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Qantas grounds entire fleet!

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RSSLatest News
Qantas responds to industrial action
Sydney, 29 October 2011
Qantas today announced that, from 8pm AEDT on Monday 31 October 2011, it will lock out all employees who will be covered by the industrial agreements currently being negotiated with the Australian Licenced Engineers Union (ALAEA), the Transport Workers Union (TWU) and the Australian and International Pilots Union (AIPA).
This step is being taken under the provisions of the Fair Work Act in response to industrial action taken by these unions. The financial impact of action taken to date has reached $68 million and the action is costing Qantas approximately $15 million per week in lost revenue. Approximately 70,000 passengers have been affected and more than 600 flights cancelled.
Pilots, licenced engineers and baggage, ground and catering staff are essential to Qantas operations and the lock-out will therefore make it necessary for all Qantas aircraft to be grounded. For precautionary reasons, this will take place immediately (as at 5pm AEDT, Saturday 29 October 2011).
Aircraft currently in the air will complete the sectors they are operating. However, there will be no further Qantas domestic departures or international departures anywhere in the world. This will have an estimated financial impact on Qantas of $20 million per day.
The lock-out will continue until the ALAEA, the TWU and AIPA drop the extreme demands that have made it impossible for agreements to be reached.
Jetstar flights, QantasLink flights and Qantas flights across the Tasman operated by Jetconnect will continue. Express Freighters Australia and Atlas Freighters will also continue to operate.
Requirements for employees are as follows:
- Until the lock-out commences, all employees are required at work as normal and will be paid.
- Once the lock-out commences:
- employees who are locked out will not be required at work and will not be paid.
- employees working overseas will not be locked out and will continue to be paid.
- all other employees are required at work and will be paid as normal.
Customers booked on Qantas flights should not go to the airport until further notice. A full refund will be available to any customer who chooses to cancel their flight because it has been directly affected by the grounding of the fleet. Full rebooking flexibility will be available to customers who wish to defer their travel.
Assistance with accommodation and alternative flights, as well as other support, will be offered to customers who are mid-journey.
Customers should monitor qantas.com for the latest updates. The latest information will also be posted on Qantas’ PPRuNe and FacePPRuNe accounts.
Only customers travelling within the next 24 hours should call Qantas contact centres (on 13 13 13).
Qantas regrets that this action has become necessary and apologises sincerely to all affected passengers.
Issued by Qantas Corporate Communication (5218)
Email: [email protected]
Click to expand...
 
The Irish shirtlifting, snaggletoothed midget running the show is one of the most despised figures in Australian Aviation. He's turned "whipsaw" into an art form.
 
LearLove said:
spoken like a guy who works for an airline that for many many years was the lowest paid with no pension, worst work rules and used as the bench standard for gutting the better paying majors post 911.
Click to expand...

I'm pretty sure he was kidding.

Go have a beer or something, geeze.
 
Virgin Australia said it would accommodate Qantas passengers where possible and was looking at adding more services in response to Qantas grounding its fleet over labor dispute. sting Qantas approximately A$15 million per week in lost revenue.

Struck work?
 
Green Banana said:
Virgin Australia said it would accommodate Qantas passengers where possible and was looking at adding more services in response to Qantas grounding its fleet over labor dispute. sting Qantas approximately A$15 million per week in lost revenue.

Struck work?
Click to expand...

Seriously?

Is VA proposing to give that revenue to Qantas? Are the Qantas employees on Strike? If am employee group is on strike and a competing company benefits from the strike actions isn't that the intent of the strike?

Strikes are intended to put financial pressure on a company. Leverage.

This is not a strike. Naturally VA, Delta, United, ets will benefit financially.

Not Struck work
 
A very risky move. If this strategy fails, they may have to liquidate, if it succeeds, it may set the standard for contract negotiations. Looks like they are looking for public support and for the unions to turn on each other.
 
Ok, agreed that competition is not struck work. It was an actuall question. Thanks.

Is this an actuall strike? Some articles say the airline decided to stop operations and others say the employees have been striking since September.
 
Green Banana said:
Ok, agreed that competition is not struck work. It was an actuall question. Thanks.

Is this an actuall strike? Some articles say the airline decided to stop operations and others say the employees have been striking since September.
Click to expand...

Unions have been involved in "industrial actions", which doesn't sound like strikes but rather slow downs, or sick outs, or something of the sort.
 
Maybe I'm slow but I don't get it. Isn't this the very definition of cutting off your nose to spite your face? Some sort of reverse strike? I would think ordinarily management types are beholden to *stockholders* who won't look kindly on intentionally running a company into the ground in order to spite the workers.
 
It's going to end up struck work. It's disputed the way it is right now. Better watch your trips and know your contracts. If your airline adds a extra flight somewhere watch out...
 
You can't throw the phrase "struck work" around when talking about this.

Firstly it's only the QF long haul pilots who are trying to negotiate a new CBA, not the domestic pilots. They are on a completely different contract. Any extra flights that Virgin is doing is only domestic and only to clear the backlog of pax that have been stranded.

Secondly, the QF long haul pilots are not on strike.

Thirdly, the QF pilots are represented by AIPA. The Virgin pilots are represented by both the AFAP and VIPA. And even then union membership is not compulsory in Australia.
 
All 108 aircraft in as many as 22 countries will be grounded until unions representing pilots, mechanics, baggage handlers and caterers reach agreements with Qantas over pay and conditions, Joyce said.
Click to expand...

Joyce is the Chief Executive.
 
ultrarunner said:
There can be no 'struck-work' when there is no labor group that isn't on strike.

END OF STORY!
Click to expand...

First off: Would you be willing to fly anything that looked like it infringed on this mess?! That's the fundamental question.

The guy has locked out the entire airline. Lockout is to Management as Strike is to Union. It's going to end up a strike.

They start interviewing and hiring intended replacements, you think that's going to be ok?

End of story? Hardly!
 
Looks like the Government may get involved with a Fair Works tribunal to try to resolve it, and it may be flying again by Monday. Sounds like Clinton and Bush forcing the hand of labor, but they also may keep labor around and not let the airline fail. Regardless, it will help Virgin Australia, and Delta too.

And, I really don't think SWA will buy them, since they can't make a profit in the most profitable quarter of the year. Sure seems like those guys are having a terrible year, with the culture problems too.


Bye Bye---General Lee
 
Last edited:
Kenny said:
You can't throw the phrase "struck work" around when talking about this.

Firstly it's only the QF long haul pilots who are trying to negotiate a new CBA, not the domestic pilots. They are on a completely different contract. Any extra flights that Virgin is doing is only domestic and only to clear the backlog of pax that have been stranded.

Secondly, the QF long haul pilots are not on strike.

Thirdly, the QF pilots are represented by AIPA. The Virgin pilots are represented by both the AFAP and VIPA. And even then union membership is not compulsory in Australia.
Click to expand...


Are you talking about Qantas vs Jetstar? Qantas has 737s that fly domestic flights, and bigger planes that go INTL. Qantas also owns Jetstar, which is a LCC (with A320/321s and A330s), and they are unaffected. Yes, Qantas does have domestic flying, with 737-400s, 737-800s, and 767/A330s.


Bye Bye---General Lee
 
Kenny said:
You can't throw the phrase "struck work" around when talking about this.

Firstly it's only the QF long haul pilots who are trying to negotiate a new CBA, not the domestic pilots. They are on a completely different contract. Any extra flights that Virgin is doing is only domestic and only to clear the backlog of pax that have been stranded.

Secondly, the QF long haul pilots are not on strike.

Thirdly, the QF pilots are represented by AIPA. The Virgin pilots are represented by both the AFAP and VIPA. And even then union membership is not compulsory in Australia.
Click to expand...

An impasse is an impasse. The exact term is just semantics.

Something like this happens, I don't think its a good idea to immediately start rationalizing that its ok without much consternation.

*edit* What's happened here, is mgt has gone on strike...
 
Last edited:
Flopgut said:
An impasse is an impasse. The exact term is just semantics.

Something like this happens, I don't think its a good idea to immediately start rationalizing that its ok without much consternation.

*edit* What's happened here, is mgt has gone on strike...
Click to expand...

Very correct. But, they will probably still get their "retention bonuses." It's called Wealthfare.


Bye Bye---General Lee
 
General Lee said:
Are you talking about Qantas vs Jetstar? Qantas has 737s that fly domestic flights, and bigger planes that go INTL. Qantas also owns Jetstar, which is a LCC (with A320/321s and A330s), and they are unaffected. Yes, Qantas does have domestic flying, with 737-400s, 737-800s, and 767/A330s.


Bye Bye---General Lee
Click to expand...
.


GL,

With the greatest of respect, I don't think you're aware of how the QF group and their pilots fit together.

QF didn't do any domestic flying until after the pilots' strike of '89, they only flew internationally. When QF bought Australian Airlines, they acquired a domestic network. Hence, they essentially have 2 pilot groups, international and domestic pilots and they are treated as separate groups on very different CBA's. It is the QF international pilots that are trying to negotiate a new CBA and whose work action to this point has simply consisted of wearing red ties and making PA's about keeping QF Australian. The domestics pilots are not taking part in any work action, even though they are also represented by AIPA and are Qantas pilots.

What this is about is "Job security". At its very simplest, imagine that when UAL formed TED, they used UAL planes but different pilots. Not UAL pilots but pilots on a different seniority list, paid less than the UAL guys to fly the same aircraft and whose work rules were far lower. Then imagine that TED grew and started taking over UAL domestic and international routes. This is what has been happening with QF and Jetstar. Jetstar has effectively been eating QF, from the inside out, for the past few years.

Let's just hope there isn't another company overseas that's willing to to bring their aircraft and pilots en-masse and fly the Qantas routes, like America West did in '89.
 
Kenny said:
.


GL,

With the greatest of respect, I don't think you're aware of how the QF group and their pilots fit together.

QF didn't do any domestic flying until after the pilots' strike of '89, they only flew internationally. When QF bought Australian Airlines, they acquired a domestic network. Hence, they essentially have 2 pilot groups, international and domestic pilots and they are treated as separate groups on very different CBA's. It is the QF international pilots that are trying to negotiate a new CBA and whose work action to this point has simply consisted of wearing red ties and making PA's about keeping QF Australian. The domestics pilots are not taking part in any work action, even though they are also represented by AIPA and are Qantas pilots.

What this is about is "Job security". At its very simplest, imagine that when UAL formed TED, they used UAL planes but different pilots. Not UAL pilots but pilots on a different seniority list, paid less than the UAL guys to fly the same aircraft and whose work rules were far lower. Then imagine that TED grew and started taking over UAL domestic and international routes. This is what has been happening with QF and Jetstar. Jetstar has effectively been eating QF, from the inside out, for the past few years.

Let's just hope there isn't another company overseas that's willing to to bring their aircraft and pilots en-masse and fly the Qantas routes, like America West did in '89.
Click to expand...



A good summation.

One of the cornerstones of the Qantas CEOs plan is to move the labor out of Australia. He can then subvert labor laws by employing pilots to operate Qantas aircraft from a country with different, little, or no labor law and without a contract or a union. Or, employ them under a separate contract in another country. All under the Qantas company umbrella.

You used the example of 'Ted' and United to illustrate situation. In this case it would be 'Ted' based in Mexico and employing a mix of Americans and foreign nationals all under a different contract. Whilst being owned by United.

'The Irish midget' needs to be deported.
 
ackattacker said:
I would think ordinarily management types are beholden to *stockholders* who won't look kindly on intentionally running a company into the ground in order to spite the workers.
Click to expand...

happens with just about every airline contract every time, standard operating procedure by management, stockholders buy into management's reasoning, you know, bust those unions!
 
ackattacker said:
Maybe I'm slow but I don't get it. Isn't this the very definition of cutting off your nose to spite your face? Some sort of reverse strike? I would think ordinarily management types are beholden to *stockholders* who won't look kindly on intentionally running a company into the ground in order to spite the workers.
Click to expand...

He is locking them out and most likely betting that the government will intervene order the company to open and the TWU to stop job actions. Thus killing the job action by the TWU and keeping the current contracts in place.
 
wmuflyguy said:
He is locking them out and most likely betting that the government will intervene order the company to open and the TWU to stop job actions. Thus killing the job action by the TWU and keeping the current contracts in place.
Click to expand...


This is what most likely will happen.
 

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