Frontier CEO hints at shutdown

[bugchaser]

I know hundreds of farmers and can't think of one single one that is a democrat. That whole conservative values thing I guess.

I'm just sayin.

 

[airplane wizard]

where's that infallibility of capitalism now?

In the same place as the unsinkable Titanic

 

[Andy]

To those at Frontier, good luck. I suggest that you make plans to work somewhere else.

I looked over the 10K and 8K; they're ugly. While some will try to soothe you in telling you that everything's standard language in the 10K, there's one phrase that you always need to look for when deciding whether or not a company's about to die - it's 'going concern.' That's a statment that auditors (in this case KPMG) insist on having put into filings when the odds are that the company's toast. It's like a doctor telling the patient that he's got an inoperable cancer/tumor/etc and has 3 months to live.

Here's a link to the 10K: http://www.frontierairlines.com/secfilings/10k063008/10k063008.pdf

A quick search results in the 'going concern' statement 17 times.

Here's a link to the 8K: http://www.frontierairlines.com/secfilings/8k063008/8k063008.pdf

That's also not a pretty sight. F9 sold 4 aircraft during May and raised a net $21M from the sale. The cash on hand increased by $11M to $110M. Keep in mind that a chapter 7 company needs to have cash on hand in order to shut down. I don't know what that number is WRT F9, but I don't give the company much past Labor Day.

My apologies to those at F9 to be the bearer of bad news, but I'm not one to sugar coat things and tell you everything's OK; it's not.

 

[Newf Dog]

Andy,

We are all well aware of the dire nature of our financial situation. Nobody is kidding themselves over it.

My main gripe is with the title of the thread which gives the impresion that the CEO mentioned us shutting down to the media. A SWA guy, who stands to benefit from our demise, posts this like it's news when all he did was extrapolate info from a standard financial filing.

Clearly we are in a race to outlast high fuel. We all know that. We're selling 7 more planes because we need cash, period.

I have looked at the numbers myself. Without knowing the $$$ amount we're getting for the seven airplanes specifically it looks like we can go for a while. It's up to the creditors committee how long they will let us fight.

Bottom line is if oil comes down we've got a shot. If not we're not the only ones in hack. We all know that. You can bet your @$$ we're not going down without a fight.

No matter how bleak it looks you fight to the end. This company is too good to give up on. If we don't make it...well we gave it everything we had. That's all you can ask.

Remember, we didn't surrender when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor!

 

[MCDU]

Germans bombed Pearl Harbor?

 

[WSurf]

Germans bombed Pearl Harbor?

Some people just don't get it! Young kids these days.

 

[WSurf]

Let us educate you.





http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fO6LVE_P-A8

 

[Colonel Savage]

Step off, Gup!

You GUP as an ex-F9er should be ashamed of yourself for fanning the flames with a post like that, "CEO hints at shutdown."

Is "piling on" the way the "classy" guys at SWA do business. Of course you guys wouldn't stand to benefit one iota from hastening F9's demise would you?

My main gripe is with the title of the thread which gives the impresion that the CEO mentioned us shutting down to the media. A SWA guy, who stands to benefit from our demise, posts this like it's news when all he did was extrapolate info from a standard financial filing.

GUP! We talked about this before, didn't we? These are your former F9 comrades telling you to take it down a notch.

I told you fortunes can change in an instant in this business, but you're starting to remind me of Browntothebone. If you think you're immune from the likes of TPG or Tiger Capital you need a reality check.

 

[Newf Dog]

Thanks for the help on that Wsurf! Kids today!

 

[WSurf]

Thanks for the help on that Wsurf! Kids today!

Anytime NewF, since we are old school its up to us to educate. LOL

 

[Flying the Line]

And jet fuel has gone up between 10 and 17 cents per gallon in the last week.

http://tonto.eia.doe.gov/dnav/pet/pet_pri_spt_s1_d.htm

 

[JetMonkey]

I was implying that more regulation is in order and you automatically brand me a communist? Does making every issue black and white make it so you don't have to think? Is everything that isn't laissez faire capitalism automatically communism? I guess my post worked because it was directed at simpletons like you.

.

Less Government=Less taxes, greater personal responsibility. Let me repeat that since common sense isn't so common for you socialist types...

LESS GOVERNMENT = LESS TAXES!!

 

[Deadalus]

I know hundreds of farmers and can't think of one single one that is a democrat. That whole conservative values thing I guess.

I'm just sayin.

I'm talking the hard working kind, dairy farmers.

I can think of several wheat farmers that are conservative Republicans. But then again they're also the type that have 120ft yachts and private jets.

 

[waka]

Less Government=Less taxes, greater personal responsibility. Let me repeat that since common sense isn't so common for you socialist types...

LESS GOVERNMENT = LESS TAXES!!

A. do you actually have a point?
B. what does that "point" have to do with my post that makes zero mention of taxes?
C. you sound like some parrot

 

[MJ42]

I'm talking the hard working kind, dairy farmers.

I can think of several wheat farmers that are conservative Republicans. But then again they're also the type that have 120ft yachts and private jets.

How dare those wheat farmers! Becoming successful and then using their hard earned money as they decide? They should be giving more to the government, who could then show that wheat farmer how to spend HIS hard earned money!uke:

 

[Max Powers]

Less Government=Less taxes, greater personal responsibility. Let me repeat that since common sense isn't so common for you socialist types...

LESS GOVERNMENT = LESS TAXES!!

Typical Republican BULL CAKA. We need to tax the he!! out of gas. with gas at 9 dollars a gallon the primary buyers (You and me with cars) will change their behaviors and buy a much smaller car. This will help to decrease demand(bringing supply in line with what it should be). With people driving less, you allow all forms of Mass transit (including airlines) to get gas at the present tax rate. People will be flying at lot more and driving a lot less and the price of fuel will plummet.!!!!

I know what your going to say: "we need to drill more - blah blah blah - the price of gas won't get people to driveless - blah blah blah - price controls never work because Sean Hanity, Rush, and bill Oriley say they won't blah blah blah. Europe is capitalistic but they believe in some common sense regulation to protect their countries from the stupidity of their citizenry.

Less taxes are good but there is a point where too much "less taxes" is bad......When your at war your yearly deficit is increasing - the national debt to over 9 TRILLION and people making over 1 million dollars see a year over year salary increase of 6.9 percent, whilst those making less than 100k see a year over year increase of 1.3 percent(not even beating inflation) one has to ask themselves are we favoring one group over the other?

 

[JumpJetter]

they believe in some common sense regulation to protect their countries from the stupidity of their citizenry.

NOTICE TO ALL


This is really what dems/liberals/the left think. It's the bottom line. The elite are smarter than you and know how to spend YOUR money better than.

Guys like Min Powers would like nothing more than to trounce on your constitutional rights 2 days after Independence Day.

Mini Powers (and you libs). Dude, leave us alone. I will spend MY HARD EARNED money on what I want. Got it?

 

[greenbayfan]

Typical Republican BULL CAKA. We need to tax the he!! out of gas. with gas at 9 dollars a gallon the primary buyers (You and me with cars) will change their behaviors and buy a much smaller car. This will help to decrease demand(bringing supply in line with what it should be). With people driving less, you allow all forms of Mass transit (including airlines) to get gas at the present tax rate. People will be flying at lot more and driving a lot less and the price of fuel will plummet.!!!!

I know what your going to say: "we need to drill more - blah blah blah - the price of gas won't get people to driveless - blah blah blah - price controls never work because Sean Hanity, Rush, and bill Oriley say they won't blah blah blah. Europe is capitalistic but they believe in some common sense regulation to protect their countries from the stupidity of their citizenry.

Less taxes are good but there is a point where too much "less taxes" is bad......When your at war your yearly deficit is increasing - the national debt to over 9 TRILLION and people making over 1 million dollars see a year over year salary increase of 6.9 percent, whilst those making less than 100k see a year over year increase of 1.3 percent(not even beating inflation) one has to ask themselves are we favoring one group over the other?

I love how most pilots on FI.com think they are friggn' economists...quit your day job brother, you are a genious! All this downsizing in the airline business would have happened years ago had the government not stepped in after 9/11 with handouts. UA was losing money even before 9/11, and the ones with the weakest buainess plans are getting exposed now...being unemployed sucks, I've been there. However, all these weak airlines need to go by the wayside for the health of our industry and our profession.

 

[Max Powers]

I love how most pilots on FI.com think they are friggn' economists...quit your day job brother, you are a genious! All this downsizing in the airline business would have happened years ago had the government not stepped in after 9/11 with handouts. UA was losing money even before 9/11, and the ones with the weakest buainess plans are getting exposed now...being unemployed sucks, I've been there. However, all these weak airlines need to go by the wayside for the health of our industry and our profession.

So had we weaned ourselves from oil as the European had done; we would still be in need of oil as badly as we are today? You have no logic.

Look.... we use 25 percent of the world's oil. If we drop that by half (which is easily possible by taxing gas and forcing mileage laws on car companies) the cost of oil would decline sharply and the aggregate excess supply would increase 7 fold. Airlines would easily be growing and people would be happy to fly and stay out of their little dangerous tin cars.

them are called facts little boy.

 

[MJ42]

You sir are absolutely right!!!! I do believe that I know better than your fat wife, whilst she rides in her 16 mpg SUV. I do believe - I know better than the slimy Texas bastard who shot two immigrants over stealing a 40 dollar computer printer (I guess he'll sleep well knowing that he shot someone in the back over a material item).

Look you knuckle draggin' red-necks: In my perfect world we would all live in non-suburban sprawl - with mass-transit and parks all over the place. But I am willing to compromise and allow people to live as they wish, but I feel they must pay for the right to hurt our country and weaken our economy.

Thankfully we don't live in YOUR perfect world! I'm smart enough to make my own life decisions.