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UAL "Hat switch" ??

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Fox-Tree

Fox-Tree

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 14, 2006
Posts
307
I like to check in with my former UAL bros once in a while via their "code-a-phone" and whatever other info presents itself. I really hope this perfect storm of events passes quickly and they (and everyone else in this ridiculous business) can get back to something closer to “normal”. They’ve been working under a brutal contract that was forced on them with the barrel of bankruptcy at their temple. The window is now open to begin to negotiate their new (and hopefully improved) contract but to date; the company has chosen not to return to the table. Frankly, that might be a good thing for now – I’m not sure it would be possible to negotiate improvements under the current circumstances. Even if the company offered, I think the pilot’s might think it prudent to stay away from the table until things get better.

So, the code-a-phone refers to a “hat switch” being on or off and directs them to wear or not wear their hats when they might be seen by management as a show of solidarity. I’m not attempting any kind of “flame” here. I am just wondering if the general pilot population at UAL really complies with this. It seems a bit silly, I think. I doubt management really cares about hats and who’s wearing them or not. It would also seem that the only thing an attempt to influence UAL management by “hat protest” would do is possibly make the pilot group look foolish. Go easy on me because I really tried to construct this letter respectfully. I really just want to hear some opinions on this – perhaps I’m just not looking at this the right way.
Thanks.
 
I think it is trying to show management that the pilots are all on the same page. It has nothing to do with the hat itself.
 
Do most pilots actually comply with it? Seems like it would be counterproductive if half the pilots just ignored the "hat switch."
 
G100driver said:
I think it is trying to show management that the pilots are all on the same page. It has nothing to do with the hat itself.
Click to expand...

I get that part. I guess I'm just wondering if this action would really do that and what it the real value of showing them you're "on the same page". Does not wearing or wearing your hat in unison signal anything like a willingness to burn the house down or go on strike? I don't see the connection. One is A LOT easier than the other.

Put yourself in a management meeting (if that's possible): "We better make sure we don't pi$$ these guys off, they're not wearing their hats."

More likely, they'd just laugh.
 
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I think it actually has some value if the overwhelming majority listen to it. It destroys management's argument that the pilots don't listen to the MEC. The key is getting all of the pilots on board. I'm not really a fan of using the hat for this purpose, but I guess it works.
 
The number of pilots I have seen wearing their hats in the last few weeks can be counted on one hand. The half wings (new hires) have special dispensation due to their probationary status.
 
Oooooh look out management!!! If we don't get our demands met, we're not going to wear our hats!!! That's what unions have come to! They can't strike, they can't stop management from imposing anything on a work group in the name of the economy. So what's the point of paying any union dues at all. Maybe we here at Jetblue can do the same by showing our management we mean business about putting a union on the property...Oh, wait, we don't have any hats do we? Well, errr, maybe we'll just taxi slow then.
 
BLUE BAYOU said:
Oooooh look out management!!! If we don't get our demands met, we're not going to wear our hats!!! That's what unions have come to! They can't strike, they can't stop management from imposing anything on a work group in the name of the economy. So what's the point of paying any union dues at all. Maybe we here at Jetblue can do the same by showing our management we mean business about putting a union on the property...Oh, wait, we don't have any hats do we? Well, errr, maybe we'll just taxi slow then.
Click to expand...

or you could all stop cleaning the aircraft during turns.
 
There are a few reasons we have a “hat switch” at United.
1. It shows solidarity and clearly identifies those pilots who are not on board with the union!
2. It lets the company know we are together. This does work as we all received an e-mail regarding the wearing of our hats which obviously shows they are paying attention.
3. It does have an effect as the last time we did this we got a TA addressing the lack of work rules on the 737/320 fleets.
I do not know if anything will happen this time but I sure do like knowing which pilots are not with us. As they say if you’re not with us your against us.
 
BLUE BAYOU said:
Oooooh look out management!!! If we don't get our demands met, we're not going to wear our hats!!! That's what unions have come to! They can't strike, they can't stop management from imposing anything on a work group in the name of the economy. So what's the point of paying any union dues at all. Maybe we here at Jetblue can do the same by showing our management we mean business about putting a union on the property...Oh, wait, we don't have any hats do we? Well, errr, maybe we'll just taxi slow then.
Click to expand...
Maybe if you guys had a union those 190 rates would have been negotiated instead of imposed.
 
eaglesview said:
There are a few reasons we have a “hat switch” at United.
1. It shows solidarity and clearly identifies those pilots who are not on board with the union!
2. It lets the company know we are together. This does work as we all received an e-mail regarding the wearing of our hats which obviously shows they are paying attention.
3. It does have an effect as the last time we did this we got a TA addressing the lack of work rules on the 737/320 fleets.
I do not know if anything will happen this time but I sure do like knowing which pilots are not with us. As they say if you’re not with us your against us.
Click to expand...

Alright guys - well - if it seems to be working then I guess I can't argue with it.

I hope things get better sooner than later and good luck to us all.
 
jimcav said:
Maybe if you guys had a union those 190 rates would have been negotiated instead of imposed.
Click to expand...

Nah, what fun would that have been! Besides, at least now we can say it wasn't our fault.
 
So let me get this straight. UAL is losing money like never before. Fuel costs have nearly doubled in the last year. UAL is losing millions per day and there is no end in sight. This is a game of survival and every day, UAL is burning through tons of cash.

There is talk about bankruptcy, mergers and furloughs and the best you can come up with is not wearing your hat?

Hang on to your wallets guys!
 
I don't think anybody ever said that was the best they could come up with, it's just a visual show of unity in addition to everything else the MEC is doing.
 
J32driver said:
Pay no attention to Blue Bayou. He is just another of the 2%'ers.
Click to expand...

I've been seeing a lot of blue dudes with JBPA stickers on their flight bags. Good stuff. Hope you guys can make it happen, in spite of the Blue Bayou types.
 
Beside the point

The UAL guys Hats off program was designed before this latest "Firestorm" of out of sight fuel prices. They were/are hell bent on a strike to take something back from the contracts imposed on them in 2003. All this though was before the run up in fuel costs.
I imagine that the program is still a go but the more immediate and catastrophic problem is the cost of fuel. All of the airlines must be reeling, not just UAL. It looks like it has come to a day to day/month to month survival plan with no end in sight, a truly unique scenario no one saw coming.
My hat is off the the UAL guys and gals (no pun intended). They have put up with a ton of $hit for years, and still keep the op safe. I put up with it for 5 years was furloughed then resigned. Airlines margins are so darn slim anyway, it wouldn't have taken much to stress their balance sheets. One of my top 3 reasons? Uncertainty in fuel costs...

Good luck guys
 
Poahi said:
So let me get this straight. UAL is losing money like never before. Fuel costs have nearly doubled in the last year. UAL is losing millions per day and there is no end in sight. This is a game of survival and every day, UAL is burning through tons of cash.

There is talk about bankruptcy, mergers and furloughs and the best you can come up with is not wearing your hat?

Hang on to your wallets guys!
Click to expand...

Why don’t you spend a little more time minding your own store. You obviously don’t understand the importance of unity no matter what the situation is.
 
BLUE BAYOU said:
Oooooh look out management!!! If we don't get our demands met, we're not going to wear our hats!!! That's what unions have come to! They can't strike, they can't stop management from imposing anything on a work group in the name of the economy. So what's the point of paying any union dues at all. Maybe we here at Jetblue can do the same by showing our management we mean business about putting a union on the property...Oh, wait, we don't have any hats do we? Well, errr, maybe we'll just taxi slow then.
Click to expand...

Blew by who? Oh, by you...
 
eaglesview said:
Time will tell if it works or not.
Click to expand...

Your're right... it will take a few decades to see if the Baker/Cheney/Bush Nationbuilding experiment in Iraq....

oh.....

sorry.... you are talking about something else...

disregard.... :0
 
ATA For Now! said:
The half wings (new hires) have special dispensation due to their probationary status.
Click to expand...

Da probie not stylin' his kangol wit da Homey's wit da switch down be ON! Probie got cojones!!!
 

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