Major Least affected by 65 - PLZ HELP

[SRJ]

I am curious which airline is over the major attrition hump and has had a majority of the AGE 60 pilots already retire? This will help for future planning. Thanks

 

[B-atch]

Dude plan all you want....The end game will always be an enigma.

 

[Frequency]

usair? Im guessing all of their pilots are over 50+

 

[Yuppyguppy]

Well it ain't SWA nor is it DAL nor UAL

 

[Spooky 2]

I am curious which airline is over the major attrition hump and has had a majority of the AGE 60 pilots already retire? This will help for future planning. Thanks

Just worry about getting hired and forget about the small things, which by the way...this issue is when put into persective.

 

[Uniform Shop]

American is just starting their big wave of retirements and APA was the only union that was against age 65. You might actually see an increase in retirements over the next few months because of the fear that they might get penalized for retiring early if they retire at 60.

They still have their pension intact. I know I would bolt before they had a chance to change the wording in their contract if I still had a pension and was approaching 60.

 

[Uniform Shop]

Just worry about getting hired and forget about the small things, which by the way...this issue is when put into persective.

How can you say this is a small issue? I think this is a huge issue.

I don't think he would have posted that if he wasn't worried about getting hired. Don't you think this will have an effect on hiring?

 

[Patriot328]

Just worry about getting hired and forget about the small things, which by the way...this issue is when put into persective.

The hell it's not... If you are in your early 30s and have your CA upgrade pushed back 5 years, you will have to work, roughly, an extra 2 years to get the same amount of total pay over your career.

So, 2 more years for the same pay. That's two years of working for free.



And to the thread starter... EVERY operation will be affected by this decision. Some will feel it now, some will feel it 10 years from now when their list stagnates.

 

[SteelerMan]

Whoever is growing with additional aircraft. So whoever that ends up being when age 65 takes place.

 

[General Lee]

At Delta we lost 2300 Cpatians prior to BK due to the pensions. That made our group fairly young compared to others, with 1000 pilots over 50, which includes 500 over 55. Our current hiring spree is due to expansion, not retirements. We are growing and adding INTL routes fast, which require extra pilots. Other airlines, like CAL, are hiring due to expected retirements primarily. That could affect hiring there I would suppose. You have to look at why an airline is hiring, and if it is retirements, then hiring could slow, along with future upgrades. Delta will have less retirements now, but down the road growth could grind to a hault.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[CALDC9]

Just worry about getting hired and forget about the small things, which by the way...this issue is when put into persective.

Spooky2
wise words of experience

You can figure aviation will change at least 3 times
in 30 years.

1) start now, max your 401k

2) find a carrier with a define contribution plan, (B plan) that money is yours whatever happens.

3) LTD, enroll when you are hired

Do these, for your financial future

Take care,good luck

 

[hmmm]

What's a LTD

 

[Cardinal]

I am curious which airline is over the major attrition hump and has had a majority of the AGE 60 pilots already retire? This will help for future planning. Thanks

You can't escape it, so the question is irrellevant. "Pay me now or pay me later."

My line has very, very few pilots over the age of 50 right now. Age 65 will still screw our young guys, but the effects won't be felt until 10 years from now. A top heavy line like NWA will feel the 5 year stagnation immediately. A hypothetical airline that just had the "majority of age 60 pilots retire" wouldn't be more desirable, as with or without a change in the retirement age advancement will be slow. Yet Age 65 would still make it worse.

Age 65 will effect every airline, just at different times.

 

[optimater]

What's a LTD

A monster of a car made by Ford. http://flee.com/ltd/

or

Long Term Disability

 

[cargoflyr69]

A top heavy line like NWA will feel the 5 year stagnation immediately.

I'm not so sure about that. Over half of the pilots are over 50 at NWA. They were all on property thru the BK and have most of their pensions intact. There will be very little financial incentive for these guys to stay on.

For 30 somethigns like me, I think it will not really affect us too much. I'm a newhire and there is no A plan for me. The B plan is immediate 5% DC going to 8%. possibly more with the next contract. As I see it, with good 401K planning and the DC, I should be close to where I would have been with a pension. its the 40 somethings that really got the screw job if you ask me. They may have to stay to 65.

my .02

 

[thor2j]

At Delta we lost 2300 Cpatians prior to BK due to the pensions. That made our group fairly young compared to others, with 1000 pilots over 50, which includes 500 over 55. Our current hiring spree is due to expansion, not retirements. We are growing and adding INTL routes fast, which require extra pilots. Other airlines, like CAL, are hiring due to expected retirements primarily. That could affect hiring there I would suppose. You have to look at why an airline is hiring, and if it is retirements, then hiring could slow, along with future upgrades. Delta will have less retirements now, but down the road growth could grind to a hault.


Bye Bye--General Lee

Actually CAL is hiring due to mainly growth 3-4% and to a lesser extend retirements. 60+ new aircraft in next two years and only loosing 15 or so older aircraft.

 

[Furloughed80]

As thor2j said. Why can't you understand that CAL is growing. We seem to go over this every month.

 

[Hutchman]

Actually CAL is hiring due to mainly growth 3-4% and to a lesser extend retirements. 60+ new aircraft in next two years and only loosing 15 or so older aircraft.

Revision last week to 2-3% groth. Hiring cut 33%. This is before age 65. More to come.........

 

[Patriot328]

Revision last week to 2-3% groth. Hiring cut 33%. This is before age 65. More to come.........

I am hoping that the slow down in hiring is due to the 65 change....

 

[taysha]

IN a memo last month, APA mentioned Bush was suppose to veto this bill.

 

[Jim Smyth]

Just worry about getting hired and forget about the small things, which by the way...this issue is when put into persective.

Right on the mark Spooky! Get the job offer first, you may not have as many choices as you think. Then everything else will be sorted out.

 

[Jonny Sacko]

Table 1 – Actuarial Study of lifespan vs. age at retirement.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Age at……………………….Average Age
Retirement…………………….At Death
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
49.9………………………….86
51.2………………………….85.3
52.5………………………….84.6
53.8………………………….83.9
55.1………………………….83.2
56.4………………………….82.5
57.2………………………….81.4
58.3………………………….80
59.2………………………….78.5
60.1………………………….76.8
60……………………………74.5
62.1………………………….71.8
63.1………………………….69.3
64.1………………………….67.9
65.2………………………….66.8

 

[Wasthatforus?]

Well that table says it all! I am printing it and giving it to every Captain I fly with. It might help some guys to make a better decision on when to retire.

 

[Patriot328]

IN a memo last month, APA mentioned Bush was suppose to veto this bill.

That was the transportation bill, which included the age60 ruling. Bush isn't opposed to the age 60 rule, but had issues with other parts of the bill.

This will be signed. It passed the house and senate without a single no vote.


Of course, why would the congressmen vote no? They are the same age as the APAADs that pushed this through.

 

[FmrFreightDog]

What happened to Oberstar saying this would never be stand alone legislation? Didn't he say that?

 

[ivauir]

Just worry about getting hired and forget about the small things, which by the way...this issue is when put into persective.

This is the biggest thing to hit our careers since 9-11. It is a disaster for anyone in the right seat.

 

[IAHERJ]

This is the biggest thing to hit our careers since 9-11. It is a disaster for anyone in the right seat.

It is huge. Give all those SWA captains you fly with a big congradulations on a job well done. They pushed for this like no other group. I'd like to throw ALPA off property here at CAL right now for their support of this too.

 

[Hutchman]

I am hoping that the slow down in hiring is due to the 65 change....

No, this was because of the revision in growth due to high fuel costs. It came out before age 65 got slipped out of the appropriations bill. Expect a downward revision.

 

[Ex737Driver]

Other airlines, like CAL, are hiring due to expected retirements primarily.

Incorrect. The fleet of 737's is being mostly exchanged on a one for one basis but there is growth there as we have not allowed our 70+ seat flying to be farmed out to regionals. We currently have some of the best scope protection of any airline. Our growth remains in the same place that yours does, international. At CAL, management takes a little more reserved approach to starting a route vs rapid expansion that may or may not work. Our current deliveries for 787's stand at 25 with 25 options. We were just awarded LHR with four frequencies and Shanghi begins in 2009.

 

[Taildragon]

I had heard that almost 50% of pilots never make it to retire at age 60. This is b/c early retirement and medical, or other reasons.
I found this hard to believe, so I looked at the last 20 guys to leave (as Captains) and I kid you not it was almost dead on. 11 had retired and 9 had medicaled out.

Makes me wonder of the 50% that could have kept going how many would have? This sucks!