A good First Officer would...

[Aviation Geek]

I am sure that I will get absolutely blasted for this, but as a former FA, what did we do that was so hard to deal with? This is not the first time I have heard this, but it may be the first time I have heard it addressed so professionally.

I kind of approached my job from a "know your stuff (follow the rules, ie: don't call the cockpit below 10,000 feet, do your preflight correctly, treat the pax well, handle stuff before it gets to the cockpit); state your needs; stay out of the way; get drinks and snacks when asked, don't interupt; if there are two fat chicks, take the one the FO does not take."

What things do you do (CAs and FOs) to deal with this issue?

 

[JustaNumber]

I am sure that I will get absolutely blasted for this, but as a former FA, what did we do that was so hard to deal with? This is not the first time I have heard this, but it may be the first time I have heard it addressed so professionally.

I kind of approached my job from a "know your stuff (follow the rules, ie: don't call the cockpit below 10,000 feet, do your preflight correctly, treat the pax well, handle stuff before it gets to the cockpit); state your needs; stay out of the way; get drinks and snacks when asked, don't interupt; if there are two fat chicks, take the one the FO does not take."

What things do you do (CAs and FOs) to deal with this issue?

If everyone had your good attitude, you wouldn't hear about the problems, but not everyone is as professional as you were. I think some FAs are compensating for other deficiencies in their lives. They immediately sense a brand new captain, and try to tell him/her how things will be done, I guess to make themselves feel important. I remember that source of friction was the only issue I had on my very first day as captain!

 

[DashTrash400]

AG, why do you think you'd get blasted for saying that? FAs that act the way you describe are a joy to fly with. They are also, at my regional airline at least, a minority. You don't get the cream of the crop to fly for $14/hr. Quite a few attitudes, lots of ignorance of procedures, plenty of drama. Dealing with one like that is hard enough, but on trips when they're *both* that way....

Starting the trip with a detailed, thorough crew briefing does go a long ways.

 

[shortbus driver]

I have to agree with almost everything said, but with my own stupidity possibly for me to make a few amendments. I ask that the FO wait for all the checklists except for the before takeoff and after landing...they all have their own pace and I don't want to rush them and after landing, I am much more concerned with where I am going and tend to forget to call for it and many FOs are scared to say anything. Also, I do forget, in fact I forget a lot of things. I have no problem if someone brings up my errors. I will feel dumb and hopefully stop forgetting.
Oh, and the actual flying is not hard, but please please please if you want to hand fly when we are 1000 feet to level off don't keep climbing at 3000+ fpm I know how that will end...I see it all the time!

 

[SEVEN]

A good FO will learn what a rudder is and its effects on aerodynamics and to use it during crosswind landings..........

 

[Max Q]

...and/or while the CA is taking a wee.

-Brett

 

[Caveman]

read the weather reports, notams and any mel's on the paperwork.

Excellent advice. When I was a regional CA I hardly ever saw the FO really read the release. You don't have to go line by line but there are some basic things that need to be verified every leg. WX, MELs, NOTAMS, fuel loads, tail number, flight number, a/c logbook, etc. If it's their leg most guys will get the bare essentials to load the box, work the W&B and plan the departure but they almost never verify WX at destination, check the fuel to make sure it makes sense, read the NOTAMS or verify the a/c, flight number and crew. If it's not their leg most FOs I flew with hardly glanced at the at the release. I really appreciated those that did.

First of all if you aren't doing these things you are setting yourself and your CA up for failure. Dispatch and CA make mistakes. One more set of eyeballs looking stuff over keeps everybody out of trouble. Second, it will dramatically increase your overall SA. Third, when you do upgrade it will be one less thing you have to practice doing. You will already be able to scan the release and get the big picture. You can then concentrate more on the leadership aspect of being the big kahuna.

Excellent question BTW. The fact you even asked it puts you way ahead of the game. Good luck.

 

[acaTerry]

Don't make the your fellow pilot embarrassed to be paired with you:
1) wear the uniform, all of it, and correctly.
2) watch your language around kids.
3) quit walking with your hands in your pockets and your head down!!!!!!!!
4) don't call the CA "captain", that's gay.
5) realize that the FA probably may not want to sleep with you.
6) put the spoilers away after you make speed!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
7) quit saying "with you"...that's gayer than item 4.
8) find a better cuss word than "Jesus"...please.
9) this is the big one....seems to get worse with each generation of pilots...watch "Airplane" and know some of the better lines.

 

[Goose Egg]

Excellent advice. When I was a regional CA I hardly ever saw the FO really read the release. You don't have to go line by line but there are some basic things that need to be verified every leg. WX, MELs, NOTAMS, fuel loads, tail number, flight number, a/c logbook, etc. If it's their leg most guys will get the bare essentials to load the box, work the W&B and plan the departure but they almost never verify WX at destination, check the fuel to make sure it makes sense, read the NOTAMS or verify the a/c, flight number and crew. If it's not their leg most FOs I flew with hardly glanced at the at the release. I really appreciated those that did.

First of all if you aren't doing these things you are setting yourself and your CA up for failure. Dispatch and CA make mistakes. One more set of eyeballs looking stuff over keeps everybody out of trouble. Second, it will dramatically increase your overall SA. Third, when you do upgrade it will be one less thing you have to practice doing. You will already be able to scan the release and get the big picture. You can then concentrate more on the leadership aspect of being the big kahuna.

Excellent question BTW. The fact you even asked it puts you way ahead of the game. Good luck.

Awesome advice, Caveman. I didn't have the foresight to start a thread like this, but I'll take all the knowledge I can get. I'll try to do better what you suggested.

(Wow, actual good advice from flightinfo. Who'da thunk it?)

-Goose

 

[ehaecker]

A good FO should bring some experience to the cockpit with him/her. Offer suggestions to the CA without overstepping your bounds (don't try to be a right seat captain!) If the captain does something, or makes a decision you don't like, bring it to his/her attention, again, without overstepping your bounds. You are there to back up the CA, and vice versa. A good FO (and CA) is ALWAYS learning from the guy or gal in the other seat.

 

[hockeypilot44]

Lol. Regional guys are funny. I'm a former regional captain so I can relate, but now I'm looking at about a 15 year upgrade give or take a few years. It's funny how your perspective changes depending on where you are. I heard a regional first officer say he was senior today. I asked him how long he worked there. He said, "just over two years, I should be upgrading soon."

 

[SEVEN]

Don't make the your fellow pilot embarrassed to be paired with you:
1) wear the uniform, all of it, and correctly.
2) watch your language around kids.
3) quit walking with your hands in your pockets and your head down!!!!!!!!
4) don't call the CA "captain", that's gay.
5) realize that the FA probably may not want to sleep with you.
6) put the spoilers away after you make speed!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
7) quit saying "with you"...that's gayer than item 4.
8) find a better cuss word than "Jesus"...please.
9) this is the big one....seems to get worse with each generation of pilots...watch "Airplane" and know some of the better lines.

Couldn't have said it better myself.

 

[Stifler's Mom]

6) put the spoilers away after you make speed!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I'd also like to add, "stow them slowly and easily". There's no need to take a fist full of spoilers and stow all of them in .5 seconds or less, sending the airplane pitching all over the sky as it tries to recover from your sloppy airmanship. Try to give the passengers the impression that you actually are trying to give them a nice ride.

 

[JettBoii]

Know your FOM and POH.

Think before you speak.

Be polite and respectful.

Do not cuss unless he/she does.

Offer to help everybody.

Be professional.

 

[JettBoii]

And..........................dont slam on the brakes on the landing roll.

 

[SplitBar]

A good First Officer doesn't make the Captain have to be the Captain.

 

[acaTerry]

A good First Officer doesn't make the Captain have to be the Captain.

VERY WELL PUT! Now that about sums it all up. When you leave feeling like you flew with a peer rather than a superior, you did a good job.

 

[Kaman]

*Good leadership requires good followership first
*Be an asset to the crew, company and customers, if not go on home.
*Work hard to learn your procedures cold, so that the Captain will recognize you are motivated, professional and competent.
*Fly with precision.
*Remember your job is to make the Captain's job easy, and to make him/her look good. If you did both of those you will have a much better trip!
*Be open to constructive criticisim. This is a one-way exchange. Unsolicited critiquing a Captain that is otherwise following SOPs is the height of disrespect and downright rude.

Regards,
ex-121 Capt/CK airman, now 121 F/O again.

 

[aerobat21]

pretend that you didnt see the the captian ******************** up, and when he slams it in and makes a dumb excuse give a fake laugh

 

[Booker]

Say, "Wow, you're so right!" when the Captain complains about pilots who say "with you" on the radio.

 

[crj567]

Cuss Obama!

 

[The Drizzle]

I'd also like to add, "stow them slowly and easily". There's no need to take a fist full of spoilers and stow all of them in .5 seconds or less, sending the airplane pitching all over the sky as it tries to recover from your sloppy airmanship. Try to give the passengers the impression that you actually are trying to give them a nice ride.

I wish we had that option on the 145. ********************in' thing goes from 0 to 11.

 

[acarpe3448]

A good FO should bring some experience to the cockpit with him/her. Offer suggestions to the CA without overstepping your bounds (don't try to be a right seat captain!) If the captain does something, or makes a decision you don't like, bring it to his/her attention, again, without overstepping your bounds. You are there to back up the CA, and vice versa. A good FO (and CA) is ALWAYS learning from the guy or gal in the other seat.

Bring experience to the cockpit? Comair F/Os bring what 250 hours to the cockpit! F/Os besure to overstep your bounds when the Comair Captains taxi your airplane onto that 1000 foot runway!

 

[CFI2766]

Bring experience to the cockpit? Comair F/Os bring what 250 hours to the cockpit! F/Os besure to overstep your bounds when the Comair Captains taxi your airplane onto that 1000 foot runway!

Your shtik is getting pretty old.

Please leave.

 

[acarpe3448]

Your shtik is getting pretty old.

Please leave.

Better yet why don't you not read it!

A good f/o realizes the RJDC = pilots trying to steal other pilots jobs!

 

[smartelephant]

know your airplane inside and out. more than what's needed to pass a checkride. learn as much as you can about the systems and how they interact with each other. because once you start talking to mx, you'll more than likely run across a new guy and you'll end up needing to explain to him how things work so that you can get the plane fixed or mel'd.

 

[Amish RakeFight]

Here's a great DVD that helped me understand the Captain's role and where I fit in.

How An Airline Captain Should Look and Act





.

 

[Gobi Gred]

A good first officer doesn't talk on their cell phone while doing a preflight.

 

[AC560]

A good first officer doesn't talk on their cell phone while doing a preflight.

Is texting acceptable?

 

[LoneWolf]

..........................dont slam on the brakes on the landing roll.

One of my pet peeves is having to add power to get to the high speed taxiway. You don't always have to melt the brakes and or use the reversers. Also, let me know you are ready to transfer controls before you do it. When you release the brakes suddenly, everyone in back gets the joy of having their head slammed into the back of the seat when the aircraft lurches forward. A few more to add to this thread:

When someone (gate agent, ramp person, maintenance, etc.) comes to the cockpit with a question (board early, fuel load, etc.), they are asking the captain. I have actually had an f/o interrupt his phone call to voice his opinion before I could respond. Not cool.

If you are the flying pilot, fly the airplane please. It's great that you can hand fly with your fingertips and tune my radios for me at the same time. But this is a two pilot aircraft for a reason. Pick a role.

There is no need to work two radios at the same time. Instead of halting your call to ops with the times to answer ATC, why not tell me you are off and let me get ATC. I can stop picking my nose to help you out. This is a real good way to have a misunderstood altitude, heading etc. You can, and should still monitor the other while you are off.

Relax and slow down. It's safer, we get paid more, and my blood pressure stays under the FAA limit. Now I am a major type B personality (maybe even C if there is such a thing) and I'm pretty laid back. When I fly with a type A leg shaker that talks so fast on the radio that ATC doesn't know what hit them, I know I'm in for a long trip filled with hurried checklists, constant button pushing and switch throwing, and races to see who can get it done first. Please don't think I am slamming type A personalities, seems like most pilots are and that drive is how they got the job and it works fine most of the time.

This type of question or statement "so why aren't you in church today?" or "so I guess you are a republican/democrat"/or other label we put on each other is the quickest way to get me to clam up and watch the farm land pass by.

Sorry for the rant, I really am easy to fly with. This stuff just builds up inside after the years pass by and needs to come out every once in a while.