Delta to trim future domestic, int'l capacity

[flyboyike]

Delta is pulling down some flying over the North Atlantic and replacing it with Africa.

Nairobi, no doubt. For obvious reasons.

 

[~~~^~~~]

Dumping all DALs eggs into the Europe and Africa basket will destroy the company-

International ops are very expensive-especially to craphole places like Africa-which no one has ever made money flying to (with the possible exception of S. Africa.) Europe's economy is tanking worse than ours-Africa has not got enough money to buy a '78 Pontiac in all its countries combined (excluding S. Africa.) Looks extremely stupid.

Delta has hardly "dumped all its eggs into Africa." Delta is diversified all over the globe and NWA brings Asia to the network in a new way.

Diversification and global connections help with driving premium revenue. Delta was well behind the industry in RASM, not it is a leader. Africa might not have loads for 777's but overseas foreign workers, government officials and those looking to trade in Africa's natural resources may fill a 757 to a profitable capacity.

After 50 years of jet travel, there is not much new, or innovative, out there. Delta is always looking for a market niche and looking for the revenue advantage that being a first mover provides.

They are NOT sitting around paying consultants hundreds of millions to find ways to "unlock shareholder's equity" like some others are doing. Delta's still trying to run an airline.

 

[PuffDriver]

These stupid decisions "big daddy D" is making will have implcations for you one day, Gen.... Even as big as you ego has become.

Dumping all DALs eggs into the Europe and Africa basket will destroy the company-everyone thought PanAm was too big to fail-how are they looking these days?. DAL almost made this same mistake in the early 90s, but they were smart enough to pull back. This time they have extended far too much and far too heavily into these areas.

International ops are very expensive-especially to craphole places like Africa-which no one has ever made money flying to (with the possible exception of S. Africa.) Europe's economy is tanking worse than ours-Africa has not got enough money to buy a '78 Pontiac in all its countries combined (excluding S. Africa.) Looks extremely stupid to anyone who has seen DAL make this mistake before.

-Good luck Gen, with this kind of complete moron mgmt. you will need it. Welcome to the new NWA-the old DAL is gone.

Glad you are not in charge of revenue management and route development. Africa has been profitable from day 1. There is a large market for Africa, and you used to have to go through Paris to get there. I won't waste the bandwidth on somebody with a brain the size of a pea, but Delta is the only US player in Africa. We were able to do it because of the flexibility of our fleet--perhaps even because of the mis-utilization of the 767s in domestic ops back in the day. Now we have the foothold in Africa, will soon offer the only non-stop to SA, and have put the rest of the carriers in the US at a huge disadvantage to entry into Africa. Keep watching. Thars oil down chonder, and with oil comes money.

 

[qxdash8]

These stupid decisions "big daddy D" is making will have implcations for you one day, Gen.... Even as big as you ego has become.

Dumping all DALs eggs into the Europe and Africa basket will destroy the company-everyone thought PanAm was too big to fail-how are they looking these days?. DAL almost made this same mistake in the early 90s, but they were smart enough to pull back. This time they have extended far too much and far too heavily into these areas.

International ops are very expensive-especially to craphole places like Africa-which no one has ever made money flying to (with the possible exception of S. Africa.) Europe's economy is tanking worse than ours-Africa has not got enough money to buy a '78 Pontiac in all its countries combined (excluding S. Africa.) Looks extremely stupid to anyone who has seen DAL make this mistake before.

-Good luck Gen, with this kind of complete moron mgmt. you will need it. Welcome to the new NWA-the old DAL is gone.

Comparing DL to Pan-Am just doesn't make much sense. The biggest difference is that DL is not operating on its own like Pan-Am did - DL has a massive marketing aggrement with AF/KLM that cannot be discounted (just flew did a LYS tirp, almost every passenger was French; tickets sold mostly by AF). Pan-Am was an old legacy carrier use to working in a tightly controled market; it could not adapt to the new unregulated world. DL has gone through some painful restructuring and is now more effiecent than even. Were not putting all of our eggs in the international basket, but we are diversifying. Even with all of this intl growth, more than half of our flying is still on the domestic side.

Plenty of carriers make money (and lots of it) in Africa ops - up until now, they have just been European airlines. Africa has money, it just concentrated in relativly small groups of people - and these people like to travel. Even with the added expense of international ops, our existing Africa routes are some of the most profitable in the system (and I'm not taking about SA either. Our operations to Nigeria has been so successful were expanding our service).

This isnt about ego, its about setting ourselves up to competitive in the gloabal market for years to come. Get over it.

 

[DTW320]

PanAm also had no real feed. DAL has tons.

 

[General Lee]

These stupid decisions "big daddy D" is making will have implcations for you one day, Gen.... Even as big as you ego has become.

Dumping all DALs eggs into the Europe and Africa basket will destroy the company-everyone thought PanAm was too big to fail-how are they looking these days?. DAL almost made this same mistake in the early 90s, but they were smart enough to pull back. This time they have extended far too much and far too heavily into these areas.

International ops are very expensive-especially to craphole places like Africa-which no one has ever made money flying to (with the possible exception of S. Africa.) Europe's economy is tanking worse than ours-Africa has not got enough money to buy a '78 Pontiac in all its countries combined (excluding S. Africa.) Looks extremely stupid to anyone who has seen DAL make this mistake before.

-Good luck Gen, with this kind of complete moron mgmt. you will need it. Welcome to the new NWA-the old DAL is gone.

Wow, there is sooo much wrong with your reply I don't know where to start.....

Delta is now big EVERYWHERE. We also have feed (as I stated earlier and now DTW320 stated), which Pan Am did not, and we also have Alliance partners, which give us even more feed worldwide. Africa is very lucrative, since those oil rich countries there have some rich people (the upper class) that want to visit other places. Our new service thru SAL, Cape Verde Islands, will have one or two flights PER WEEK to 5 or 6 different capitals of certain countries. The flights will go to SAL and back as turns (no layovers in those countries), and we can carry a lot of cargo since those flights will stop at SAL prior to going back to ATL. In otherwords, SAL will be a mini hub, and it will maximize profits, without dangering our crews. It's called Genius. Our management has also pulled out of markets faster if they do not perform, and they have been spot on since our BK reorganization plan, when we got some new people in there. The brightest thing I think they have done so far, though, is to announce more RJ parkings. Wow, that really is good news.


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[crj567]

Wow, there is sooo much wrong with your reply I don't know where to start.....

Delta is now big EVERYWHERE. We also have feed (as I stated earlier and now DTW320 stated), which Pan Am did not, and we also have Alliance partners, which give us even more feed worldwide. Africa is very lucrative, since those oil rich countries there have some rich people (the upper class) that want to visit other places. Our new service thru SAL, Cape Verde Islands, will have one or two flights PER WEEK to 5 or 6 different capitals of certain countries. The flights will go to SAL and back as turns (no layovers in those countries), and we can carry a lot of cargo since those flights will stop at SAL prior to going back to ATL. In otherwords, SAL will be a mini hub, and it will maximize profits, without dangering our crews. It's called Genius. Our management has also pulled out of markets faster if they do not perform, and they have been spot on since our BK reorganization plan, when we got some new people in there. The brightest thing I think they have done so far, though, is to announce more RJ parkings. Wow, that really is good news.


Bye Bye---General Lee

Do you even read what you write, Gen? Can you actually read at all?

"Pan Am had no feed... DAL has tons.......-let's park all our feed!" To paraphrase....

BTW-It may help you to read a little bit more than what you can find on this lame site. The "oil rich" countries which you reference in Africa are all covered up with terrorists, they are unprofitable hell-holes...... Of course, there are all the tourists who would love to head over there and get shot in the butt by one of these freak terrorists-NOT! Also, the price of crude is no longer at such high levels that many of these places could rightly be considered "oil rich."

You truly are an exceptionally stupid individual, Gen. I am convinced that DAL mgmt. is not only over-extended into Africa but into all of Europe. Europe's economy is in far worse shape than the U.S. economy... What do you really think that will do to international bookings-especially Africa? And, while you claim RJs are a waste of money, what do you think it costs to send a half-empty 767 back and forth to Nigeria? Hmmmmm.

Also, enlighten me on the mgmt. logic of "competing more aggessively" with AirTran. If I were on the board, I would be getting DAL to buy all AirTran's bonds to prop them up.... What-praytell, do you think will happen the very instant AirTran folds? them funny-looking 737s flown by all those "leather-jacket-wearing-discount" pilots you love to try and denegrate will come into ATL faster than you can send crap through a goose, and they WILL drive you right out of business....... Mark this paragraph and save it, then get back to me in a few years!

DAL is doing itself no favors these days.... Charging for bags, screwing people on their "frequent flier" miles, hosing smaller markets-especially from places like CVG. People remember these little things, and they are chomping at the bit to have an alternative-one day soon, they will. Lots of "little" planes with a true nationwide network will come into ATL and smack your arrogant butt right where it counts! It will just be unfortunate for all the non-toolbags who happen to work at DAL!

BTW-I have been in this industry far longer than you assume. I have seen DAL in good times and bad, but mark my words: These decisions that your vaunted mgmt. is making right now WILL destroy the company.. It is just a matter of time.

-One consolation for all of us will be seeing your arrogant, egotistical, self-obsessed, miserable butt have to go and get a real job and work for a living! I hear Jiffy Lube has great benefits!

 

[JohnQ]

what do you think it costs to send a half-empty 767 back and forth to Nigeria? Hmmmmm.

Well out of curiosity I checked the ATL-LOS trip for the 28, the day after Thanksgiving. Oversold by 25! The price if I wanted to buy a last-minute ticket? $3200 NON-refundable, and over $5000 for a refundable ticket!

You can easily fly a "half-empty" 767 to Nigeria if that is how it is defined. How much money is Air Tran and SWA making flying the Jerry Springer crowd from Orlando to Hartford?

BTW-I have been in this industry far longer than you assume. I have seen DAL in good times and bad, but mark my words: These decisions that your vaunted mgmt. is making right now WILL destroy the company.. It is just a matter of time.

Is that why prior to their arrival we were at 85% of industry average revenue, but now we are > 100%? I suppose we need to fire all those guys. Quick, let's put 777s and 767-400ERs back on endless ATL-MCO and ATL-FLL runs. We have to "protect Florida at all costs" (which I heard for years from our previous incompetent mgmt teams) even if it destroys the company in the process.

 

[jehtplane]

Well out of curiosity I checked the ATL-LOS trip for the 28, the day after Thanksgiving. Oversold by 25! The price if I wanted to buy a last-minute ticket? $3200 NON-refundable, and over $5000 for a refundable ticket!

quote]


Why not be more realistic. I do not think there are too many fares being sold this late for the day after thanksgiving. Why not try the middle of Jan. and see what you come up with. I will save you some time, 1500 roundtrip. Don't think too many people are saying at the last minute, hey lets fly to LOS.

 

[800Dog]

Do you even read what you write, Gen? Can you actually read at all?

"Pan Am had no feed... DAL has tons.......-let's park all our feed!" To paraphrase....

BTW-It may help you to read a little bit more than what you can find on this lame site. The "oil rich" countries which you reference in Africa are all covered up with terrorists, they are unprofitable hell-holes...... Of course, there are all the tourists who would love to head over there and get shot in the butt by one of these freak terrorists-NOT! Also, the price of crude is no longer at such high levels that many of these places could rightly be considered "oil rich."

You truly are an exceptionally stupid individual, Gen. I am convinced that DAL mgmt. is not only over-extended into Africa but into all of Europe. Europe's economy is in far worse shape than the U.S. economy... What do you really think that will do to international bookings-especially Africa? And, while you claim RJs are a waste of money, what do you think it costs to send a half-empty 767 back and forth to Nigeria? Hmmmmm.

Also, enlighten me on the mgmt. logic of "competing more aggessively" with AirTran. If I were on the board, I would be getting DAL to buy all AirTran's bonds to prop them up.... What-praytell, do you think will happen the very instant AirTran folds? them funny-looking 737s flown by all those "leather-jacket-wearing-discount" pilots you love to try and denegrate will come into ATL faster than you can send crap through a goose, and they WILL drive you right out of business....... Mark this paragraph and save it, then get back to me in a few years!

DAL is doing itself no favors these days.... Charging for bags, screwing people on their "frequent flier" miles, hosing smaller markets-especially from places like CVG. People remember these little things, and they are chomping at the bit to have an alternative-one day soon, they will. Lots of "little" planes with a true nationwide network will come into ATL and smack your arrogant butt right where it counts! It will just be unfortunate for all the non-toolbags who happen to work at DAL!

BTW-I have been in this industry far longer than you assume. I have seen DAL in good times and bad, but mark my words: These decisions that your vaunted mgmt. is making right now WILL destroy the company.. It is just a matter of time.

-One consolation for all of us will be seeing your arrogant, egotistical, self-obsessed, miserable butt have to go and get a real job and work for a living! I hear Jiffy Lube has great benefits!

Someone has way to much time on his hands!

 

[General Lee]

Do you even read what you write, Gen? Can you actually read at all?

"Pan Am had no feed... DAL has tons.......-let's park all our feed!" To paraphrase....

BTW-It may help you to read a little bit more than what you can find on this lame site. The "oil rich" countries which you reference in Africa are all covered up with terrorists, they are unprofitable hell-holes...... Of course, there are all the tourists who would love to head over there and get shot in the butt by one of these freak terrorists-NOT! Also, the price of crude is no longer at such high levels that many of these places could rightly be considered "oil rich."

You truly are an exceptionally stupid individual, Gen. I am convinced that DAL mgmt. is not only over-extended into Africa but into all of Europe. Europe's economy is in far worse shape than the U.S. economy... What do you really think that will do to international bookings-especially Africa? And, while you claim RJs are a waste of money, what do you think it costs to send a half-empty 767 back and forth to Nigeria? Hmmmmm.

Also, enlighten me on the mgmt. logic of "competing more aggessively" with AirTran. If I were on the board, I would be getting DAL to buy all AirTran's bonds to prop them up.... What-praytell, do you think will happen the very instant AirTran folds? them funny-looking 737s flown by all those "leather-jacket-wearing-discount" pilots you love to try and denegrate will come into ATL faster than you can send crap through a goose, and they WILL drive you right out of business....... Mark this paragraph and save it, then get back to me in a few years!

DAL is doing itself no favors these days.... Charging for bags, screwing people on their "frequent flier" miles, hosing smaller markets-especially from places like CVG. People remember these little things, and they are chomping at the bit to have an alternative-one day soon, they will. Lots of "little" planes with a true nationwide network will come into ATL and smack your arrogant butt right where it counts! It will just be unfortunate for all the non-toolbags who happen to work at DAL!

BTW-I have been in this industry far longer than you assume. I have seen DAL in good times and bad, but mark my words: These decisions that your vaunted mgmt. is making right now WILL destroy the company.. It is just a matter of time.

-One consolation for all of us will be seeing your arrogant, egotistical, self-obsessed, miserable butt have to go and get a real job and work for a living! I hear Jiffy Lube has great benefits!

Okay, a little slower for you now. Pan Am didn't have any direct feed, and at the end did mostly point to point. We are happily getting rid of 50 seat RJs (not enough though), and we are still keeping some CR9s and E170s, to go to the smaller cities. A lot of our feed will be trimmed, so instead of 8 flights a day on DCI from Knoxville to ATL, we might have 5. We are also going to add some mainline planes back to some cities, and take RJs away all together. People will be happy about that.

You really don't know much about Africa, do you? Did you know World Airways has 2 weekly flights from IAH (that's Houston Intercontinental for you) to Luanda, Angola? Why would they do that? Oil companies pay big bucks for that. It is probably World Airways' most profitable charter. And, we will offer twice weekly service (via SAL) to Luanda as well, along with some other Capitals that want the service. But, you knew that.....

You talk about what we should do with Airtran. Well, we are currently trying to "Pound" them, but not kill them. We already deal with a LCC that undercuts our flights (Airtran), and Southwest would be the same. You see, we have 70% of ATL traffic, and a lot consists of CONNECTIONS from places Airtran doesn't go to. From around the world, places you don't know even exist. (like Brazil) I know you were excited to go WEST OF THE MISSISSIPPI last week. Good for you. So, you want DL management to buy Airtran's bonds and then take them over after they go away? Did you call up Kramer and ask him that question? You love CNBC, don't you?

You mention CVG and people there who may not be happy with our service. Great example there chief, we fly 90% of the flights out of CVG. IF they want to go nonstop anywhere except ORD, DFW, or DEN, they have to fly on us. The first thing we can do to make them happier is to take away some of the cramped RJs. We are on our way to doing just that.

So, you have been in this industry a long time, eh? What, 8 months? Sounds like it. And I am glad you know a lot about Jiffy Lube. I suggest you go there and buy a quart of Quaker State and keep it for yourself. It will make the next year or so go "smoother" for you.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Cobra17]

Delta is now big EVERYWHERE. We also have feed (as I stated earlier and now DTW320 stated), which Pan Am did not, and we also have Alliance partners, which give us even more feed worldwide. Africa is very lucrative....

Bye Bye---General Lee

Talk about Kool-Aid. You should try this monster egg nog my brother makes with lighter fluid...

 

[crj567]

You are a truly challenged person, Gen....

Pretty much everything you wrote is patently incorrect, but I am busy and have little time to fool with such idiots as yourself.

I will address just one point that I thought I had made abundantly clear:

-DAL should do anything and everything they can to keep AirTran afloat. The threat AirTran presents to DAL is far less dire than that from SWA-which would replace AirTran in about 3 seconds......

-My point about buying bonds had nothing to do with taking over AirTran, my point was that these bonds would effectively "prop them up."

-AirTran is now CCC+ status on their debt. That is far into "junk bond" territory. You may well remember that term from when your last "inspired" management took DAL to that esteemed level. You may also remember that the next step for your "inspired" mgmt. was bankruptcy-or as you so idiotically put it-"BK."

-Now, if no one will buy AirTran's debt, maybe DAL could buy enough to keep them out of "BK." This would prevent the far more serious threat posed to your domestic routes from SWA.

You should note that SWA has not posted an annual loss since the 80's. I cannot think of many other airlines in that company-certainly not yours. When is the last time DAL strung together a couple of annual profits? Hmmmmm-about decade by now?

-Maybe DAL has a few things to learn from these guys. SWA knows how to not screw pax, they know how to make lots of money, and if they come to ATL, they will find out how to kick your sorry arrogant butt!

 

[General Lee]

You are a truly challenged person, Gen....

Pretty much everything you wrote is patently incorrect, but I am busy and have little time to fool with such idiots as yourself.

I will address just one point that I thought I had made abundantly clear:

-DAL should do anything and everything they can to keep AirTran afloat. I guess you didn't read the part about us "pounding" them, but not killing them, right? Re-read my post again junior.The threat AirTran presents to DAL is far less dire than that from SWA-which would replace AirTran in about 3 seconds...... Also, it would take YEARS for Southwest to totally replace Airtran. They are already fighting a new front in DEN, while retreating in BWI. They could try to get some ex Airtran 737s, but it would still take time to hire, train people to standards, etc. Sorry, but it would take a bit longer than 3 seconds....

-My point about buying bonds had nothing to do with taking over AirTran, my point was that these bonds would effectively "prop them up." Ummm, no. They won't go away anytime soon. Didn't you just read that article in the Majors section about Airtran doing better? Go take a look....

-AirTran is now CCC+ status on their debt. That is far into "junk bond" territory. You may well remember that term from when your last "inspired" management took DAL to that esteemed level. You may also remember that the next step for your "inspired" mgmt. was bankruptcy-or as you so idiotically put it-"BK."

-Now, if no one will buy AirTran's debt, maybe DAL could buy enough to keep them out of "BK." This would prevent the far more serious threat posed to your domestic routes from SWA. Even if Southwest eventually does take over the routes, they would be taking the same type of people that fly Airtran. Look what happens when Southwest THINKS about INTL flying? They give it to Volaris and Westjet. If you think Airtran is about to go away, then great, but I doubt it has hit that level yet. And maybe they do need to go into BK---we did it, and we seem to be doing a lot better now. It hurts, but that is the way it goes.

You should note that SWA has not posted an annual loss since the 80's. I cannot think of many other airlines in that company-certainly not yours. When is the last time DAL strung together a couple of annual profits? Hmmmmm-about decade by now? Well, Southwest didn't do great last quarter, and it remains to be seen how well they will do with the domestic slow down. All I know is that we have $6 billion in cash now, and that should hold us over.

-Maybe DAL has a few things to learn from these guys. SWA knows how to not screw pax, they know how to make lots of money, and if they come to ATL, they will find out how to kick your sorry arrogant butt! We have a different model than Southwest, and we fly hub and spoke. They do point to point, and have one type of aircraft, and stay away from INTL flying. I thought you knew all of that? One thing we are learning from them though is not to rely on RJs for profits. And my arrogant butt is doing great over here, and enjoying every second of not going to LBB or flying 5 legs a day. I think you should apply over there, you may have to soon anyway....

AirTran future brighter after painful struggles

Mon Nov 24, 2008 2:17pm EST
By Kyle Peterson - Analysis
CHICAGO (Reuters) - AirTran Airways, once seen as a likely casualty of the stunning oil price spike that claimed several smaller rivals this year, seems to have found its way out of the woods and may be positioned for profits in 2009.
By some estimates, the low-cost airline, a unit of AirTran Holdings (AAI.N: Quote, Profile, Research, Stock Buzz), had a brush with oblivion in the first half of this year as oil and jet fuel raced to record highs and pummeled the airline industry.
But a series of liquidity-boosting steps and a few lucky breaks have brightened the future of the Orlando, Florida-based airline which has an Atlanta hub.
"The fuel price spike had put extreme pressure on AirTran's cash flow and liquidity by midsummer, and unrestricted cash balances had dropped to very uncomfortable levels," said Bill Warlick, senior director at Fitch Ratings.
"But the rapid decline in jet fuel costs and the big cuts in domestic capacity have improved the carrier's cash flow prospects considerably," he said.........


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Speedbird34]

You are a truly challenged person, Gen....

Pretty much everything you wrote is patently incorrect, but I am busy and have little time to fool with such idiots as yourself.

I will address just one point that I thought I had made abundantly clear:

-DAL should do anything and everything they can to keep AirTran afloat. The threat AirTran presents to DAL is far less dire than that from SWA-which would replace AirTran in about 3 seconds......

-My point about buying bonds had nothing to do with taking over AirTran, my point was that these bonds would effectively "prop them up."

-AirTran is now CCC+ status on their debt. That is far into "junk bond" territory. You may well remember that term from when your last "inspired" management took DAL to that esteemed level. You may also remember that the next step for your "inspired" mgmt. was bankruptcy-or as you so idiotically put it-"BK."

-Now, if no one will buy AirTran's debt, maybe DAL could buy enough to keep them out of "BK." This would prevent the far more serious threat posed to your domestic routes from SWA.

You should note that SWA has not posted an annual loss since the 80's. I cannot think of many other airlines in that company-certainly not yours. When is the last time DAL strung together a couple of annual profits? Hmmmmm-about decade by now?

-Maybe DAL has a few things to learn from these guys. SWA knows how to not screw pax, they know how to make lots of money, and if they come to ATL, they will find out how to kick your sorry arrogant butt!

You sir I must call by your real name: RETARDED 100% or a flamebait.:smash: what a waste of human life. To think we have pea size brains like yours in our industry. What a shame.