Alaska Furloughs 32 on January 5th

[Z_Pilot]

Got the call from the base CP half an hour ago.

The only details I know:

-32 to be furloughed
-Effective January 5th
-Health for three months
-Possible retention of travel benefits


Best of luck to us

ZP

 

[AKMD80GUY]

Unfortunate for the 32 to get fuc........I mean furloughed. However, I believe this is straight from Ford and Harrison and does not have anything to do with staffing. Ask any one who has been on reserve how adequately staffed the airline is.

True since the MD retirement that we are going to be a little fat for a time. But the last of the MD pilots wont be trained until spring sometime and the it will be time to ramp up for the summer schedule.

It will cost the company more to furlough and then retrain the FO's and certain Capt. downgrades than to just eat the overstaffing, if you could call it that. The company has stated that they want a contract signed by years end. What beter way than to scare the pilots with confirmed furlough numbers. I'm also betting that they want something signed before the new administration takes place.

Stay strong everyone.

 

[QCappy]

Ask any one who has been on reserve how adequately staffed the airline is.

I flew 4 days last month. I think we're adequately staffed.

 

[Fubijaakr]

What happened to the 137 early out apps?

 

[Chief Pilot]

I flew quite a bit last month on reserve in SEA. I didn't get guarantee, but middle of the pack for SEA FO's was around 40 hours and I was higher than middle. I agree that this has more to do with Ford and Harrison and that management would rather finalize a contract under our current administration.

Still stinks for those of us in the line of fire.

 

[ImbracableCrunk]

The rumor I heard is that management wanted Kemp to call people on the "Thanksgiving Eve" and he said, "No, it can wait til Monday."

That sounds like '92 to me.

 

[GuppyWN]

Bottom DOH please?

Gup

 

[lumax]

about 8-20-07

 

[bluefin]

Ual 380 Jan 14 & 21, Ufb

 

[sf340flyer]

more like 10/15/07

 

[CesnaCaptn]

Very few FO reserves in LA flew more than 35 hours. Many were in the teens or 20s. On 11/30 I counted 19 reserves available. I definitely feel adequately staffed right now. If the company want to furlough they can. Whether or not it's cost effective or necessary is another argument. I used to work for a company they prided itself on having never furloughed a pilot. Now I work for Bill.

 

[Chief Pilot]

Ual 380 Jan 14 & 21, Ufb

bluefin,

I'm not sure I understand your sentiment here. Are you implying that because there is a larger number of furloughs at ual, somehow the impact of a furlough on Alaska pilots and their families is less significant? Or is your point that this is a crappy time in the airline industry and it is "Ufb" that we, as a whole, have to endure more of this? A little clarification would be nice.

Someone losing his or her job and means to support a family in this economy should not be marginalized.

 

[Old School 737]

I flew with our ALPA scheduling guy a while back and he was saying the stance is that they would have to reduce the block hours to 65 before they can lay off. 65 is the number that crew planning can build a open flying line to. It is a weird deal in the contract because it does not say what a the min block of line value is just that a min pay is 75. And since 65 has been a proven and used number for what they build lines to then that becomes a standard and what we can say they must reduce the lines to before layoffs. we will see.

 

[CesnaCaptn]

I flew with our ALPA scheduling guy a while back and he was saying the stance is that they would have to reduce the block hours to 65 before they can lay off. 65 is the number that crew planning can build a open flying line to. It is a weird deal in the contract because it does not say what a the min block of line value is just that a min pay is 75. And since 65 has been a proven and used number for what they build lines to then that becomes a standard and what we can say they must reduce the lines to before layoffs. we will see.

There was at least 1 open flying line in LA that was Less than 70. Was the alpa stance that all flying lines need to drop to 65 or just open flying?

 

[msmb]

To have over 100 Pilots who WANT to either take the company offered early retirement plan or take an extended leave and then not follow through with these programs....criminal just criminal. Bill and his upper management friends should be gone. What a bunch of Scum.

 

[bluefin]

bluefin,

I'm not sure I understand your sentiment here. Are you implying that because there is a larger number of furloughs at ual, somehow the impact of a furlough on Alaska pilots and their families is less significant? Or is your point that this is a crappy time in the airline industry and it is "Ufb" that we, as a whole, have to endure more of this? A little clarification would be nice.

Someone losing his or her job and means to support a family in this economy should not be marginalized.

No, I am making a point that it's not only Alaska that is Furloughing. The sentiment of losing a job with a family, for many this will be the second furlough for them. Welcome to the airline industry. I am not wishing ill will on any person.

 

[Going2Baja]

Last month in ETOPS training they said 15 lines were being moved from ANC to LAX - but this was NOT so they could furlough. They went on to say that an ADDITIONAL 5 new jets would be here by the end of the 1st qtr of 09'. Growth? I can't tell anymore. I do know that I flew 2 days for 13:42 hrs last month (no vacation) and had MANY trade requests denied for lack of coverage. Short - Heavy - depends on who you ask. It all sucks!!

Baja.

 

[ImbracableCrunk]

No, I am making a point that it's not only Alaska that is Furloughing. The sentiment of losing a job with a family, for many this will be the second furlough for them. Welcome to the airline industry. I am not wishing ill will on any person.

So, you are making light of Alaska's situation. Thanks.

We at Alaska thought we were the only airline. Maybe there are others out there. Perhaps we at Alaska should refrain from discussing our own issues on a thread that specifically is an Alaska thread?

Sheesh.

 

[AKMD80GUY]

If management does indeed furlough, it WILL be for hostage taking purposes only. We are overstaffed right now because of the MD pilots being added into the 737. How many reserves, especially captains worked over 80 hours last spring and summer. I personally flew with many over 80. I flew with SEA guys flying partial and or full LAX trips.

Does anyone think that with VA, JetBlue, SWA etc...all flying the west coast that we are going to shrink and furlough all these pilots. I personally don't. Does anyone remember the Xmas eve furlough notices? This tactic has been used time and time again. Scare the pilots with furloughs, the sky is falling etc...I just don't buy it.

Does anyone remember the first of Saretskys bulletins? First we were in trouble because of high fuel even with the second best hedge price behind SWA. Then we got the one that says it's not high fuel prices it's the commodities market. These guys will say whatever they have to to scare us. That is there job. Our job is to read between the BS and call them on it.

The industry and economy suck right now. But too many things just don't add up. We don't have to shrink to profitability, we are and have been already there. We have the youngest and most fuel efficient fleet in the industry. We were understaffed for a long time and now we are getting to normal staffing and maybe a little fat for a short time. As the new NG's come online our staffing will again even itself out.

Read this for what it is. A scare tactic by F&H that has been used for too many years to too many pilot groups. Why we cant all see thru this crap yet I have no idea. Stay the course boys and girls and stay strong.

If I seem like I'm full of it, just read the negotiating play book. I think we are at the section that talks about hostage taking. Anything else just seems like bad business sense. I may not like the way the Anglers run their airline, but they are good business people.

 

[Chief Pilot]

Agreed.

This is management on the offensive and the pilot group simply reacting. Management has not done a single thing yet required to mitigate these furloughs per our CBA. They have again verbally stated that they will furlough, but have not reduced lines, posted a furlough list at all bases, etc.....refer to our contract.

Additionally management has expressed a desire to finalize our contract by the end of the year and, no doubt, they would prefer to do it under the current administration.

We need to be anticipating their next move, which is to present us with the comprehensive outline they will present our negotiators in Washington D.C. later this month. They will show us their comprehensive outline with a modest pay increase, weak scope language, no change to health care and significantly slashed retirement. Then they will say if we take it we can keep everyone on the property.

You just have to sign by the end of the year.