SWAPA Comments about 717

[4day]

This statment was sent to SWAPA pilots . Now let it be known ALL Airtran CA positions are now LOST to SW and he says this.

This is good news for our pilots for many reasons. First, management has stated there will be no jobs lost in this transition. The 717s will be transferred to Delta and our Classic fleet will be retired at a slower rate to account for the departing 717s. Add to that the availability of NG aircraft on the open market and our manning model will not be affected by this change.

Southwest's agreement with Delta will bring long overdue upgrades for many of our First Officers between now and December 2014. Movement on our seniority list is something we have all been waiting for and this will provide that movement.

Well I just don't know what to say.

 

[easydoesit]

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]22 MAY 2012
A Message from your SWAPA President
[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]Fellow Pilots,

Southwest Airlines just announced they have a tentative agreement with Delta Airlines to sublease the B717 and transition them out of our fleet by the end of 2015. This announcement is one SWAPA has planned for from the original announcement of the purchase of AirTran Airways. Side Letter 10 specifically addressed this possibility and it was discussed throughout the SLI & SL10 process. Management has made no secret the B717 does not meet the Company's long-term fleet plan and if the opportunity were presented, they would be retired from our fleet sooner, rather than later.

This is good news for our pilots for many reasons. First, management has stated there will be no jobs lost in this transition. The 717s will be transferred to Delta and our Classic fleet will be retired at a slower rate to account for the departing 717s. Add to that the availability of NG aircraft on the open market and our manning model will not be affected by this change.

Southwest's agreement with Delta will bring long overdue upgrades for many of our First Officers between now and December 2014. Movement on our seniority list is something we have all been waiting for and this will provide that movement.

The Company has repeatedly said the 717 is a "fine airplane" but doesn't really fit into our system or long-term fleet plans. We have a long history of profitability operating a single fleet type and this agreement allows SWA to continue to operate with that philosophy.

Finally, we believe this will aid the transition and place us in a better position to achieve the stated synergies that exist as a result of the AirTran acquisition. From the beginning, the Company has asserted this acquisition and subsequent integration would put Southwest Airlines in the strategic position to realize growth and increased profitability. SWAPA believes this is one of many initiatives that will help in that endeavor.

While we wait for the deal to become binding, I encourage everyone to stay engaged and if new information is presented, we will forward that along. Thank you for everything you do day-in and day-out.

Fly Safe,

Steve Chase
[email protected][/FONT]

 

[easydoesit]

deleted for too much emotion...

 

[scoreboardII]

Steve Chase is no hero on this side of the fence, more like Nero of Rome era fame. funny how that sounds like Zero.

 

[redflyer65]

Agreed. Looking forward to the elections in November to make some changes.

 

[Capn Butthead]

Granted there will be quite a few captain seats lost. I can't deny that and I know it sucks. I am a 8 year fo here and I'm not even close to an upgrade. So I personally know it sucks. But not ALL CA slots are being taken away. I forget the number but I believe it's 36 717s will be transferred after 2015 to 2016. And even in 2014 to 2015 you will still have 70ish 717s. So it's not going to be a big flush of captain slots coming to us. Will it lead to faster upgrades for us? Sure. And I will gladly commute from Orlando to Oakland to do it. I said that even before the AirTran purchase. I agree with everyone. An Atlanta base needs to be opened ASAP. I think a majority of us will agree on that.

 

[Citrusflyer]

While the 717 saga stings, we all (AT guys) know it's business. Things happen, but ... seriously, extending the 'olive branch' would show the true SWA spirit (a spirit that to almost a man, no one here at Airtran has seen or believes in). ATL base, a bump in pay to mitigate the fact that we all now can barely eke out an hour or two above min guarantee month to month, etc.

Resentment is running very deep here in ATL today, and it's building very quickly. Your your chiefs evidenced that today in both RGS and the crew room. They did NOTHING to quell the anger. Then, we get the 'pile on' from this remnant of a man in your union president ... all SC is doing is lighting the fuse to the powder keg.

 

[Dan Roman]

This statment was sent to SWAPA pilots . Now let it be known ALL Airtran CA positions are now LOST to SW and he says this.

This is good news for our pilots for many reasons. First, management has stated there will be no jobs lost in this transition. The 717s will be transferred to Delta and our Classic fleet will be retired at a slower rate to account for the departing 717s. Add to that the availability of NG aircraft on the open market and our manning model will not be affected by this change.

Southwest's agreement with Delta will bring long overdue upgrades for many of our First Officers between now and December 2014. Movement on our seniority list is something we have all been waiting for and this will provide that movement.

Well I just don't know what to say.

Wow, saying that replacing AT Captains seats with SWA f/o's as something to cheer for and "everyone should be happy" is pretty weak, to say the least.
Is that part of the "warrior spirit"

 

[fuzzy077]

Pretty disgraceful if I may say so myself.

 

[Dan Roman]

That's so wrong in so many ways. It's obvious that SWAPA was planning on this when they agreed to the deal. Was the AirTran folks equally informed or were they not fully appraised when they agreed to the deal?
Have to wonder if the AirTran folks might have some legal recourse for being deceived if that's the case.

 

[St. Nic]

SWAPA... an independant union that takes care of its own- just like APA and just like USAPA.
ALPA SUX!!!

 

[Capn Butthead]

With all do respect in SL9 that was not even given a chance to be voted on every AirTran captain was seat protected. I would've had 160 people junior to me holding the left seat. SWAPA reccomended we vote it in. So SWAPA, in my own opinion and based on that fact, had no previous knowledge of the 717 going away.

 

[GIZMONC]

Were the 717 Pilots offered to DL with the 717? I thought that was in their contact that if the 717's went they went with the aircraft?

 

[BR715]

Very angry!

 

[CF34-3B1]

Were the 717 Pilots offered to DL with the 717? I thought that was in their contact that if the 717's went they went with the aircraft?

Only if Delta were buying them, but they aren't. They're sub-leasing them from SWA.

 

[Kharma Police]

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]22 MAY 2012
A Message from your SWAPA President
[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]Fellow Pilots,

Southwest Airlines just announced they have a tentative agreement with Delta Airlines to sublease the B717 and transition them out of our fleet by the end of 2015. This announcement is one SWAPA has planned for from the original announcement of the purchase of AirTran Airways. Side Letter 10 specifically addressed this possibility and it was discussed throughout the SLI & SL10 process. Management has made no secret the B717 does not meet the Company's long-term fleet plan and if the opportunity were presented, they would be retired from our fleet sooner, rather than later.

This is good news for our pilots for many reasons. First, management has stated there will be no jobs lost in this transition. The 717s will be transferred to Delta and our Classic fleet will be retired at a slower rate to account for the departing 717s. Add to that the availability of NG aircraft on the open market and our manning model will not be affected by this change.

Southwest's agreement with Delta will bring long overdue upgrades for many of our First Officers between now and December 2014. Movement on our seniority list is something we have all been waiting for and this will provide that movement.

The Company has repeatedly said the 717 is a "fine airplane" but doesn't really fit into our system or long-term fleet plans. We have a long history of profitability operating a single fleet type and this agreement allows SWA to continue to operate with that philosophy.

Finally, we believe this will aid the transition and place us in a better position to achieve the stated synergies that exist as a result of the AirTran acquisition. From the beginning, the Company has asserted this acquisition and subsequent integration would put Southwest Airlines in the strategic position to realize growth and increased profitability. SWAPA believes this is one of many initiatives that will help in that endeavor.

While we wait for the deal to become binding, I encourage everyone to stay engaged and if new information is presented, we will forward that along. Thank you for everything you do day-in and day-out.

Fly Safe,

Steve Chase
[email protected][/FONT]

I guess this means we won't be having another Round Up in Atlanta anytime soon?

You stay classy, Steve Chase!

 

[nonstop]

At least you don't have to deal with Regional Jets. :angryfire

 

[scoreboardII]

send steve an email, he'll like to hear from you.

[email protected]

 

[St. Nic]

To all the first officers at Airtran (I'm addressing the entire pilot group here)
YOU SHOULD HAVE DUMPED ALPO!!!!!!!

 

[J.Otto]

So AT captains are losing their seats and SWA FOs will upgrade into them? Am i understanding this correctly?

 

[fletch717]

One day SWAPA will ask us former AT pilots to stand with them in some sort of fight. I won't be there, ever.

 

[AFcitrus]

On a related note apparently being gifted the remaining AirTran captain seats from GK wasn't enough for SWAPA. Word has it SC is attempting to get a side letter that will prevent new SW pilots (former AT) from bidding into a base their seniority affords them while any original SW pilots are displaced through normal monthly base flexing. Effectively, junior pilots would have preferential right of return over senior pilots to any base they once held but can no longer. So much for being SW pilots once we cross the partition. I smell a DFR lawsuit for new SW pilots.

Sorry SC, but this was a part of the SLI agreement that SWAPA voted for and is the only negative that came to SW pilots through the SLI that destroyed AirTran pilots' left seat careers/aspirations. And it primarily hurt junior pilots because SWAPA threw them under the bus so captains wouldn't be harmed and senior FO's would make windfall gains through previously unachievable upgrades. Steve, if you'd like to revisit the agreed upon SLI and make after the fact changes, we'll be happy to take another look at it. But it's going to require an SLI more closely resembling a relative integration. Yea I didn't think you wanted to go there.

Every AirTran pilot needs to know that not only will we be losing significantly more captain seats than agreed upon in the SLI, but that if SC gets his way another hose job will be headed our way. When we do go over the fence our seniority will be meaningless in terms of getting the base we want. Call your reps!!

 

[scoreboardII]

So AT captains are losing their seats and SWA FOs will upgrade into them? Am i understanding this correctly?

Partially, some will. Then any remaining after 2015 will come over as CA as they transition to their 737 CA job. Then, all those who made the pre 2015 transition as FO's (hundreds) will then be next in line to CA. So while this looks bad, it depends on your exact seniority placement and where you are at the 2015 cutoff.

 

[scoreboardII]

On a related note apparently being gifted the remaining AirTran captain seats from GK wasn't enough for SWAPA. Word has it SC is attempting to get a side letter that will prevent new SW pilots (former AT) from bidding into a base their seniority affords them while any original SW pilots are displaced through normal monthly base flexing. Effectively, junior pilots would have preferential right of return over senior pilots to any base they once held but can no longer. So much for being SW pilots once we cross the partition. I smell a DFR lawsuit for new SW pilots.

Sorry SC, but this was a part of the SLI agreement that SWAPA voted for and is the only negative that came to SW pilots through the SLI that destroyed AirTran pilots' left seat careers/aspirations. And it primarily hurt junior pilots because SWAPA threw them under the bus so captains wouldn't be harmed and senior FO's would make windfall gains through previously unachievable upgrades. Steve, if you'd like to revisit the agreed upon SLI and make after the fact changes, we'll be happy to take another look at it. But it's going to require an SLI more closely resembling a relative integration. Yea I didn't think you wanted to go there.

Every AirTran pilot needs to know that not only will we be losing significantly more captain seats than agreed upon in the SLI, but that if SC gets his way another hose job will be headed our way. When we do go over the fence our seniority will be meaningless in terms of getting the base we want. Call your reps!!

This is untrue , that rumor died on the vine, SWA denied RoR. End of story.

 

[ATLplt]

send steve an email, he'll like to hear from you.

[email protected]

Sure, so he can forward the email to the CULTure Gestapo?

 

[AFcitrus]

This is completely an untrue fabrication, that rumor died on the vine, SWA denied RoR. End of story.

Scoreboard,

I'd like to believe you about this being a bad rumor. Could you give a more specific source for SWA denying this? Public denial or back room one. Did SWAPA put out a statement to such? I hope you're right brother.

 

[Dan Roman]

So AT captains are losing their seats and SWA FOs will upgrade into them? Am i understanding this correctly?

.......and, they are saying it's a good thing! amazing

 

[scoreboardII]

Scoreboard,

I'd like to believe you about this being a bad rumor. Could you give a more specific source for SWA denying this? Public denial or back room one. Did SWAPA put out a statement to such? I hope you're right brother.

It's real, it was an issue our youngens fought for during the SLI discussion which was basically dropped and our side feels rather sold down the river for it NOT having been a priority. After the SLI a bunch tried to push the union but they refused citing "SWA said not just no, but heck no".

So it was a thing, but never made out of wishland.

if you have to know, send an email to [email protected] and ask

I'd copy a statement from our forum but the Gestswapo comm commander wiped the forum.

In my opinion SWA has done an excellent job pissing off all 8000 of us.

 

[anewunion]

So why did SWA buy AT ? What assets did they get ?

 

[Dan Roman]

In my opinion SWA has done an excellent job pissing off all 8000 of us.

Probably not the FO's that get the AirTran Captain positions.