DCI Fall Cutbacks..............

[JumpersAway]

Hmmm, from what I'm willing to bet- 100 More furloughs in the fall, with around 60 displacements.....at ASA.

Any bets from the others such as Mesaba, Pinnacle, Comair, etc????

 

[boctal]

They can't furlough 100 more...for what it's worth, I don't think there will be any additional furloughs at ASA, even with the cutbacks.

 

[Windsor]

Same threat at Pinchanickle. Cept then the pilot group would be properly staffed instead of this micky mouse retarded understaffing that we are used to. Drop in hours + same pilot numbers = properly staffed

 

[Stifler's Mom]

How many pilots are left that are not protected by the no-furlough clause?

Scott Hall's letter shows the writing on the wall. Sounds like we need some to take long term voluntary leaves, and after that, what else is there left to do....

 

[crj567]

What is left to do is to furlough some of these SKYW people! There is no reason ASA should take all the bad news, and they get none.... SKYW is still doing a lot of flying in ATL!

 

[ASA_Aviator]

They can't furlough 100 more...for what it's worth, I don't think there will be any additional furloughs at ASA, even with the cutbacks.

What is it, 50 or so that are not protected? I hope you're right.

 

[relief tube]

hate to say it but better here than at mother Delta.

 

[Cpt Oveur]

The union and company can waive that clause if they agree to something else. Long term, the pilot group will have some tough choices ahead...

 

[CFI2766]

The union and company can waive that clause if they agree to something else. Long term, the pilot group will have some tough choices ahead...

Concur. I see some difficult, painful choices in the future.

It is ugly now, and about to get uglier, but it will turn around. When it does turn around, my guess is 12-16 months from now, it will be the start of a wave of pilot hiring that could do even more damage to our profession. MPL anyone?

 

[JumpersAway]

They can't furlough 100 more...for what it's worth, I don't think there will be any additional furloughs at ASA, even with the cutbacks.

Without having my contract handy at this time, doesn't the section listed under Scotts letter pertain to the no furlough clause. I'm normally an upbeat person, but this isn't sounding good at all............I'm thinking this falls cuts are going to hurt..............bad...

As for the pilot hiring boom in 3-4 years..........I don't think people realize just how bad it's going to be. Lots of people either being forced out, or punching out of the flying biz. There are no pilots entering the pipeline now........Only two ways you're coming up with funds to fly- cash money (the stock market issue and economy have drained most cash anyone would have to pay for this) and student loans (Most of which can't be used for flight training now). With the retirements coming up, you could just about completely empty every seniority list at every regional and still not fill in the blank.

All the while, many mainline pilots complain that a staple would put "unqualified" and "undesirable" candidates on mainline seniority lists. The ironic thing is, that those very candidates will likely end up there anyway, but the damage we inflict on our own working wages will persist. Management will simply lower the qualifications for hiring to fill the seats on the flight deck. At a not too distant point in time, it's not going to matter if you're blind, a cripple, or incapable of flying a kite- if you want to fly for a legacy or any other airline, you're simply just going to have to ask or show up..............

 

[sweptback]

First of all, he was talking about MOU 43 and 44, which have already expired. It would be simple to renew them, assuming both the company and ALPA want to.

How do we know that SkyWest, Inc. hasn't manipulated the flying given over by Delta to give more flying to SkyWest and less to ASA? We still see a lot of SkyWest airplanes in ATL and CVG, even after ASA got 900s. So then why don't we see ASA airplanes in SLC? Isn't it possible that SkyWest, Inc. is trying to keep the flying on the SkyWest side so they don't have to furlough over there?

If it comes down to it, SkyWest, Inc. can get out of the ASA no furlough clause by filing bankruptcy. But then their DCI contract can be canceled immediately, so that wouldn't be too smart. If it comes to that, they will need to assign more flying to ASA, and furlough off the side of the company without any protections.

 

[BrickTop]

What is left to do is to furlough some of these SKYW people! There is no reason ASA should take all the bad news, and they get none.... SKYW is still doing a lot of flying in ATL!

Not possible. Skywest hase clauses in their contract to allow only so many capacity cuts and they have reached that limit. The cuts will have to come from other carriers.

 

[Browntothebone]

Concur. I see some difficult, painful choices in the future.

It is ugly now, and about to get uglier, but it will turn around. When it does turn around, my guess is 12-16 months from now, it will be the start of a wave of pilot hiring that could do even more damage to our profession. MPL anyone?

Actually, MPL is a solution to the problem facing the regionals of incompetent F/Os. An MPL F/O will have spent almost his entire training in jet simulators and be ready to transition to a real jet on the line instead of the existing F/Os who have to transition from a seminole to an RJ. The MPL F/O will be going from a 737 or A320 simulator to an RJ, so his transition will be simple.

 

[Browntothebone]

Without having my contract handy at this time, doesn't the section listed under Scotts letter pertain to the no furlough clause. I'm normally an upbeat person, but this isn't sounding good at all............I'm thinking this falls cuts are going to hurt..............bad...

As for the pilot hiring boom in 3-4 years..........I don't think people realize just how bad it's going to be. Lots of people either being forced out, or punching out of the flying biz. There are no pilots entering the pipeline now........Only two ways you're coming up with funds to fly- cash money (the stock market issue and economy have drained most cash anyone would have to pay for this) and student loans (Most of which can't be used for flight training now). With the retirements coming up, you could just about completely empty every seniority list at every regional and still not fill in the blank.

All the while, many mainline pilots complain that a staple would put "unqualified" and "undesirable" candidates on mainline seniority lists. The ironic thing is, that those very candidates will likely end up there anyway, but the damage we inflict on our own working wages will persist. Management will simply lower the qualifications for hiring to fill the seats on the flight deck. At a not too distant point in time, it's not going to matter if you're blind, a cripple, or incapable of flying a kite- if you want to fly for a legacy or any other airline, you're simply just going to have to ask or show up..............

They are right. The majors should just avoid the risk of hiring an "unknown quantity" that hiring a current generation regional pilot would entaile. The majors should only hire military or a new generation of MPL candidates who the majors would know there entire training history from day one.

 

[SLUF4]

Actually, MPL is a solution to the problem facing the regionals of incompetent F/Os. An MPL F/O will have spent almost his entire training in jet simulators and be ready to transition to a real jet on the line instead of the existing F/Os who have to transition from a seminole to an RJ. The MPL F/O will be going from a 737 or A320 simulator to an RJ, so his transition will be simple.

I'm not very well studied on MPL, but from what you're saying, it will be mostly simulator based. Do you really think that "flying" a sim around is the same as dealing with real weather, ATC, emergencies, etc...?

 

[amcnd]

First of all, he was talking about MOU 43 and 44, which have already expired. It would be simple to renew them, assuming both the company and ALPA want to.

How do we know that SkyWest, Inc. hasn't manipulated the flying given over by Delta to give more flying to SkyWest and less to ASA? We still see a lot of SkyWest airplanes in ATL and CVG, even after ASA got 900s. So then why don't we see ASA airplanes in SLC? Isn't it possible that SkyWest, Inc. is trying to keep the flying on the SkyWest side so they don't have to furlough over there?

If it comes down to it, SkyWest, Inc. can get out of the ASA no furlough clause by filing bankruptcy. But then their DCI contract can be canceled immediately, so that wouldn't be too smart. If it comes to that, they will need to assign more flying to ASA, and furlough off the side of the company without any protections.

File bankruptcy?? They would have to burn through there 700 mill in cash first!!

 

[Browntothebone]

I'm not very well studied on MPL, but from what you're saying, it will be mostly simulator based. Do you really think that "flying" a sim around is the same as dealing with real weather, ATC, emergencies, etc...?

How is this different from the current generation of regional f/o from the "academies" who have never dealt with real weather , high density ATC or real emergencies, plus the biggest thing they have flown is a seminole. I'd rather have one that at least knows about jet systems and jet handling and can fly at jet speeds.

 

[sweptback]

File bankruptcy?? They would have to burn through there 700 mill in cash first!!

Well, technically, they could file for one of the two subsidiaries and claim that it is a drain on their operations.

Realistically, you're right, dumb idea.

 

[DrewBlows]

Actually, MPL is a solution to the problem facing the regionals of incompetent F/Os. An MPL F/O will have spent almost his entire training in jet simulators and be ready to transition to a real jet on the line instead of the existing F/Os who have to transition from a seminole to an RJ. The MPL F/O will be going from a 737 or A320 simulator to an RJ, so his transition will be simple.

You still post here? Does posting endless flame ever get boring?

 

[Browntothebone]

You still post here? Does posting endless flame ever get boring?

MPL is not flame. MPL is coming, it's indorsed by FAA, ATA, RAA, Boeing, Airbus, Alteon and Flight Safety. It's the way of the future.

 

[Monster Buck]

They are right. The majors should just avoid the risk of hiring an "unknown quantity" that hiring a current generation regional pilot would entaile. The majors should only hire military or a new generation of MPL candidates who the majors would know there entire training history from day one.

Hey Mr. flame bait ******************************bag, STFU!

 

[SiuDude]

Actually, MPL is a solution to the problem facing the regionals of incompetent F/Os. An MPL F/O will have spent almost his entire training in jet simulators and be ready to transition to a real jet on the line instead of the existing F/Os who have to transition from a seminole to an RJ. The MPL F/O will be going from a 737 or A320 simulator to an RJ, so his transition will be simple.

Hey, that's one of your better flames. Congratulations!

By the way, your "girlfriend' called. He just wishes you'd get off the computer and come back to his side of the cell.

 

[boctal]

The union and company can waive that clause if they agree to something else. Long term, the pilot group will have some tough choices ahead...

You are correct, but if our union agrees to waive this clause, we don't have much of a union (in my opinion). The morale at ASA would be back at pre-contract levels or worse, especially when Skywest, INC is still making money.

Without having my contract handy at this time, doesn't the section listed under Scotts letter pertain to the no furlough clause. I'm normally an upbeat person, but this isn't sounding good at all............I'm thinking this falls cuts are going to hurt..............bad...

Those MOU's pertain to extended COMA's and half month COMA's. The no furlough clause is part of the main body of the contract (Section 1) and was never an MOU.

 

[Papa Woody]

I'd rather have one that at least knows about jet systems and jet handling and can fly at jet speeds.

I got a great idea:

From now on, the Majors should only hire Blacks.

Then there will never again be furloughs, pilot error, passenger complaints, junior manning, disciplinary hearings, or Letters-of-Investigation......

......'cause that would all be RACIST.

 

[silver02ex]

Pinnacle started to offer Reduce line values to get ready for the fall cut back. I'm sure this made the junior guys happy that they may get to keep their job and my guess is the reduce line value will go senior. I noticed YOW was canceled last night. I had a VM asking if i can help with a JM yesterday morning about 2 HS that needed crews.

 

[JumpersAway]

BrownInThePants...........no one wishes to hear your drivel here. Go back to fishing in another thread and leave this one alone.

As I see it, SkyWest will eventually furlough regardless of what ASA does. There is no way they are going to be able to lose the amount of flying they did in Milwaukee and still remain staffed as is. There isn't going to be enough flying to divvy up at the end of this, I'm affaid.

How long before ASA has to meet the cost lock in for our DCI contract?

 

[Skywest Pylot]

As I see it, SkyWest will eventually furlough regardless of what ASA does. There is no way they are going to be able to lose the amount of flying they did in Milwaukee and still remain staffed as is. There isn't going to be enough flying to divvy up at the end of this, I'm affaid.

Maybe if every SkyWest pilot takes an oath of Union Celibacy, the quick upgrade fairy will stop by and make all their wildest dreams come true. It worked last time. BTW. whatever happened to that sweet EMB190/CRJ900 deal with Southwest? Just vote NO, right?

 

[Skywest Pylot]

Quote:
Originally Posted by crj567
What is left to do is to furlough some of these SKYW people! There is no reason ASA should take all the bad news, and they get none.... SKYW is still doing a lot of flying in ATL!

Not possible. Skywest hase clauses in their contract to allow only so many capacity cuts and they have reached that limit. The cuts will have to come from other carriers.

You better take another look at the fine print in that contract. There is a BIG difference between SkyWest Airlines and Skywest Inc. IMO, the big growth days at Skywest Airlines ended when Ron Rebber departed. Jerry and Chip are not go getters and prefer to sit on their 100s of millions without taking risks. The real mover and shaker in the regionals is Republic. If you are sitting in the right seat at SKYW, you better get comfortable. If you are at the bottom of the list, I would have a contingency plan in place.

 

[pipi]

I got a great idea:
 
From now on, the Majors should only hire Blacks.
 
Then there will never again be furloughs, pilot error, passenger complaints, junior manning, disciplinary hearings, or Letters-of-Investigation......
 
......'cause that would all be RACIST.

Are you F...ING STUPID?

And they gave you a pilot's certificate?

Unbelievable.

 

[goahead]

Are you all retarded, a no furlough clause means nothing in the airline industry, NOTHING.

A lawyer and a bunch of selfish senior azzhole's can get around it any day of the week.

I'll take it in the shorts to keep guys on our list at ASA, but I'll bet too many other's won't, not enough real men left in this industry.