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No furloughs at ASA!

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JoeMerchant

JoeMerchant

ASA pilot
Joined
Mar 31, 2005
Posts
6,353
I have it on very good authority that there will be no furloughs at ASA. The ASA MEC was right not to jump the gun and put out misinformation about possible furloughs....The XJT MEC could learn a few things from the ASA MEC.....
 
Not even two weeks ago SH and ALPA were saying furloughs. Something must have drastically changed then in the last few days. But I'll believe it when I see it.
 
Flyguy1226 said:
Not even two weeks ago SH and ALPA were saying furloughs. Something must have drastically changed then in the last few days. But I'll believe it when I see it.
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The only "ALPA" people that were saying this were the XJT ALPA folks...The ASA ALPA people weren't saying it...
 
JoeMerchant said:
I have it on very good authority that there will be no furloughs at ASA. The ASA MEC was right not to jump the gun and put out misinformation about possible furloughs....The XJT MEC could learn a few things from the ASA MEC.....
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The XJT MEC passed an LOA that would bring ASA guys over to the XJT incase of furloughs you jacka**.
I guess you would have rather they went to the street if the furlough happened. Real classy blaming XJT on this Joe.
 
Flyguy1226 said:
Just two weeks ago during an ALPA lunch with the ASA MEC they said furloughs. But whatever... You are obviously pretty sure of yourself that it's not going to happen, and I hope it won't
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They never put out anything OFFICIAL. The XJT MEC did put out an official announcement...I can't vouch for what any individual said on their own....
 
PapaSiera said:
The XJT MEC passed an LOA that would bring ASA guys over to the XJT incase of furloughs you jacka**.
I guess you would have rather they went to the street if the furlough happened. Real classy blaming XJT on this Joe.
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PapaSiera, here is exactly what your MEC put out to it's pilots:


On the ERJ side of the house, we are seeing block hours increase again and more pilots being hired and upgraded. In addition, we are bringing back 18 of the 26 furloughed XJT pilots who went to ASA over a year ago. They will be arriving in the training center soon after the New Year. Added to that will be furloughed ASA pilots who wish to be hired on the ERJ side and placed into training as new hires with us. MOU 25 outlines a process similar to the one in MOU 18 when our furloughs went over to the CRJ side. While these furloughed CRJ pilots will be new hires on the ERJ, they will retain their furloughed status on the CRJ. Once the seniority list is integrated, they will retain their CRJ seniority spot on the pilot seniority list.

These reckless comments caused a lot of problems on this side of the company and our MEC took heat because it decided to wait for facts before jumping to conclusions...
 
JoeMerchant said:
PapaSiera, here is exactly what your MEC put out to it's pilots:


On the ERJ side of the house, we are seeing block hours increase again and more pilots being hired and upgraded. In addition, we are bringing back 18 of the 26 furloughed XJT pilots who went to ASA over a year ago. They will be arriving in the training center soon after the New Year. Added to that will be furloughed ASA pilots who wish to be hired on the ERJ side and placed into training as new hires with us. MOU 25 outlines a process similar to the one in MOU 18 when our furloughs went over to the CRJ side. While these furloughed CRJ pilots will be new hires on the ERJ, they will retain their furloughed status on the CRJ. Once the seniority list is integrated, they will retain their CRJ seniority spot on the pilot seniority list.

These reckless comments caused a lot of problems on this side of the company and our MEC took heat because it decided to wait for facts before jumping to conclusions...
Click to expand...


If you care to read it, it says "added to that will be furloughed ASA...." That means that ANY ASA pilot that MAY BE furloughed WILL BE ADDED to those allowed to come over here. It was an LOA to allow any of your guys who may want, to come over here. What's your beef against XJT???

Are you just mis-reading in order to cause a conflict when there isn't one? Would you prefer that we just allowed ASA to interview as new hires without longevity??

Every XJT pilot I know understood that we our MEC was saying that some MAY BE furloughed just as had been reported. Would you have preferred our MEC to wait until your guys were on the street before setting up a meeting to pass the LOA?
 
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princeton said:
If you care to read it, it says "added to that will be furloughed ASA...." That means that ANY ASA pilot that MAY BE furloughed. It was an LOA to allow any of your guys come over here you. What's your beef against XJT???

Every XJT pilot I know understood that we our MEC was saying that some MAY BE furloughed just as had been reported. Would you have preferred our MEC to wait until your guys were on the street before setting up a meeting to pass the LOA?
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ASA had already taken your furloughed pilots...Was there any doubt that our actions wouldn't be reciprocated IF the need ever arrose? Our pilots took this official communication from your MEC as fact and attacked our MEC for not putting anything out to our pilots. In addition, it was irresponsible to put this information out as official before it was fact. It cleary stated that there would be ASA furloughs coming to class on the ERJ.
 
JoeMerchant said:
I have it on very good authority that there will be no furloughs at ASA. The ASA MEC was right not to jump the gun and put out misinformation about possible furloughs....The XJT MEC could learn a few things from the ASA MEC.....
Click to expand...

You do realize that the XJT MEC didn't just make this furlough news up? Somewhere management gave this information to them and went so far as to negotiate and sign an agreement to change our contract in order to give your furloughs an opportunity to come over here. If anything, you guys should be upset at management for jumping the gun.

Anyways, there might still be furloughs.
 
Joe, Your comment should be that of thanks to the XJT MEC for agreeing to negotiate something to help out your furloughed pilots just as your MEC did for ours and we all said thanks. As stated above, it is quite obvious that ASA furloughs are or were about to happen as management would not have negotiated these terms.
 
Dang Joe, I thought others were just being hard on you but you truly are punk! Why are you so divisive and against XJT MEC and XJT pilots?
 
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TEXAN AVIATOR said:
Why are you so divisive and against XJT MEC and XJT pilots?
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Because we are just lowly XJT pilots and we cant possibly have any good ideas or do anything that would make this ********************ty job any better.

Same attitude that the AA pilots have about the TWA pilots and the USAir pilots have about the AMWest pilots.
 
JoeMerchant said:
I have it on very good authority that there will be no furloughs at ASA. The ASA MEC was right not to jump the gun and put out misinformation about possible furloughs....The XJT MEC could learn a few things from the ASA MEC.....
Click to expand...

Joe, this exact attitude of yours is exactly what management wants. While I have to agree with a lot of what you say, the finger pointing that you do towards our legacy express jet brothers and sisters is unprofessional , childish, and counter productive towards us moving forward to a competitive joint contract that works for the pilots and management. When were were negotiating PBS I don't ever remember seeing an express jet guy on here finger pointing at us or our MEC for negotiating something that our MEC felt could be better for the pilots and the company. Yes, they were against PBS, but not against our MEC. As far as their newsletter referencing furloughs at ASA, I am sure they didn't put that in there without being told something from management and without legal counsel. Everything that gets published to the pilots by ALPA gets a legal consult and look over. Joe, if you want to have an intimate relationship and be in bed with management that's fine, but can you do so and be respectful of your ALPA brethren?? Understand this, and I hope that it never happens, but if something ever happens to you on line in an accident or incident of some kind to an airplane under your command, you can kiss your bedroom liking and relationship with ASA management goodbye. They will turn on you quicker than you can blink an eye. I'm not saying hop in to bed with ALPA, I'm just asking for you Mr. Joe to stand united with your new coworkers at express jet and stop trying to divide everyone ...
 
While Joe should probably be a little more diplomatic, the fact remains that things are tense between the two mecs to put it nicely. As someone who spends alot of time in the alpa office, I can hear the yelling from behind closed doors. This issue is just one of many between the two mecs. I have my opinions as to why this was done, but I'll keep that to myself as I have already said to much.
 
Joe is just the typical Baby Boomer pilot. They will call every other generation the Me Generation and at the same time do whatever it takes to throw other pilots under the bus. The thought of even one pilot from Xjet being placed senior to Joe kills him.
 
aircombat said:
Joe is just the typical Baby Boomer pilot. They will call every other generation the Me Generation and at the same time do whatever it takes to throw other pilots under the bus. The thought of even one pilot from Xjet being placed senior to Joe kills him.
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He's a lifer.. Comes with the territory.
 
Fightingirish,
I can see where there are heated discussions between the MEC's and I am not in the least bit surprised....the fact of the matter is that we as line pilots need to let the MEC's hash it out in the boardroom like they have been doing and we need to be respectful and supportive of all involved publicly as line pilots. It is in our best interest. I agree with a lot of what Joe says, however I think he is so out of touch with reality and quite disrespectful at times. My best friend works at expressjet and I respectfully tell him about my personal disagreements and feelings all the time. In a public forum or dialogue though I support us and those guys collectively as it is in our best interest to do so. In the Coast Guard we have saying "Loose lips sink ships"....and it can definitely be applied here......

Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk
 
ASABound said:
Fightingirish,
I can see where there are heated discussions between the MEC's and I am not in the least bit surprised....the fact of the matter is that we as line pilots need to let the MEC's hash it out in the boardroom like they have been doing and we need to be respectful and supportive of all involved publicly as line pilots. It is in our best interest. I agree with a lot of what Joe says, however I think he is so out of touch with reality and quite disrespectful at times. My best friend works at expressjet and I respectfully tell him about my personal disagreements and feelings all the time. In a public forum or dialogue though I support us and those guys collectively as it is in our best interest to do so. In the Coast Guard we have saying "Loose lips sink ships"....and it can definitely be applied here......

Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

ASABound, thanks for the respectfull debate. I agree with some of what Joe says and I disagree with some. I'm curious when you say that you "agree with a lot of what Joe says", how you can then be so critical.

As someone who spends a lot of time in the ALPA office, I don't think you realize how ugly it has gotten between the two mecs. I believe in transparancy, and the pilots have the right to know what is going on behind closed doors. They pay the bills. There are two VERY different philosophies on how to procede and I don't believe it is harmful to have that debate. Do you?
 
FightingIrish said:
ASABound, thanks for the respectfull debate. I agree with some of what Joe says and I disagree with some. I'm curious when you say that you "agree with a lot of what Joe says", how you can then be so critical.

As someone who spends a lot of time in the ALPA office, I don't think you realize how ugly it has gotten between the two mecs. I believe in transparancy, and the pilots have the right to know what is going on behind closed doors. They pay the bills. There are two VERY different philosophies on how to procede and I don't believe it is harmful to have that debate. Do you?
Click to expand...

While I believe in transparency to a point to prevent fraud type activity - I also feel that elected reps have an obligation to get the best result for everyone. When disagreements arise I think it is best to keep quiet until there are actual results.

An analogy would be kind of like fighting with your wife about her parents. You may argue and fight about what role you want your in-laws to play in your lives or where they are staying for Christmas - but do you want her telling them everything you said during the argument phase to come to the final conclusion? I think most people would say of course not - just the final decision is all that needs to be conveyed. If she told her mother that you called her a smelly heifer it would probably just cause unnecessary drama while the end result is the same if she knows or not.

I say let them hash it out behind closed doors and we'll all get our 1 vote on their proposed changes when that time comes. I enjoy a good rumor as much as the next guy (hence I'm on FlightInfo right now) but I think on these legitimate issues both MEC's are being very classy 'if' they are fighting to not utilize mass communications and public perception to pressure the other. I would expect if they do - it will become a much more tense work environment for everyone.
 

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