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Markets hot for 50 seaters.

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Jul 22, 2002
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Seemsthe markets hot for these old 50's


Unwilling to wait for new jets, buyers opt for CRJ conversions

By Curt Epstein

Aviation International News >> June 2008
Cabin interior and electronics, Maintenance and Modifications



With the backlog for new business jets extending years into the future in some cases, and with used large-cabin aircraft prices soaring, several enterprises are offering an expedient alternative through executive conversions of Canadair CRJ200 regional jets. The 50-seat (in its commercial configuration) jetliner was first introduced in 1992 as a replacement for regional turboprops. Most of the executive conversions call for passenger accommodations of less than half that number, which would put them firmly in the large-cabin category, one that has seen dramatic growth and declining used inventory.

Given these conditions, many feel the time is ripe for CRJ refurbishments.

“What’s driving it is it ends up being a great platform for conversions into the corporate market because it has about 30 percent more volume than a GIV, it has the exact same cabin in height, width and length as a Global XRS and it gives you that size cabin for basically Challenger 604 operating cost,” said Allyn Caruso, CEO of Portland-based Maine Aviation, which is currently involved in the conversion of four of the aircraft and has completion slots for another five.

Of the four under way, three have been sold, according to Caruso, who notes a major selling point is the near-instant gratification. “We have one left out of the first batch, and I don’t believe that one will be around long because it’s the only airplane that will deliver this year,” he said.

One of the latest players in the executive CRJ market–a consortium consisting of Quebec-based Aerospace Concepts, in partnership with Project Phoenix and the UK’s Action Aviation–made a splash at November’s Dubai airshow, when plans were announced for a multiple aircraft conversion program. The group obtained its first CRJ200–a 20,000-hour aircraft formerly operated by now defunct Independence Air–and announced Ritz Pacific as its launch customer. The aircraft was recently ferried to Skyservice at Toronto Pearson Airport to begin two months of maintenance and upgrades before being sent to completions specialist Flying Colours, which recently unveiled expansion plans to accommodate the burgeoning CRJ conversion market.

Peterborough, Ontario-based Flying Colours is a preferred completions provider for Bombardier and has developed an “ExecLiner” CRJ modification package that includes an STC for additional fuel tanks that can give the aircraft 3,000 nm range.

The company–which is also handling the conversion work for Maine Aviation– will deliver its first ExecLiner to Indian fractional provider Club One Air this month. It has three additional CRJ200s in various stages of completion and claims firm orders for 10 CRJ ExecLiner conversions in addition to the completions work it will do on the derivative CRJ Phoenix. “The response has been all over the map, obviously North America, but I would say at least 50 percent or more is overseas,” said Flying Colours sales director Sean Gillespie. “It’s the niche thing right now so we are looking to take advantage of it.”

Fellow Canadian company Mjet has also recently begun work on a CRJ conversion of its own. The Montreal-based Elisen subsidiary is transforming a 2002 CRJ200 with 10,696 flight hours into a 15-passenger executive transport that will be operated for charter by Corpac Canada. The conversion will feature the recently introduced Elisen Elite Auxiliary Fuel System 500, which will provide an additional 4,500 pounds of fuel. Mjet expects to make its first conversion delivery in January.

Another company looking to make a major splash in the CRJ pool is Redmond, Wash.-based Tailwind Capital, which has already scooped up nine low-time CRJ200s from bankrupt commercial carriers Comair and Independence. Conversion of the aircraft into CRJ Executive Jets is being conducted by PATS Aircraft in Georgetown, Del., the OEM provider of the auxiliary fuel system for the Challenger 850. “From a value perspective, we’re offering our airplanes, fully converted with auxiliary fuel tanks and basically the same operating characteristics as the Challenger 850, at just over $19 million apiece,” said Tailwind managing director Joel Hussey.

The company had expected to hand off its first CRJ Executive Jet–to be managed in the Netherlands by Solidair–last month but has experienced what Hussey describes as “teething pains.” According to Hussey, the certification process for the aircraft was complicated by Tailwind’s seeking simultaneous FAA and EASA approval. While Tailwind had hoped to have this first of the five CRJs currently undergoing conversion ready in time for display at EBACE, current plans call for it to be delivered just after the show.

In contrast to other operations, Tailwind purchased its nine aircraft–all with fewer than 14,000 hours logged–outright and is converting them on speculation, rather than first seeking a customer. “We realistically believe that this is going to become a long-term program rather than a one-shot deal,” said Hussey. “The critical issue is being able to acquire the feedstock that is not only low time but also the right entry point.”


http://www.ainonline.com/airshow-co...-for-new-jets-buyers-opt-for-crj-conversions/
 
Knock da wings off an add a few cushy thangs an ya gots a really nice camper......
RVin' bouyyyyyyyyyyyyyy....
 
It's interesting, the first time I saw a non-airline CRJ was on the ramp at Penske in PTK about 4-5 years ago. At the time I remember going inside and thinking that it really does make a nice bizjet. Take the overheads and the ridiculous number of seats out and its got some serious space.

Wouldn't be surprised at all if the market proves to be excellent for these conversions.
 
Given the popularity of freight, wonder who will be the first to install tracks and have some cans built to fit the fuselage.
PBR
 
Add to that, a plethora of qualified pilots and knowledgable mechanics to keep operating cost down. It might be a good opportunity for many CRJ regional pilots who are fed up with the airlines to break into a good quality biz-jet job. It is also nice to have an airframe with millions of flight hours of experience so there are less “new aircraft” operational bugs to work out.
 
Some airline in Scandinavia flys CRJ200 freighters. I wonder why there aren't more of them. FedEx Express Express.
 
If this idea picks up, those guys will be loaded. I bet airlines would even lower the cost so low just to get rid of them. I dont think the majors like these things drinking all their precious highly priced fuel any longer.
 
These new 850's seem to be taking off throughout the world. Especially in the Middle East and Russia. Not all of them are old airframes. A few of them are fresh off the assembly line. However there have been problems getting some of these aircraft out of the conversion shop. Reason being a 4th fuel tank and a extravigant intertior is making them too heavy. I know people at a European company who are being paid to do nothing and are awaiting the arrival of their first two 850's for this reason. They are many months behind schedule...
 
They Do

Given the popularity of freight, wonder who will be the first to install tracks and have some cans built to fit the fuselage.
PBR

From Aerospace Technology http://www.aerospace-technology.com/projects/crj200/

"In August 2006, Bombardier launched the CRJ200 PF (Package Freighter), with the announcement that West Air Europe of Sweden had signed a contract for the conversion of two CRJ200 to the freighter configuration."
 
I heard that Pinnacle had a deal worked out that converted the door into some sort of "cargo door"



The deal was in place and it was set up for the spring to start flying for Fed EX.




Of course the Pinnacle FO and Captain told me this some 3 years ago...
 
just think the pilot pay will likely go up after they leave the regional airlines. I would bet you will see CRJ freighters in the future. Just about every other regional aircraft has been converted into frieghters following 121 pax service. (BE99,E-120,BE-1900, Metro, Shorts, etc.)
 
Hi!

My buddy is getting furloughed from Spirit.

So far, he has 1 job lined up, in India.

He will be flying an ERJ-145 (50 seater), that is being bought from some US regional and being retrofit as a biz jet. 10 weeks on, 3 weeks off. He's single, so it works for him.

cliff
MCI
 
just think the pilot pay will likely go up after they leave the regional airlines. I would bet you will see CRJ freighters in the future. Just about every other regional aircraft has been converted into frieghters following 121 pax service. (BE99,E-120,BE-1900, Metro, Shorts, etc.)

I think I read that the good ol' 146 is going to be a freighter in Europe, too.
 
just think the pilot pay will likely go up after they leave the regional airlines. I would bet you will see CRJ freighters in the future. Just about every other regional aircraft has been converted into frieghters following 121 pax service. (BE99,E-120,BE-1900, Metro, Shorts, etc.)

Oh and i forgot the ATR, how silly of me ;)
 
...and the EMB110, and the Saab 340, and the Fokker 27. Freighter is the last iteration of just about every commercial aircraft I think.

Just like once a building becomes a Chinese restaurant its the last stop before the wrecking ball.
 
Reason being a 4th fuel tank and a extravigant intertior is making them too heavy.
I recently read about one of these conversion companies whose program offered engine "upgrades"

It didn't get into specifics about what the upgrades were, but based off the performance stories that have been told about the CRJ's climb performance, one would take it to mean bigger engines.

IMO, you can't go wrong by adding more power.
 
I recently read about one of these conversion companies whose program offered engine "upgrades"

It didn't get into specifics about what the upgrades were, but based off the performance stories that have been told about the CRJ's climb performance, one would take it to mean bigger engines.

IMO, you can't go wrong by adding more power.

What Ive been told from guys who have flown these 850s is that its a computer mod. Basically they bump up the N1 a few percent for takeoff and climb. The justification is that these things wont be flying 10 legs a day like a typical CRJ. So they will be able to handle the abuse over a long period of time due to fewer cylces.
 
The corporate thing I can see. The cargo thing, you're either joking or out of touch with reality (at least in the US markets).
 
There's a cargo outfit flying a modified -200....in Europe of course though...

http://www.airliners.net/photo/West-Air-Europe/Canadair-CL-600-2B19-Regional/1231507/L/

It's always a possibility!!
Just very slim in the US.

Seriously, you've got cargo "gateways" scattered all over the place in the US, even in places such as Casper, WY and Sioux Falls, SD. Outstations are rarely over an hour and a half away in a turboprop, and even a Cessna Caravan is competitive with it's low speed. The fact is that turboprops get the job done at less cost (less fuel, mx under part 135 etc.)

With the heavies flying into the gateways, and everything getting to the outstations in time to make the early a.m. deliveries with turboprops the job is getting done at a lower cost than if you tried entering RJ's into the equation. It's not like your customers are going to "sneer" at the fact that their package had to fly on an old beat up turboprop (like passengers do).

Additionally, everything is being consolidated in the cargo world, further supporting the heavy jet gateway network. ABX used to do well with their DC9's, for example. Now after being consolidated with DHL, and then having DHL decide to ship things on UPS instead, the DC9's are on the chopping block, and the DC8's are being pulled out of the desert for UPS. You'd think "whoa, DC8's are gas guzzlers if there ever were any," but the bottom line is that through consolidation, it's more cost efficient to send one DC8 than two 727's and a DC9.

If even a DC9 can't survive, what makes you think there's a market for a CRJ?

Europe, Asia, Africa, South America, well, those are entirely different networks, who knows what a CRJ could do there.
 
Do you people actually do the math yourselves or just pass words? Most flights i do in a CRJ say for an hour block i burn 3500 pounds. Or 522 gallons. Even at $4/gallon that is only say around $2000 in gas.
Share that between 50 pax and you got each person paying $40 for gas. And that is at $4/gallon and i donm't think the airlines are paying that.
Now look at a DC-9. You will find the same flight will cost around $52/pax.
The CRJ is not as inefficient as you may think.

And look at the ERJ 170 (Regional Jet). It burns 30% more fuel than the CRJ 700. Same engines. Just a lot more drag. Air Canada is very dissapointed with the efficiencies of this jet. The 190 burns the same fuel but carries 20% more. (Depending on first class set up).
Anyway the airplanes that need to go away are the ERJ 170/175's.
 
Sorry for the late response, but I gotta respond anyway.

First off, when did we start talking about 70 seat RJ's? We're talking about 50 seaters and cargo. The only reason the 50 seaters are even in consideration for cargo is because the demand for them just drastically dropped.

In the cargo world, low cost of aquistion can compensate for higher operating costs because aircraft fly less legs/hours. How do you think the 727 has lasted so long?

Second, who said that DC9's were being chopped for inefficiency? The fact of the matter is that through consolidation FedEx and UPS can stick with larger aircraft (727 and larger).

Third, I gotta call BS on the "30%" figure.
 

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