Alaska and Delta: Frenemies?

[ImbracableCrunk]

http://www.fool.com/investing/gener...-still-want-to-be-friends-with-alaska-ai.aspx

Does Delta Still Want to Be Friends With Alaska Airlines?

By Adam Levine-Weinberg | More Articles
October 2, 2013 | Comments (6)
Delta Air Lines (NYSE: DAL ) has built a thriving international gateway in Seattle, thanks in large part to a partnership with Alaska Air (NYSE: ALK ) , which operates a hub there. Delta and Alaska code-share on numerous flights from Seattle, and Delta has relied on the "feed" from these flights to fill planes for its flights from Seattle to Europe and Asia.


etc. . .

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

No offense to the Alaska gang....

There is no effing reason Delta can't fly it's own 737's to feed Seattle.

Massive NWA carryover FAIL....

 

[flythere]

No offense to the Alaska gang....

There is no effing reason Delta can't fly it's own 737's to feed Seattle.

Massive NWA carryover FAIL....

None taken, I don't want to wear that dumb-ass double-breasted donkey suit, or worry about the base chief pilots roaming around assessing fines for not wearing your hat!! Or have to fly with Genny Lee!!

One can only assume that Daddy Delta is still bent out of shape over AK's agreement with American last year. This may be their way of applying a little pressure on us, to give a subtle nudge that they were not too happy!

There's no way AK could compete on those routes, would be better off exploring new routes, oh that's right, we have new routes; they'll be flown by SkyWest! My bad!!

 

[General Lee]

None taken, I don't want to wear that dumb-ass double-breasted donkey suit, or worry about the base chief pilots running around assessing fines for not wearing your hat!! Or have to fly with Genny Lee!!

Why spend the money on building up a new base when you have a code share partner that can do it much cheaper?? Nothing personal, it's just business!!

If it happens, you can be my FO on my first JNU flight. That will be awesome. Third and fifth beers are on me!


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[Redtailer]

None taken, I don't want to wear that dumb-ass double-breasted donkey suit, or worry about the base chief pilots running around assessing fines for not wearing your hat!! Or have to fly with Genny Lee!!

Why spend the money on building up a new base when you have a code share partner that can do it much cheaper?? Nothing personal, it's just business!!

Wow, someone a little bitter? Did you get turned down for the job or something? I've been to several major airlines and so far DL is the best one post 9/11. I assure you our worst day at work is 10x better than the best day at any regional. Personally I don't let the personality of another individual change the way that I bid. If he is a complete A hole then I know how to handle that. 99% of the guys though are great to work with.

 

[flythere]

If it happens, you can be my FO on my first JNU flight. That will be awesome. Third and fifth beers are on me!


Bye Bye---General Lee

They finally let you out of the pound huh?

 

[General Lee]

They finally let you out of the pound huh?

Wasn't I nice enough? I offered you third and fifth beers? Chillax a bit.

Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[Mea25000]

Things are just about to get even more strained... It could be very interesting for all of us over here at AS in 2014. RA and BT are playing high stakes poker and I sure hope BT is sitting on something real good.. I am confident RA is.

 

[General Lee]

It appears AK can fill their planes with their own pax, so DL needs some feed. The SFO to SEA flights will now feed Asia via SEA, since DL just announced the cnx of the SFO to Narita flight next April. Looks like SEA will get a lot bigger to Asia, with nonstops to London Heathrow, Amsterdam, and Paris as well. Feed from big cities on the West Coast will help feed those flights, and if AK flights are already full, then DL needs to do something about that. I think it's great they are actually doing something. The 717s arriving in ATL and DTW are freeing up some larger RJs, but 50 seaters are also getting parked enmasse, so those 70/76 seaters will be limited. Hopefully more mainline flights will go to SEA.


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[ImbracableCrunk]

Sure would be nice if AS bought more planes.

 

[Noserider76]

Things are just about to get even more strained... It could be very interesting for all of us over here at AS in 2014. RA and BT are playing high stakes poker and I sure hope BT is sitting on something real good.. I am confident RA is.

Yep, looks like they want to have a little capacity war with AS adding more flights on top of the ones DL just added. Like you said, should be interesting.

 

[CesnaCaptn]

Maybe this is a gang bang on VX. Then again, 3X flights per day hardly makes them relevant.

According to management, SEA-Bay Area is a loss leader. Every time we operate this flight we lose money. It's crazy that airlines are always up for a little attrition warfare.

 

[waveflyer]

Hate to say it, but the SWA/AK rumors are heating up- but no announcement possible til 2015- and coincident with huge growth announcement to take the edge off
Apparently mgmt learned from AT that stagnation and acquisitions are bad enough for morale that it affects the bottom line-
They knew there'd be some discontent- now they know how much-
Primed for growth and new destinations- the idea is to have so many new hires and movement, employees will be 'excited' about the move- they'll link growth to the merger to do this....
Then again I'm a pilot, and I might be starting sh/t to see what happens-
I think all the CEO's are constantly playing poker - BT, DP, RA, and GK seem to still be playing this particular alaska hand

 

[johnsonrod]

Get ready for the Seattle-bound Skywest MRJs in the coming years. That MRJ will look cool in the Eskimo paint scheme.

 

[RNP.15]

Why the big fuss over little Alaska Airlines. Were just a little boutique airline flying the west coast.

 

[mittro]

I believe the general is correct. DL is making a play on the Asia routes out of SEA and SFO/LAX/LAS are big destination's.
AS is already running load factor's in the mid 80's meaning less and less seats to offer on the codeshare. With the DL 717's coming online out east, Compass and Skywest can send the EMB-175's and CRJ-900's west to feed these city pair's with the a/c that are no longer needed, feeding the mainline asia growth!

 

[Noserider76]

Hate to say it, but the SWA/AK rumors are heating up- but no announcement possible til 2015- and coincident with huge growth announcement to take the edge off
Apparently mgmt learned from AT that stagnation and acquisitions are bad enough for morale that it affects the bottom line-
They knew there'd be some discontent- now they know how much-
Primed for growth and new destinations- the idea is to have so many new hires and movement, employees will be 'excited' about the move- they'll link growth to the merger to do this....
Then again I'm a pilot, and I might be starting sh/t to see what happens-
I think all the CEO's are constantly playing poker - BT, DP, RA, and GK seem to still be playing this particular alaska hand

Problem with that is the merger merry go round is most likely over. Think the government is kicking themselves for letting SWA take over it's main low fare competitor. Don't think AS-SWA would have much of a chance, but that's just my opinion.

 

[Saluki Dawg]

Except that Alaska isn't really considered an LCC. If anything they are closer to a legacy than Southwest, although we're working on it. I actually think that SWA/AAG would have almost no trouble getting DOJ approval.

 

[cbrown1]

Except that Alaska isn't really considered an LCC. If anything they are closer to a legacy than Southwest, although we're working on it. I actually think that SWA/AAG would have almost no trouble getting DOJ approval.

Many people thought AA/US was a sure thing as well.

 

[Noserider76]

Except that Alaska isn't really considered an LCC. If anything they are closer to a legacy than Southwest, although we're working on it. I actually think that SWA/AAG would have almost no trouble getting DOJ approval.

The past is the past. The government isn't going to allow anything except 2 relatively small carriers to get together. LCC or legacy makes no difference. They're won't allow the industry to get any smaller with fares up and companies making record profits.

 

[LandGreen]

Hate to say it, but the SWA/AK rumors are heating up- but no announcement possible til 2015- and coincident with huge growth announcement to take the edge off
Apparently mgmt learned from AT that stagnation and acquisitions are bad enough for morale that it affects the bottom line-
They knew there'd be some discontent- now they know how much-
Primed for growth and new destinations- the idea is to have so many new hires and movement, employees will be 'excited' about the move- they'll link growth to the merger to do this....
Then again I'm a pilot, and I might be starting sh/t to see what happens-
I think all the CEO's are constantly playing poker - BT, DP, RA, and GK seem to still be playing this particular alaska hand

Just a pilot too Wave, but I really don't think any Management team in the airline industry is stupid enough to grow huge, merge, or do anything that takes huge capital expenditures in order to make pilots happy. Much cheaper to give massive raise, get everyone drinking the koolaid, then run for bankruptcy court with their hands above their head....sound familiar?

 

[Saluki Dawg]

Many people thought AA/US was a sure thing as well.

That deal is still very much alive and likely to be approved after some minor divestitures at DCA.

 

[Flyby1206]

Many people thought AA/US was a sure thing as well.

I still believe a lot of that conflict was created from within (someone in AA like Horton pissed about not getting his way)

 

[cbrown1]

I still believe a lot of that conflict was created from within (someone in AA like Horton pissed about not getting his way)

I think there was conflict created by the speed at which us management was starting to run aa from the outside days after the merger announcement. However, I think the theory that horton has been manipulating things from the shadows to derail this is far fetched. Baer wants to show everyone there is a "new sheriff in town" and it's sad that it's at the expense of this merger. I kind of wonder how this had gone down had the merger been announced and finished prior to his confirmation.

 

[Dan Roman]

I can't imagine anyone but maybe a few SWA pilots thinking a AK/SWA is a good idea or even remotely realistic. Probably a good analogy would be when USAir and Piedmont merged. They were both very financially strong companies and Piedmont probably had better employees/management relations than even SWA does now. Both operations seemed similar enough on the surface, but when they merged they started a very downward trend that the airline never recovered from. AK and SWA would fit together like oil and water. It could easily be the beginning of the end for them.
That's not a slam against either, they are just two totally opposite business models. Also, would the SWA folks really want to deal with a merger with an airline that would not have to give them any flying or seats? If "Gary" threatened them the way he threatened the AT folks (operate separately) why would the AK folks care?

 

[cbrown1]

That deal is still very much alive and likely to be approved after some minor divestitures at DCA.

I sure hope so, there is lots of money riding on this for lots of people.

 

[Flyer1015]

I sure hope so, there is lots of money riding on this for lots of people.

Meh, mostly the Easties who shot themselves in the foot years ago.

 

[waveflyer]

Just a pilot too Wave, but I really don't think any Management team in the airline industry is stupid enough to grow huge, merge, or do anything that takes huge capital expenditures in order to make pilots happy. Much cheaper to give massive raise, get everyone drinking the koolaid, then run for bankruptcy court with their hands above their head....sound familiar?

In this case it's planned growth they've been prepping for for a long time.
And as much as it does seem like swa's mgmt team is getting like everyone else- they do believe the culture has a positive monetary impact and are smart enough to get something big out of the big growth that is planned.

Make no mistake- the AT purchase has cost SWA money over morale.

And here's me just flying the jet... Tea leaves though

 

[msmb]

I've been a passenger on both Delta and Alaska...no comparison...Alaska blows them away. If Delta decides to divorce Alaska...Alaska will just get in bed with someone else and in the end be just fine. See you later Delta, dont let the door hit you where the good lord split you.

 

[ImbracableCrunk]

I've been a passenger on both Delta and Alaska...no comparison...Alaska blows them away. If Delta decides to divorce Alaska...Alaska will just get in bed with someone else and in the end be just fine. See you later Delta, dont let the door hit you where the good lord split you.

I've spent a lot of time in back on both. Thanks, Delta (NWA) for getting me there, but AS wins domestic.