Midwest Flight Reductions Announced

[DenverCrashpad]

The new schedule's main effects on Milwaukee travelers include:

Dropping nonstop flights to Los Angeles, San Francisco and Seattle. Those flights will now stop in Kansas City to take on additional fuel and passengers. Service to San Diego is being dropped entirely.

Dropping service to Fort Lauderdale and Fort Myers, two leisure destinations in Florida.

Flying to Orlando only from Oct. 21 through April 30. It is now a year-round destination.

Dropping Midwest Connect service to several cities, including Baltimore; Hartford, Conn.; Louisville, Ky.; Raleigh/Durham, N.C.; and St. Louis.

Service remains unchanged to such destinations as Atlanta; Boston; Denver; Minneapolis; New York; Philadelphia; Phoenix; Pittsburgh, Tampa, Fla.; and Washington, D.C.

 

[DenverCrashpad]

I can't fathom how Midwest feels they're losing money on some of these routes. Very high load factors and they charge a good amount.

 

[CitationLover]

I can't fathom how Midwest feels they're losing money on some of these routes. Very high load factors and they charge a good amount.

but they spend a lot too.

leisure markets have always been poor money makers in the airline business.

 

[GOULET!]

How convenient that they are also increasing their code share agreeement with NWA along with still keeping 5 flights a day to MSP.

 

[jravi8tor]

How convenient that they are also increasing their code share agreeement with NWA along with still keeping 5 flights a day to MSP.

I'm thinking it won't be long before all flights are operated by NWA. The traveling public will still be able to purchase a ticket on Midwest by Northwest via website or reservation call center, but in the end, it really doesn't matter.

Timmy sold the airline out from under everyone, and I truely believe he's to incompetant to realize what he's done and what NWA's true intentions are. He really thought Doug Steenland was a true friend.

 

[airplane wizard]

I can't fathom how Midwest feels they're losing money on some of these routes. Very high load factors and they charge a good amount.

Midwest couldn't make money if they were the only airline around, fuel was 0$, planes were free and everyone worked for free.

 

[FlyWolf]

^^ I agree

 

[RIDETHELIGHTING]

I'm thinking it won't be long before all flights are operated by NWA. The traveling public will still be able to purchase a ticket on Midwest by Northwest via website or reservation call center, but in the end, it really doesn't matter.

Timmy sold the airline out from under everyone, and I truely believe he's to incompetant to realize what he's done and what NWA's true intentions are. He really thought Doug Steenland was a true friend.

you guys new who he was selling too. How do you figure he sold the airline out from under you.

 

[maxblast72]

NWA doesn't give a crap about Midwest. How many times did NWA try to put Midwest out of business. NWA's play in Milwaukee was strictly a defensive play to keep one of the fastest growing LCC's away from their home turf. Definitely a smart move on NWA's part. Unfortunately, the Midwest company is just a pawn in the game.

Luckily for us, the deal didn't go through. Hub building and 20% growth year over year at $4 a gallon for jet A is not a profitable business plan

 

[FlyWolf]

you guys new who he was selling too. How do you figure he sold the airline out from under you.

And do you think any of us had any saying in this?

 

[Cardinal]

Those flights will now stop in Kansas City to take on additional fuel and passengers.

..... a practice known in the industry as CONNECTING AT THE DAMN HUB! All this airline spin is making me nauseous.

 

[armani]

but they spend a lot too.

leisure markets have always been poor money makers in the airline business.

Unless your Allegiant!

 

[Propsync]

The way the journal article read, it makes me believe there are 12 more departures to be cut out of MKE. My guess is PHX and LAS will get cut during some week when nothing else is going on.

 

[Wesb737fo]

And do you think any of us had any saying in this?

Agreed, I don't think anyone on the property (other than mgt.) could do anything about the present situation. It really sucks to have to ride the roller coaster without knowing where you will wind up.

ATA did a similar thing with it's employees and in the end everyone wound up kicked to the curb. The SWA codeshare seemed like a good idea at the time.

Hopefully, Midwest won't go the same way. I'm not sure what the end game is for TPG/NWA-DAL situation.
I'm sure TPG will not sit around and let NWA-DAL use Midwest as a blocking tool in MKE (I mean...they are going to want something for their investment).
Anybody see any scenarios?

 

[Propsync]

The way the journal article read, it makes me believe there are 12 more departures to be cut out of MKE. My guess is PHX and LAS will get cut during some week when nothing else is going on.

Edit isn't working for me. Anyway, re-read the article. Now it makes sense. Still can't believe they'll do PHX and LAS with 717's. Winter winds have to make it tough.

 

[TWA Dude]

For a brief period TWA flew 717s STL-PHX. It was a stretch and a big problem with alternate fuel. I can't imagine MKE-PHX or LAS working especially since they're putting more seats on.

 

[deadstick]

I see the future for MKE travelers, now.

NWA just announced MKE-LAX nonstop as of 6 SEP in an A320.

 

[GOULET!]

I see the future for MKE travelers, now.

NWA just announced MKE-LAX nonstop as of 6 SEP in an A320.

Im sure SFO, SEA, and some Florida destinations will be popping up again periodically too. NWA is beginning to add some more "competition" to MKE again. This all looks good on paper til the merger goes through and Midwest goes under.

 

[CitationLover]

Unless your Allegiant!

1) you're

2) allegiant makes a significant amount of revenue from hotel/casino and rental car arrangements. other major airlines have failed at this since the allegis debacle of the 1980's. all the power to allegiant to continue it.

 

[FlyWolf]

Not to change the subject

The numbers are out, 115 furloughs, in addition to the 35 furloughed already.

 

[CitationLover]

Not to change the subject

The numbers are out, 115 furloughs, in addition to the 35 furloughed already.

still 150 too many, but it is 60 less than anticipated.

 

[FlyWolf]

I know CL, this will be my third. I heard they got 100 sick calls over the weekend, it was a big mess.

 

[flying zephyr]

rumor, speculation, whatever

Call it what you will, but I had heard a while ago that our ranks were going to be reduced greatly for an eventual merger sometime next year with the new "DELTA". I was told that this is being done partially to integrate fewer ME pilots onto the list and now half the captain ranks will be integrated as FOs. Also that for us furloughed guys our "career expectations" will be so low that we will not be offered a recall to the new carrier. Hence, we will be cast off into the great unknown. I had always thought this to be just rumors, but the coffin lid is closing and I see more of the nails being pounded every day. My reasons for denying this were denial for which I am stupid, but also that somewhere along the way, TPG has to make some cash. Now I am starting to believe everything about this "rumor".

 

[9rj9]

TPG doesn't have to make any money. They never intended to, they get paid by NWA and Delta on the back side when Midwest goes under. It was a cheap way for Delta to dominate the upper midwest, plus demise of Midwest gives tax breaks and right downs against profits. You were just a pawn in the game, bad timing, I guess you could've supported Airtran, but who knows.

 

[fam62c]

Call it what you will, but I had heard a while ago that our ranks were going to be reduced greatly for an eventual merger sometime next year with the new "DELTA". I was told that this is being done partially to integrate fewer ME pilots onto the list and now half the captain ranks will be integrated as FOs. Also that for us furloughed guys our "career expectations" will be so low that we will not be offered a recall to the new carrier. Hence, we will be cast off into the great unknown. I had always thought this to be just rumors, but the coffin lid is closing and I see more of the nails being pounded every day. My reasons for denying this were denial for which I am stupid, but also that somewhere along the way, TPG has to make some cash. Now I am starting to believe everything about this "rumor".

NWA and DAL are trying to reduce the number of fleet types and the number of employees; why would they go through all the merger related hassles to add tiny Midwest, another airplane type (sub-type anyway) and a bunch of senior employees? That wouldn't make good business sense if they are eliminating the brand. NWA/DAL/TPG will just transfer anything of value to NWA/DAL and their connection carriers (it just happened with MKE-LAX) and then the remaining shell of Midwest will be liquidated and NWA/TPG will be out from underneath it. There's not going to be any merger here and I don't see any way Midwest can continue to operate on it's own.

The only question now is how to transfer the pieces with value to NWA/DAL so it will pass scrutiny in the bankruptcy process and not generate claims by creditors. All I can see being transferred is the LGA/DCA slots, some airport gate/facility leases and some ground support equipment. Maybe what's left of Skyway will be retained as a division (or independent company owned by the creditors) to provide ground support functions. The 717's, most of the Midwest employees and the Midwest off-airport facilities are probably going to be liquidated. Nothing else makes any economic sense in this environment; at this point TPG needs a quick exit strategy to minimize further losses.

 

[Morning Wood]

I don't really understand why if the whole intent is for TPG to pull the plug, why not do it now? Why burn through whatever cash is left and put on this dog and pony show of "restructuring"? What's sick is that they want the people who are being furloughed NOV1 to stick around until that day.

 

[fam62c]

I don't really understand why if the whole intent is for TPG to pull the plug, why not do it now? Why burn through whatever cash is left and put on this dog and pony show of "restructuring"? What's sick is that they want the people who are being furloughed NOV1 to stick around until that day.

That's a good question and I don't have an answer, only guesses. They may be waiting to see if and to what extent the lessors, vendors and unions will bite on concessions. They may feel that if they can maintian a going concern with below market rate costs that the business may sell as a whole. Another thought is that they need more time to figure out how to move the important pieces to NWA/DAL without creating any additional antitrust issues that could slow that deal. Additionally, there may be an attempt to do some "face saving" at TPG so they are making a show of a herculean attempt at restructuring to "save" the company. If the vendors and or unions balk they will have a scapegoat when they pull the plug.

I don't know when the end will come but I just don't see any way that Midwest will ever be able to operate profitably in it's proposed form. The people at TPG aren't dumb, maybe they have another way out; we'll just have to wait and see. At some point even the catlike Midwest will use up it's nine lives.

 

[eightdriver]

Not to change the subject

The numbers are out, 115 furloughs, in addition to the 35 furloughed already.

Where did you get this info from??

 

[atpcliff]

Hi!

My CEO was wondering if they would fly more MKE-IND with either 717s or the Skywest RJs and hook up with NWA to go longer distances, like the West Coast and Mexico?

I hope for the best for the MidEx crews. A merger would be the best-they would all end up as DAL/NWA pilots.

cliff
MCI

 

[Propsync]

Hi!

My CEO was wondering if they would fly more MKE-IND with either 717s or the Skywest RJs and hook up with NWA to go longer distances, like the West Coast and Mexico?

I hope for the best for the MidEx crews. A merger would be the best-they would all end up as DAL/NWA pilots.

cliff
MCI

Beyond doubtful. That's what DTW and MSP are for.