Anderson to be named CEO of Delta

[tomgoodman]

Excerpt from "Marketwatch"

FWIW:

Calyon Securities analyst Ray Neidl increased his rating on Delta Air Lines to add from neutral, saying the stock looks cheap if ticket prices rise, oil prices fall, or investors get excited about industry consolidation.
The management shifts at Delta suggest the Atlanta carrier "is seriously preparing for industry consolidation and this should excite the markets over the coming days," said Neidl in a note to investors.
He said Delta is probably more likely to be a seller than a buyer, and that its system would fit well with network carriers such as Northwest and UAL Corp.

 

[Vikedog64]

Well liked at NWA? Where on earth did you hear that? He was certainly not well liked by the rank and file. Maybe the board or some other anti labor groups at NWA liked him.

You all at NWA rarely like any CEO. I grew up in MN. and relationships with your management are legendary. Most of it to do with your management...

 

[Schwanker]

FWIW:

Calyon Securities analyst Ray Neidl increased his rating on Delta Air Lines to add from neutral, saying the stock looks cheap if ticket prices rise, oil prices fall, or investors get excited about industry consolidation.
The management shifts at Delta suggest the Atlanta carrier "is seriously preparing for industry consolidation and this should excite the markets over the coming days," said Neidl in a note to investors.
He said Delta is probably more likely to be a seller than a buyer, and that its system would fit well with network carriers such as Northwest and UAL Corp.

How could that be? I just read on FI that Delta would be the buyer! What does Neidl know?

Schwanker

 

[Noserider76]

There ain't gonna be any stinkin merger. The companies are too big and employee unrest on both sides would cause the creditors to fear the loss of their investment. DL will build their own Pacific network bypassing hubs like NRT and ICN with pt to pt service and the value of a linkup with Northwest will be negated.

 

[~~~^~~~]

I like that, of course 777's or 787's are needed to pull that off.

 

[bravodude]

I'm with the General on this one. If Anderson is as focused on the link between employees and customer experience as he is saying he is, he should know that letting NW takeover DL would be the new textbook example of how to ruin customer service overnight. I know very little about what is going on here, but I'd venture to bet that nothing will happen until the next downturn. That may be next year or it may be 5 years down the road. When that happens, I think DL will be one of the stronger airlines out there and will be in a position to pick up pieces of those airlines that don't make it if the government doesn't step in and prop up the weak guys. This could all change if Tilton can talk someone into buying UAL which may happen so it's anyones guess as to what will happen over the next couple of years.

Does anybody remember Dave Segul from continental or maybee it was coex. evrybody said all around great guy we were verry happy to have him at usair but i think everyone remembers what happened next.

 

[General Lee]

FWIW:

Calyon Securities analyst Ray Neidl increased his rating on Delta Air Lines to add from neutral, saying the stock looks cheap if ticket prices rise, oil prices fall, or investors get excited about industry consolidation.
The management shifts at Delta suggest the Atlanta carrier "is seriously preparing for industry consolidation and this should excite the markets over the coming days," said Neidl in a note to investors.
He said Delta is probably more likely to be a seller than a buyer, and that its system would fit well with network carriers such as Northwest and UAL Corp.

This is hillarious. If Gordon Bethune would have been given the job, these guys would have said there was NO DOUBT Delta was being bought by Continental. The thing is that M&A people (merger and acquisition) want to create buzz to get people thinking. Anderson used to run NWA, but left for better money at United Healthcare. He obviously made enough, or Delta offered him a lot. He did a good job at NWA, and will probably do a great job here. Ray Neidl also said the merger between USAir and Delta would happen. It did not.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[General Lee]

I like that, of course 777's or 787's are needed to pull that off.

We are getting 10 more 777s in the next 3 years, and looking for more on the used market. An announcement about any other new planes, like 787s, could come soon. The 767-300ERs will have to be replaced eventually I suppose.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[General Lee]

How could that be? I just read on FI that Delta would be the buyer! What does Neidl know?

Schwanker

"Delta is probably more likely to be a seller than a buyer"----Ray Neidl


And remember Ray Neidl did say Delta would "PROBABLY MORE LIKELY" which obviously means IT WILL HAPPEN.....

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[GogglesPisano]

Isn't there a website out there that scores analysts by their track record of correct vs incorrect predictions?

 

[HarryParatestes]

Anderson is a Jackass! I don't think there was any love lost at NWA when he left. UHC was glad he left too.

 

[michael707767]

The thing is that M&A people (merger and acquisition) want to create buzz to get people thinking.

I agree 100% with this statement. Keep in mind, the brokerage firms the analysts stand to make big money if a deal is done. Almost every analyst out there was saying how good a deal the USAir/Delta merger would have been. No doubt, it would have been a good deal for the financial people involved, but we need only look at the mess the USAr/AWA merger become to realize adding Delta to the mix would have made things worse.

Mergers may happen. But they don't need to happen. The only people who say that are the folks who stand to make money doing the deal.

 

[Truckdriver]

I agree 100% with this statement. Keep in mind, the brokerage firms the analysts stand to make big money if a deal is done. Almost every analyst out there was saying how good a deal the USAir/Delta merger would have been. No doubt, it would have been a good deal for the financial people involved, but we need only look at the mess the USAr/AWA merger become to realize adding Delta to the mix would have made things worse.

Mergers may happen. But they don't need to happen. The only people who say that are the folks who stand to make money doing the deal.

This is what people are questioning with Anderson. Is he going to stick to the plan that convinced the old board not to merge with LCC or was he put on the new board by the creditors so he would do what they wanted and get them their money? A merger may get them their money faster and some are saying that is what is playing out here. I agree that mergers don't need to happen. If the creditors want one, they now have a board that supports them and it looks like they now have a CEO that owes them for getting the job. I doubt that Anderson would fight like Jerry did to fend off a takeover that would benefit the creditors.

My personal thoughts are that his past track record shows he is a descent guy and usually those people tend to act the same way in different roles. He was well liked at NWA and UHC so I bet once the Delta people get to know him he will be well like here also. I believe him when he says he isn't here to facilitate a merger. It may happen down the road, but I don't think that was why he as chosen as the CEO.

 

[General Lee]

This is what people are questioning with Anderson. Is he going to stick to the plan that convinced the old board not to merge with LCC or was he put on the new board by the creditors so he would do what they wanted and get them their money? A merger may get them their money faster and some are saying that is what is playing out here. I agree that mergers don't need to happen. If the creditors want one, they now have a board that supports them and it looks like they now have a CEO that owes them for getting the job. I doubt that Anderson would fight like Jerry did to fend off a takeover that would benefit the creditors.

My personal thoughts are that his past track record shows he is a descent guy and usually those people tend to act the same way in different roles. He was well liked at NWA and UHC so I bet once the Delta people get to know him he will be well like here also. I believe him when he says he isn't here to facilitate a merger. It may happen down the road, but I don't think that was why he as chosen as the CEO.

I agree. He has made too many statements just to change his mind tomorrow. But, if there is another 9-11, or fuel shoots up to $100 a barrel, then maybe he might start looking into it. And, if consolidation does ever occur, I think NWA and DL would make a great combo. Little hub overlap and our route strengths would make us tough to beat worldwide. Certain points make it look not advantageous--like employee integration with unions and non union employees, and different fleet types--- although we at Delta had 13 fleet types at one time way back when. It could be done. Regardless, I don't see a merger happening anytime soon. Nah. Again, if Gordon Bethune was asked to take this job, the analysts would be saying Continental was preparing to buy us. Anderson took a better paying job at United Healthcare, and now wanted to get back into the airline business. That sounds plausible to me.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[~~~^~~~]

This is what people are questioning with Anderson. Is he going to stick to the plan that convinced the old board not to merge with LCC or was he put on the new board by the creditors so he would do what they wanted and get them their money? A merger may get them their money faster and some are saying that is what is playing out here.

Yeah, I think you are on it. Once Gordon Bethune was in the same position as Whitehurst, with a Board more interested in plotting an exit that would allow them to cash out, he said,

"An airline isn't a deal," he says. "It's a schedule of, like, 300 airplanes leaving at this time, getting there at that time, people loading the bags, showing up for work. If you've got a problem, the easiest way out is looking for the shortcut, with a lot of deals. But the business doesn't work that way."

The history of Continental and Delta's recent history have many similarities and this rather long article is an excellent read.

http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortune/fortune_archive/2004/10/18/8188058/index.htm

Delta's current plan is working and hopefully Anderson will stay the course. He says that he will, but has also made it clear that he is not on the job yet and has not had the opportunity to make his own assessments.

The creditors on the Delta Board are rumored to feel "screwed" by the decision not to cash out with US Air and Delta's stock has thus far not taken off as hoped. The pressure to sell Delta will likely be directly proportional to the market value of the company. If the Board feels that they are better off as stock holders, then they will be more inclined to keep their interests in Delta.

Of course, these same stake holders are partly to blame for the stock not performing. Those who had stock "given" to them have been cashing out and the selling has driven down the price. This will turn around as Delta establishes more of a track record and more buy and hold investors step up to the plate.

Objectively Delta stock should be performing well, much better than SKYW or other airlines that have had good runs on the market. If someone knew when the balance tips in Delta's favor, they could do very well in the market.... or a merger if you are an impatient Board Member.

As for Anderson himself, I think he knows who put him in power and will respect their direction. He also seems financially conservative, a discipline that Delta lacked at points in it's history - particularly under Mullin and Reid.

 

[Truckdriver]

Here is a great link to an interview with Gordon Bethune that was done in July. Some good info regarding mergers and why a CEO may not want to deal with a merger.

http://michaelmanning.tv/blog/2007/07/interview-gordon-bethune-part-1-of-2.html

Part 2

http://michaelmanning.tv/blog/2007_07_01_michaelmanning_archive.html

Gordon is always good for no nonsense information.

 

[General Lee]

Yeah, I think you are on it. Once Gordon Bethune was in the same position as Whitehurst, with a Board more interested in plotting an exit that would allow them to cash out, he said,
The history of Continental and Delta's recent history have many similarities and this rather long article is an excellent read.

http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortune/fortune_archive/2004/10/18/8188058/index.htm

Delta's current plan is working and hopefully Anderson will stay the course. He says that he will, but has also made it clear that he is not on the job yet and has not had the opportunity to make his own assessments.

The creditors on the Delta Board are rumored to feel "screwed" by the decision not to cash out with US Air and Delta's stock has thus far not taken off as hoped. The pressure to sell Delta will likely be directly proportional to the market value of the company. If the Board feels that they are better off as stock holders, then they will be more inclined to keep their interests in Delta.

Of course, these same stake holders are partly to blame for the stock not performing. Those who had stock "given" to them have been cashing out and the selling has driven down the price. This will turn around as Delta establishes more of a track record and more buy and hold investors step up to the plate.

Objectively Delta stock should be performing well, much better than SKYW or other airlines that have had good runs on the market. If someone knew when the balance tips in Delta's favor, they could do very well in the market.... or a merger if you are an impatient Board Member.

As for Anderson himself, I think he knows who put him in power and will respect their direction. He also seems financially conservative, a discipline that Delta lacked at points in it's history - particularly under Mullin and Reid.

Have you seen any large airline mergers lately? USAir and AWA come to mind, and that was allowed because they complemented each other. Most legacies do not, and have some overlap. That doesn't seem to make Congress or local politicians feel good. The creditors may not care, but the politicians do. It would have to be a deal that allowed virtually no overlap (like the US and AWA deal), and very little job loss (Congress could see right through Parker at USAir). That limits the potential deals, but NWA and DL might do the trick. Other legacies do not fit that mold, and will have a hard time through regulatory channels. You can't just merge two companies together anymore. Local interests will make too much noise.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[tomgoodman]

Excerpt from Forbes

Another FWIW:


The appointment of Anderson could mean more than just a big step in his personal resume: the job could also spell a significant shift in the U.S. airline sector.
Frank Boroch, an analyst at Bear Stearns, pointed out in a client note that Anderson ran Northwest for 13 years with Doug Steenland, currently the chief executive officer at Northwest.
"With an intimate knowledge of Northwest, Delta with Anderson at the helm could either be a difficult competitor or close partner," Boroch wrote. "Having two airline chiefs that understand one another may provide the best opportunity the industry has seen for reaching a friendly deal."
The analyst pointed out that Delta and Northwest both filed for bankruptcy on the same day in September 2005, and both emerged from Chapter 11 in the second quarter of 2007. Published reports back in January, Boroch wrote, indicated that the two airlines were in discussions about a possible combination.
If the two did decide to join forces, he observed, there would be lots of value to be had. Complimentary international routes and limited domestic overlap could make a compelling case for the partnership. The merger could create $5 billion in value, Boroch said.
He wrote that the combination would create a massive airline with global reach. Northwest could solve Delta's lack of a significant Asian presence quickly. In Europe, much of Delta's growth has centered on nontraditional European gateways, while Northwest mostly flies to major European hubs. Domestically, Boroch argued, there is no overlap between the carriers' top 20 city pairs.
--The Associated Press contributed to this article.

 

[General Lee]

Another FWIW:


The appointment of Anderson could mean more than just a big step in his personal resume: the job could also spell a significant shift in the U.S. airline sector.
Frank Boroch, an analyst at Bear Stearns, pointed out in a client note that Anderson ran Northwest for 13 years with Doug Steenland, currently the chief executive officer at Northwest.
"With an intimate knowledge of Northwest, Delta with Anderson at the helm could either be a difficult competitor or close partner," Boroch wrote. "Having two airline chiefs that understand one another may provide the best opportunity the industry has seen for reaching a friendly deal."
The analyst pointed out that Delta and Northwest both filed for bankruptcy on the same day in September 2005, and both emerged from Chapter 11 in the second quarter of 2007. Published reports back in January, Boroch wrote, indicated that the two airlines were in discussions about a possible combination.
If the two did decide to join forces, he observed, there would be lots of value to be had. Complimentary international routes and limited domestic overlap could make a compelling case for the partnership. The merger could create $5 billion in value, Boroch said.
He wrote that the combination would create a massive airline with global reach. Northwest could solve Delta's lack of a significant Asian presence quickly. In Europe, much of Delta's growth has centered on nontraditional European gateways, while Northwest mostly flies to major European hubs. Domestically, Boroch argued, there is no overlap between the carriers' top 20 city pairs.
--The Associated Press contributed to this article.

Tom,

Each one of these analysts also thought USAir would prevail with Delta. Didn't happen. Yes, Anderson knows something about NWA---he did work there for 14 years. Does that mean we shouldn't hire him? Gordon Bethune worked at CAL, and had we hired him speculation would have revolved around a potential CAL hookup with Delta. Anderson was on CNBC and other media outlets saying emphatically that he was NOT brought in to facilitate a merger or acqisition with NWA and Delta. He knows a bunch of people over there, but he also knows a bunch at UHC. I guess we could be the first merger between a large health care company and an airline. Keep the speculation up though, and keep subscribing to Forbes and Fortune, etc. They love your business. But, this article you provided did show that a possible hook up could lack overlap, which would allow it less scrutiny in Congress. That still doesn't mean Anderson was brought in to facilitate that.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[michael707767]

Complimentary international routes and limited domestic overlap could make a compelling case for the partnership. The merger could create $5 billion in value, Boroch said.

what a load of crap. Same kind of crap coming out of Parkers mouth.

Lets see, take an airline with a market cap of 4.4 billion, merge it with and airline with a market cap of 3.6 billion, trim out some of the overlap, ground a few planes, etc, and suddenly you have a new airline worth 13 billion? Does this make sense to anyone?

A Delta/NW merger would create some value, and would likely be worth more than the sum of its parts. But to say it would create 5 billion in value is not just pushing things, it's an outright lie.

 

[tomgoodman]

Listen to the analysts or toss a coin

... this article you provided did show that a possible hook up could lack overlap, which would allow it less scrutiny in Congress.

General,

That's one of the reasons I posted the excerpt -- Boroch makes some of the same points you did about the "fit". He seems less speculative than Neidl, but I wouldn't bet on any analyst's predictions. For every one that just said "buy", there's another who just said "sell". I also don't think Anderson's current statements or intentions have much bearing on whether or not a merger eventually occurs. Unlike Jerry, he's just an employee of the BOD, and will do their bidding or follow Leo out the door. CEOs say what they have to at any given time -- we've both seen that recently enough!

Wishing all the best to my friends who are still at the Widget.

 

[michael707767]

I also don't think Anderson's current statements or intentions have much bearing on whether or not a merger eventually occurs.

I agree. Nothing he says right now gives any real hint to what will happen in the future.

I will say this, while I don't want to merge with anyone (actually I take that back. I think a Delta/Alaska merger would be a great fit and good for both sides) I don't fear a Delta/NWA merger. Unlike Delta/USAirways, DAL/NWA makes sense, has very little overlap and could very well produce an airline where the total is greater than the sum of its parts.

Delta/USAirways made no sense and the employees on both sides would have paid a heavy price.

 

[tomgoodman]

Skeptical about a merger

Yet another FWIW, from The Street.com:

Unlike Parker, Anderson will likely be spared the burden of merging two distinct airline cultures. Sure, his Northwest connection has sparked a merger gabfest, but it is no different from the one that accompanied the same-day bankruptcy filings of Delta and Northwest in 2005. Wasn't this merger allegedly supposed to be done by now?

 

[Diesel-9]

Only if someone else gets the merger ball rolling. Then this will become a probability. UAL will initiate the Big Bang due to Tilton's desire, incompetence and hope to haul more loot out of the airline business than he did the oil business. Mr. Anderson will be a good candidate to run the combined NWA/DAL if it comes to that. It would be a dominant company. And the hard part of finding a good CEO is already done.

 

[NuGuy]

Only if someone else gets the merger ball rolling. Then this will become a probability. UAL will initiate the Big Bang due to Tilton's desire, incompetence and hope to haul more loot out of the airline business than he did the oil business. Mr. Anderson will be a good candidate to run the combined NWA/DAL if it comes to that. It would be a dominant company. And the hard part of finding a good CEO is already done.

Heyas Diesel,

Probably true. I don't think anything will happen unless someone else pulls the trigger first.

Interesting thing, though...NWA has had a "poison pill" in place since the emergence from BQ, and DAL does not, so DAL will most likely be the target, rather than the suitor.

Also, NWA still has the "golden share" in CAL, and will require high tribute before they give it up.

They bagged MEH. The only thing left for their whole "North Border" motif would be a play for Alaska.

While some would disagree, Anderson was considered with respect by most at NWA. For a NWA CEO, that was the same as a parade. The DAL boys got the better end of the deal on that one.

So it seems all roads DO go through Mecca. GO figure...

Nu

 

[gutshotdraw]

Heyas Diesel,

Probably true. I don't think anything will happen unless someone else pulls the trigger first.

Interesting thing, though...NWA has had a "poison pill" in place since the emergence from BQ, and DAL does not, so DAL will most likely be the target, rather than the suitor.

Also, NWA still has the "golden share" in CAL, and will require high tribute before they give it up.

They bagged MEH. The only thing left for their whole "North Border" motif would be a play for Alaska.

While some would disagree, Anderson was considered with respect by most at NWA. For a NWA CEO, that was the same as a parade. The DAL boys got the better end of the deal on that one.

So it seems all roads DO go through Mecca. GO figure...

Nu

Well said Nu.

The only thing I would add is the fact that the landing rights in Japan are in Northwest's name and must remain so. If a deal were to happen, I think it would be Northwest Holdings buying Delta. The post-merger management team would be led by Anderson and much of the Delta team with the new carrier ultimately being flagged as Delta because of a (marginally) better service reputation. Anderson's presence would soften resistance to the deal among Northwest employees and the idea of keeping Delta's name on the door clears the way with the General Lee types. Since the carrier would be nominally owned by Northwest Holdings, the Japan rights remain in place. The deal would probably pass DOJ muster because of limited system overlap. Frankensteenland cashes in again (which has always been his goal) and is sent on down the road shortly after closing (cheers all around). Aside from the gigantic culture clash between the double-breasted jacket and hat types versus the leather jackets and uncovered heads in Minni, I think Delta/NWA actually makes some sense. Ultimately, I figure the deal is about even money, or maybe 3-2 against.

 

[NuGuy]

Hi Gut,

Yup. I see that playing out as well. Probably keep the DAL name, but it would be the NWA certificate due to the fifth freedom issues, sort of like the Valujet/Airtran deal.

The actual Northwest name would proably go to Compass, which would torque off the RB guys to no end...so maybe there IS a silver lining after all...

Nu

 

[Heavy Set]

Well said Nu.

The only thing I would add is the fact that the landing rights in Japan are in Northwest's name and must remain so. If a deal were to happen, I think it would be Northwest Holdings buying Delta. The post-merger management team would be led by Anderson and much of the Delta team with the new carrier ultimately being flagged as Delta because of a (marginally) better service reputation. Anderson's presence would soften resistance to the deal among Northwest employees and the idea of keeping Delta's name on the door clears the way with the General Lee types. Since the carrier would be nominally owned by Northwest Holdings, the Japan rights remain in place. The deal would probably pass DOJ muster because of limited system overlap. Frankensteenland cashes in again (which has always been his goal) and is sent on down the road shortly after closing (cheers all around). Aside from the gigantic culture clash between the double-breasted jacket and hat types versus the leather jackets and uncovered heads in Minni, I think Delta/NWA actually makes some sense. Ultimately, I figure the deal is about even money, or maybe 3-2 against.

That is a big myth. That never happened when Air Canada bought Canadian Airlines. Air Canada got the rights to NRT as long as they kept the service current during the transaction and didn't take the flying for themselves prior to the close of the deal. United also got the Pan Am rights to Asia when they bought them. Northwest does NOT have to keep their name. Northwest also changed it's name from Northwest Orient to Northwest, and I think the Orient part was on the "deed" when they signed way back when. I see Delta possibly buying Northwest and keeping the Atlanta hub as headquarters if some sort of merger wave starts. Northwest employees would also rather have Delta management (not Steenland) running the show, so it would be a smoother transition if Delta ran the show.

 

[NuGuy]

That is a big myth. That never happened when Air Canada bought Canadian Airlines. Air Canada got the rights to NRT as long as they kept the service current during the transaction and didn't take the flying for themselves prior to the close of the deal. United also got the Pan Am rights to Asia when they bought them. Northwest does NOT have to keep their name. Northwest also changed it's name from Northwest Orient to Northwest, and I think the Orient part was on the "deed" when they signed way back when. I see Delta possibly buying Northwest and keeping the Atlanta hub as headquarters if some sort of merger wave starts. Northwest employees would also rather have Delta management (not Steenland) running the show, so it would be a smoother transition if Delta ran the show.

Actually, NWA's rights are considerably different than the others that you mention, for a number of reasons. Occam actually has all the details, but to make it brief, NWA's rights stem directly from a post war treaty with Japan that tie the rights directly to the operating certificate (the name on which may change, or be ammended to a DBA). It is the nature of this certificate that gives NWA it's fifth freedom rights out of NRT, meaning it can solicit "local" passengers to points beyond NRT, not simply back to the US. This makes NWA, in essence, a "domestic" Japanese carrier out of NRT (if fact, all NWA business in Asia is conducted in yen).

So while the name on the certificate may change, these rights (both cargo and pax), per treaty, are tied directly to the actual air carrier certificate.

Nu

 

[Heavy Set]

Actually, NWA's rights are considerably different than the others that you mention, for a number of reasons. Occam actually has all the details, but to make it brief, NWA's rights stem directly from a post war treaty with Japan that tie the rights directly to the operating certificate (the name on which may change, or be ammended to a DBA). It is the nature of this certificate that gives NWA it's fifth freedom rights out of NRT, meaning it can solicit "local" passengers to points beyond NRT, not simply back to the US. This makes NWA, in essence, a "domestic" Japanese carrier out of NRT (if fact, all NWA business in Asia is conducted in yen).

So while the name on the certificate may change, these rights (both cargo and pax), per treaty, are tied directly to the actual air carrier certificate.

Nu

Is this different than the Pan Am and UAL transaction? I know NW flies some flights from NRT to Nagoya and onto Saipan (flight 77 I believe), etc, but those flights do NOT have paying passengers deplaning in Nagoya. NWA is really not a domestic passenger airline in Japan as you have stated. You guys can stop in Nagoya on the way to another point, but not take passengers between those domestic cities. UAL also has a NRT base that can connect passengers to other Asian cities, and they purchased the rights from Pan Am and changed the name. Can you or Oscam show me the difference between the Pan Am and United transaction and possible Delta and NW transaction and why a name transfer could be done with the first but not the second?

From my understanding the incumbant rights are transferrable by the US government to any USA Flag carrier, and the slots are held by the foreign government. Slots can be transferred at will, as Delta did to Fedex back in 2002 when they gave up their slots they initially used for PDX--NRT. The Japanese government approved that deal, and probably would approve others.