Delta Cuts

[Seaknight1]

Call me a cynic, but is it possible the merger may not be completely dead after all? Could this be a means of reducing the overhead that will certainly be necessary in the support functions should the merger actually happen? You know, some of that synergy we keep hearing about. I don't think rigormortis has set in on the merger yet. Too much money at stake. If mgt wants this merger there will come a time when they move on and do it with or without the pilots coming to an agreement. Time will tell.

Ding, ding, ding, ding! We've got a winner! I think they're cleaning out shop before hand rather than after the merger.

 

[lowecur]

They offer the buyout to 30k, the goal is 2k, and they will take more than 2k if the numbers are there.

Sooooo potentially they could lose insert number here? How many would be too many? 30k?

30k is more than half the company.

I doubt it's insert a number. Buying out older senior workers, then rehiring younger less expensive workers is not a new idea. I'm sure Doug would love to do this, but most of his workforce is union, and I would guess they would smell a rat.

The ranks of the unemployed is going to swell in the next 12 months, and many will be educated and actually be glad for the opportunity to bring home a paycheck. Smart move by Anderson, as many that will take his offer will be sorry they did so 12 months from now.

imp:​

 

[Gunfighter]

I...the fact that they will soon be transporting Americans in decreasing numbers to places were Americans can no longer afford to go.

Delta is already transporting Americans in decreasing numbers. That is the beauty of international flying. Delta is selling tickets in Euros to foriegn customers who view travel TO the US as a bargain. When the $ rebounds they will sell tickets in $ to Americans who can travel overseas. The international flights leaving the US are full of return passengers on round trip flights, not originations on a round trip.

Delta is selling in Euros and converting them at 1.5 to the dollar. That helps offset the high oil prices.

 

[Gunfighter]

The ranks of the unemployed is going to swell in the next 12 months, and many will be educated and actually be glad for the opportunity to bring home a paycheck. Smart move by Anderson, as many that will take his offer will be sorry they did so 12 months from now.

The downside for Delta is that many who volunteer will be the highly motivated and skilled individuals who can find employment elsewhere. Exactly the kind of people who are needed to run a leaner company. The ones who stay in a buyout scenario are often the average to below average employees who couldn't find a comparable job.

 

[Furloughed80]

Is it true that all classes after April are on hold indefinitely?

 

[FDJ2]

I doubt it's insert a number. Buying out older senior workers, then rehiring younger less expensive workers is not a new idea.

You are correct. I'd expect a target figure of between 1600-1700 is what management is looking for.

The number of early outs is insignificant to match the non front line employee cuts a merger would bring. This isn't about prepping for a merger, this is about adjusting to $110/bbl oil.

There may still be a merger down the road, but these cuts are a different matter.

 

[737 Pylt]

I doubt it's insert a number. Buying out older senior workers, then rehiring younger less expensive workers is not a new idea. I'm sure Doug would love to do this, but most of his workforce is union, and I would guess they would smell a rat.

The ranks of the unemployed is going to swell in the next 12 months, and many will be educated and actually be glad for the opportunity to bring home a paycheck. Smart move by Anderson, as many that will take his offer will be sorry they did so 12 months from now.

imp:​

While I don't usually agree with things you say, you do have a good point here. Anderson is not stupid, and you're right, getting rid of higher, longer employed people, and replacing them with newhires is a smart move.

737

 

[Tanker Clown]

Boy, I think we all saw this coming. Soon they won't be asking for volunteers. You can only hemmorage cash before so long.

 

[ACL65PILOT]

Noting is official yet for classes, but from what I have been told (unofficial, official will be in a day or two) One or both classes will probably run. Summer may not have any hiring, and then reevaluate next fall.
The is a very reactive action by Delta. Not something that has happened in the past. They are doing this now instead of a year down the road when we are over 1 billion in the red.
It is better to wait on the outside looking in, than to get a number and be lobbed off in two months. I know, I waited six years. This time lets all hope it never gets to that point.

 

[Tanker Clown]

Hire 'till you furlough. I guess SWA had a crystal ball when they started cutting back a year ago.

 

[Bavarian Chef]

Must not be a good offer then, to offer it to 30k and only hope for 2k.

Unless it comes with that magical clause:


"Leave now with something, or leave later with nothing."

 

[EMBpilot]

The total number of employees eligible for early out is 30K.
This does not mean that Delta is asking all 30K to bail out. Delta expects 2000 to take it. If more decide to go Delta will try to accommodate.

 

[ultrarunner]

Is it just me, or does anyone else find it astounding that 65% of the employees on the property meet this standard:

"....over 29.5 years Seniority and is at least 52 years old...."

 

[snow-back]

Delta is already transporting Americans in decreasing numbers. That is the beauty of international flying. Delta is selling tickets in Euros to foriegn customers who view travel TO the US as a bargain. When the $ rebounds they will sell tickets in $ to Americans who can travel overseas. The international flights leaving the US are full of return passengers on round trip flights, not originations on a round trip.

Delta is selling in Euros and converting them at 1.5 to the dollar. That helps offset the high oil prices.

This is one of the most retarded explanations I've read in a long time. Ticket price is ticket price. It doesn't matter if you charge Euros, Dollars, Lira or Rupees. 500 Euros or $780 will buy you the same ticket. You make it sound like you're tricking the Europeans into buying a $500 ticket for 500 Euros and then pocketing the difference.

 

[PA44Jockey]

Re-read the article, they are cutting 2000 jobs by offering the severance package to 30,000 employees in hopes that 2000 will take it. They arent cutting 30,000 jobs.

Those 2000 jobs are admin and management positions. So if 3000 ramp workers took the bait, they would still have to cut 2000 jobs. I believe they need way more than 2000 jobs eliminated.

 

[wings421]

What an awesome time to be a new hire at Delta.

Age 65, fleet shrinkage, no seniority. uke:

Well, I started yesterday. Knew about age 65, slow upward movement and the high oil prices being a bad thing all paired with merger prospects before I came.

Not for one second do I regret coming here.

FWIW, they told us in class today that there will likely be 3 more classes (2 April, 1 May) that run before they close the doors on hiring until close to the end of the year. Then (assuming oil doesn't keep rising like it has been), they will have to start hiring again for the 737/777 on order. All of those are still coming.

 

[Future Furlough]

Is it just me, or does anyone else find it astounding that 65% of the employees on the property meet this standard:

"....over 29.5 years Seniority and is at least 52 years old...."

All flight attendants!?

 

[GuppyWN]

Well, I started yesterday. Knew about age 65, slow upward movement and the high oil prices being a bad thing all paired with merger prospects before I came.

Not for one second do I regret coming here.

Not trying to be a smartass but how many seconds are there in ONE DAY? Bro you haven't had long to look bad a ponder your decision yet.

Gup

 

[General Lee]

Not trying to be a smartass but how many seconds are there in ONE DAY? Bro you haven't had long to look bad a ponder your decision yet.

Gup

Well, look on the bright side. No Lubbock flying, no intra-Texas bounces, not many 5-6 leg days, and the chance to fly more than one type of plane for the rest of your life, along with route variety. I think he will be happy with his decision. How many seconds do you have to ponder your hunger between 25 minute turns? That would be 1500. And, how many times would you do that in a day? 6 times. Wow. That can make you dizzy I bet. And yeah, you were being a smartazz.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Gunfighter]

This is one of the most retarded explanations I've read in a long time. Ticket price is ticket price. It doesn't matter if you charge Euros, Dollars, Lira or Rupees.

Pick up an international finance book on your next layover. You may learn a thing or two. I know I did when I studied it in college.

Delta isn't "tricking" anyone into buying tickets. They have signficant demand for their international flights East of 0 Long. Those customers buy in Euros or other non US currency. A 500 Euro ticket converted to dollars is about $790 today. A month ago that same 500 Euro ticket was $735. Delta just benefited from a $55 fare increase without touching the ticket price. Do you really think they are lowering fares from Europe to the US, so they don't benefit from the declining dollar?

As the weak dollar makes international travel TO the US more appealing, the demand from foreign customers increases. This also decreases the demand for travel FROM the US which has a balancing effect on the overall demand.

 

[bleagle]

Pick up an international finance book on your next layover. You may learn a thing or two. I know I did when I studied it in college.

Delta isn't "tricking" anyone into buying tickets. They have signficant demand for their international flights East of 0 Long. Those customers buy in Euros or other non US currency. A 500 Euro ticket converted to dollars is about $790 today. A month ago that same 500 Euro ticket was $735. Delta just benefited from a $55 fare increase without touching the ticket price. Do you really think they are lowering fares from Europe to the US, so they don't benefit from the declining dollar?

As the weak dollar makes international travel TO the US more appealing, the demand from foreign customers increases. This also decreases the demand for travel FROM the US which has a balancing effect on the overall demand.

Currency conversion is NOTHING NEW... buffett, gates(to name a few) have done it to realize capital gains. BUT those capital gains are subject to taxation from the good ole US Gov. I just don't see how the international flying is going to be a huge factor in DAL "domination" when open skies will increase international competition as well as LCCs getting into the intl market...eventually. How will this DAL intl increase also thrive in extremely saturated NYC airports/airspace? Don't forget about Branson, Lufthansa and other foreign carriers... even RyanAir is planning on hitting american soil....

Stay tuned ...this will get interesting.

 

[General Lee]

Currency conversion is NOTHING NEW... buffett, gates(to name a few) have done it to realize capital gains. BUT those capital gains are subject to taxation from the good ole US Gov. I just don't see how the international flying is going to be a huge factor in DAL "domination" when open skies will increase international competition as well as LCCs getting into the intl market...eventually. How will this DAL intl increase also thrive in extremely saturated NYC airports/airspace? Don't forget about Branson, Lufthansa and other foreign carriers... even RyanAir is planning on hitting american soil....

Stay tuned ...this will get interesting.

Ryanair THREATENED to hit American soil, after the EU refused it the right to buy Aerlingus. They also stated they would use large Airbus planes, even though they are an all Boeing carrier. What about their current game plan in Europe? They fly to out of the way airports with little traffic and lower airport fees. Do you know of any current American airlines that are doing that? (Skybus?) How are they doing? Not gonna happen anytime soon. Nope. The influx of new carriers now seems to be on the "high priced" side---like EOS, Le Avion, Silverjet, and British Airways new "Openskies." Not much movement on the LCC side crossing the Atlantic.

As far as Branson and others getting more NYC slots? Unlikely. As I just stated, the airports all over NYC now are slotted. The main reason we wanted "openskies" was to get access to LHR, end of story. If we thought it would seriously hurt us, we would have fought it. The losers here are Branson, British Air, American Airlines, and United. They all lost the exclusivity of LHR. Where else can European Airlines go in the US that is highly coveted, at a large business center so you can charge high fares, and has room to fit new flights? (Gates, slots) Anywhere? Buehler? ORD? Nope. Any others that are lacking current service?

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Bavarian Chef]

Well, look on the bright side. No Lubbock flying, no intra-Texas bounces, not many 5-6 leg days, and the chance to fly more than one type of plane for the rest of your life, along with route variety. I think he will be happy with his decision. How many seconds do you have to ponder your hunger between 25 minute turns? That would be 1500. And, how many times would you do that in a day? 6 times. Wow. That can make you dizzy I bet. And yeah, you were being a smartazz.


Bye Bye--General Lee

Come on, what rational person, in this industry, in today's economy, believes anything management tells him/her in INDOC?

Let me guess, they still pulling the standard airline welcome aboard ... Management Pogue Addresses the Newhires: "Ladies and Gentlemen, in 25(30) years you will all be millionaires."

(insert raucous applause and lots of goosestepping)


You know -- you can agree with people sometimes. Go ahead. It'll will make you feel better.

Oh forget it. I know you are already gonna disagree with me, come up with 59 ways Delta and Delta alone is gonna take over the world and make its first flight to Uranus next year. I am already tired from having to read your post, and you haven't even posted it yet.

 

[Schiphol]

Come on, what rational person, in this industry, in today's economy, believes anything management tells him/her in INDOC?

Let me guess, they still pulling the standard airline welcome aboard ... Management Pogue Addresses the Newhires: "Ladies and Gentlemen, in 25(30) years you will all be millionaires."

(insert raucous applause and lots of goosestepping)


You know -- you can agree with people sometimes. Go ahead. It'll will make you feel better.

Oh forget it. I know you are already gonna disagree with me, come up with 59 ways Delta and Delta alone is gonna take over the world and make its first flight to Uranus next year. I am already tired from having to read your post, and you haven't even posted it yet.

I like JetBlue. Fewer hats. And you have free WiFi in your terminal.

I don't know WTF is up with our terminal. I feel like I just landed in late 1980's Compton everytime I come back from Europe.

I totally agree with my esteemed colleague the Kraut Cook...its going to be nothing but sunshine up the kazoo in indoc until they start furloughing.

 

[AA717driver]

OnYourSix--My money's on an asteroid AND the Yellowstone caldera blowing at the same time. Presto! The New Ice Age. Now Delta's REALLY screwed...

Is Delta the new Pan Am? Awesome Int'l. structure unsupported by domestic feed. Hummm...

Boy, I'd sure hate to leave a cushy corporate job to go to Delta. TC

 

[jke406]

Let me guess, they still pulling the standard airline welcome aboard ... Management Pogue Addresses the Newhires: "Ladies and Gentlemen, in 25(30) years you will all be millionaires."

If you work for Jet Blue, I seriously doubt you heard that at your indoc.

Sorry, couldn't resist.

 

[Schiphol]

OnYourSix--My money's on an asteroid AND the Yellowstone caldera blowing at the same time. Presto! The New Ice Age. Now Delta's REALLY screwed...

Is Delta the new Pan Am? Awesome Int'l. structure unsupported by domestic feed. Hummm...

Boy, I'd sure hate to leave a cushy corporate job to go to Delta. TC

Delta's domestic feed is very strong everywhere but JFK. However, codeshare gets the planes full-ish going out. I think the gauge into JFK from ATL and CVG may increase very soon, however.

I assure you everyone is sensitive to the pitfalls of Pan Am here...since we, uhhhhhh, bought them as they were failing.

 

[Tanker Clown]

Well, look on the bright side. No Lubbock flying, no intra-Texas bounces, not many 5-6 leg days, and the chance to fly more than one type of plane for the rest of your life, along with route variety. I think he will be happy with his decision. How many seconds do you have to ponder your hunger between 25 minute turns? That would be 1500. And, how many times would you do that in a day? 6 times. Wow. That can make you dizzy I bet. And yeah, you were being a smartazz.


Bye Bye--General Lee

Well, look on the the side of reality. Oil is through the roof, Delta isn't hedged well, the economy is in a recession, and they tend to hire till they furlough. Meanwhile, the 25 minute turn guys lead the industry in pay, are hedged well, and saw a recession a year ago.

If I were a new hire in one of these Delta classes I'd keep my resume updated.

 

[jke406]

Tanker Clown Meanwhile, the 25 minute turn guys lead the industry in pay, are hedged well, and saw a recession a year ago.

That will go away by time you're eligible to work there, lieutenant (assuming you could get hired).

Those SWA guys are going to take a pay cut in their next contract.

 

[Monster Buck]

I finally get it!!
I have been on these boards for years and always hated the negativity and bickering about whose better, who knows what is really going on.....and I now just figered it out. Its not just people being mean...its jealousy. Not about that someone else is at an airline that you want to be at, but they are at an airline and are HAPPY, HOPEFUL and trying to look at the bright side because they finally got to the pilot job they always wanted and are sick of the negativity and just want to be happy about it. But that is it exactly it, someone else is jealous about them being happy and it makes them feel better to say anything to bring them down. Misery loves company and jealousy rearing its ugly head, two sayings that sum up 95% of this board.

I am one that just got hired at Delta and can't wait to go to class. I pray they still keep going. Its been a long journey to get here, even if I get furloughed day one, I still will show up to class and take the recall years later. Thanks to the people that provide the other 5 percent, the info is helpful.