in a summer) he made just over $50k. Not too bad for unskilled labor, and nowhere near the "poverty wages" you claim Nindiri wants to force on that work group.

Do they deserve a raise? Sure. Like every other workgroup here, including the pilots, they deserve actual COLA raises, and probably some QOL tweaks in their work rules and/or other bennies to reward them for their part in the company's recent successes.

Go on then. I'll be here advocating that good workers do deserve a living wage.
The irony is then you'll blame me and other liberal's for the welfare state when the culprit is republican disdain for honest pay for an honest day's work.

Actually, conservatives have no problem at all with "honest pay for an honest day's work." The key, however, is the word "honest." "Honest pay" is determined by, and is the result of market forces (supply and demand). For example, forcing employers to pay more than that honest pay for low-to-unskilled labor ($15/hr minimum wage for teenage burger-flippers) kinda' puts a hole in your "honest pay" theory now, doesn't it?

And yes, we'll still blame liberals for the welfare state. For pushing and expanding it, and even incentivizing it.

Bubba
 

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