Any mil guys ever resign from a major airline furloughed or not?

[NewmanF16]

QOL is everything, IMHO. I have 16+ years of active service, the last 5 as an AGR, and I'm going to part time status. The reserve job sucked the life out of me and my family. I'll finish my 20 in part time status, and I'm going to work for an aircraft manufacturer where I will have more time for my kids and have fun at work again.

There is not exactly job security in the guard/reserve or defense industry, either, today. My unit shut down and displaced 500+ people. I've seen sim operator contracts change hands every three years or so, although usually the jobs stay, your employer just changes.

I'm saying all of this not to be the wet towel, but to piggyback on another comment above. Life is a marathon, so make sure your looking far down the road. If the lifestyle of a legacy captain (notice I didn't say pay) is worth the short term sacrifice, then seniority is everything and you need to stay put, if not, go for CAE, but don't expect it to be the last job you ever have.

QOL, not $$ is driving fighter pilots out of the AF in droves. Guys are being crushed at work--and not from deployments. Airline schedules are actually a pretty good break and a huge improvement in QOL for most. YMMV. Good Luck!

 

[bagasticks]

I think newman hit it right on. . . . .Quality of Life. . . if you enjoy all of those things you listed, and they are more important to you than perhaps (and I stress perhaps) 200k a year. . .maybe. . .someday. . Than you should definately go for the 9-5 gig.

I have always been traditional and have never played the airline gig (always been corporate). I would'nt trade the football coaching, softball, deer hunting, drag racing or anything else my family and I enjoy for any amount of money. You only get one go at this gig, no pressure right? ?

 

[Pistlpetet]

If you are going to pull the plug on your airline job. Why don't you give them some bogus call to active duty orders. Keeps the door open.

I have one friend who has done that for four years while he worked different contracts around the world. Now after he made a lot of money he is back flying for that airline.

Another friend who has never even been in the military was put on mil leave by the airline that furloughed just because he was flying as a GOV contractor OCONUS. Now he does not have to go back until he wants to.

If you ain't cheatin you ain't trying.

 

[NewmanF16]

If you are going to pull the plug on your airline job. Why don't you give them some bogus call to active duty orders.

It's that going to jail thing that would dissuade me...(besides the obvious morale implications).

 

[KCPilot]

Just watch out for any future BRACs. My unit is to close next fall. As an ART Officer my opitions are 1. To go where the company tells me (you only get one choice/chance) or not have a job or 2. Find a new job on my own. Well I went with #2 and will be leaving the ART program at the end of this week for the airlines.

I miss the QOL I had 2+ years ago before the BRAC and I'm hoping I'll get it back in the future. If not, maybe 5 years from now I'll stock the shelves at Home Depot!

 

[Foties]

Pilots are smart. What entrepenuerial ventures are you in?

Everyone has truly provided an amazing perspective. I hope it has helped others as well that may have airline hopes or need to make a tough decision like this..

I think a few points seem to prevail:

It's all a gamble

The $$ may improve at airlines, but I am convinced it will cost us a continued degraded QOL (Perspective is everything but I fly with senior Captains, that still make good cash but they all hate being a slave and working so much harder than they did before and now they are unhappy).

Airlines are a fit for some and others should truly do their due diligence before they make the leap.

Take pride in serving your country but take mil leave honestly and morally. Those that abuse it truly affect a ton of mil / airline guys. My company has changed the way we request mil leave 2 times since I have been here making it harder to do. They are walking a fine line but still are legal at this point.

So here is my final question for the night. I hear of entrepreneurial pilots that do very well with other ventures. Some do so well they become financially free and continue to fly for fun with no worries of them losing their jobs. What have / are you doing to be in more control and insure yourself from losing your airline job?

 

[NewmanF16]

I run a software development company with my wife (I'm the businessman, she runs the technical end with two other employees). That works well for me, because it only requires part time effort on my part. Others have done real estate (bad time for that right now).

 

[bagasticks]

If you are going to pull the plug on your airline job. Why don't you give them some bogus call to active duty orders. Keeps the door open.

I have one friend who has done that for four years while he worked different contracts around the world. Now after he made a lot of money he is back flying for that airline.

Another friend who has never even been in the military was put on mil leave by the airline that furloughed just because he was flying as a GOV contractor OCONUS. Now he does not have to go back until he wants to.

If you ain't cheatin you ain't trying.

perhaps you are kidding, i dont know but seems kinda shady considering our kids (E-1's on food stamps) are over there getting shot in the face by bad guys and your talking about "faking" active duty to maintain that "airline captain" lifestyle. . .

 

[Fedora]

Well, Foties, good thread here.
It sounds to me from the sound of your posts, that you have made up your mind to leave but just don't know it yet. You can tell from the various posters here that it always comes down to a very personal choice that only you the right answer to. Airline flyin' is not for everyone and that's a fact. The first year or so out of the military is a big adjustment is also a fact. I've seen guys get out to become teachers, ministers, construction workers, you name it.
While the thread here is going to get all kinds of viewpoints and suggestions, in the end it will come down to what is right for you and your family, and only you can make that call.
Good luck in whatever you decide.

 

[bearcat]

The grass is not always a different color on the other side. I could not deal with the BS at the squadron on a dialy basis. If your looking for a quick fix or instant gratification then mabye you should quit. This job is way too easy for me to go to a ART job. I guess it depends on who you work of also. Remember this industry is a marathon not a sprint.

Shack reddog.....the politics drive me crazy. Remeber the best part of that airline job is when you park the jet, the job doesn't exist until you come back. I personally like the break up of schedules. I'm climbing the walls on orders right now and I cannot wait to getback to the airline. Well not exactly, but I am looking forward to it. The Tech job is a good deal, but remember what you are not gaining in your 401K and B plan if they exist. You can back contribute. How long before you get a Tech retirement? Are you step 5?? Most of us (myself included) type A's are never happy. Make sure you step back and look at the big picture

 

[bearcat]

perhaps you are kidding, i dont know but seems kinda shady considering our kids (E-1's on food stamps) are over there getting shot in the face by bad guys and your talking about "faking" active duty to maintain that "airline captain" lifestyle. . .

FOUL bags. YGBSM. If I knew someone that did that I would knock him on his a$$.

 

[learflyer]

You are right an ART/civil service jobs are not acceptable for mil leave at my company, so taking mil leave is just not that easy. I have already done 2 years AD for the current war and am basically timed out for the time being unless I get an AGR job which is very rare.

To add to that the sim instructor job I am describing is a contractor job (CAE)and has nothing to do with active duty and civil service.

By no means am I here to knock guys that love the airlines but I personally think it is god awful boring. When the stuff hits the fans we definitely make our $$ but there is no challenge 99% of the time. I know sim instructing would be god awful boring at times as well but my point is even with some seniority, you never have 100% control of your life. I worked my butt off as a guard technician, but I also had way more fun. As a very competitive and active person I can't even commit to a mens softball/baseball team for years to come due to my unreliable schedule.

I have a buddy that quit United at age 45, became a fireman and couldn't be happier. I have also heard a few stories of guys that started businesses while furloughed that won't go back as well.

I just wanna hear if there are any more guys that haven't gone back / resigned.

Hi Foties. I'm not a Military guy, but I can certainly relate on this topic. I was at the Fractionals for 6 years. The last few years of it, I couldn't bear the thought of leaving my wife, dogs, for 8 days anymore. yes, I had 7 off on the other side, but all I could think of on my 7 off was going back for 8 again. So I eventually resigned and got a job as a Sim/ground instructor. I'm trying to find things that suck about it but I can't! My QOL sky-rocketed, and I'm making more than I ever had flying. We know our schedule a week in advance instead of a day in advance, and for me, I can handle that.

I love walking to my fridge and getting a soda, not walking down some hotel room corridor and paying 1.50 for one. I love being able to play softball/Flag football again. I love some days only being 3 hours long. It ain't perfect, but i'm happier than I was flying. By the way, the job keeps me current in TWO jets, and I still fly contract WHEN I WANT TO!

 

[satpak77]

call this guy

call a guy named Kit Darby, he will tell you exactly what you should do with your life, and he will predict into the future how much your Airline pension should be worth. Someone might tell him airline pensions don't exist anywhere (FDX maybe).

But Darby will still go ahead and help you out with your life.

Why stop at $110,000 a year with a secure govt job and weekends off and some politics when you can roll the dice on the Airline roulette wheel and possibly end up at X Airline that never furloughed in the past, such as Delta? Any mope knows that "past performance is not indicative of future results."

But Delta never furloughed before, so they will never ever furlough ever again. Or at least until a few years back, when thousands were on the street. Oops. That ole roulette wheel didn't really work out like we planned it or how Kit Darby told me it would.

Such a dice roll could result in $220,000 a year as Captain (never mind time to Captain at most majors is 7-10 years min, that is 7-10 years being not-a-Captain) at these majors. And of course not one airline job had labor issues, strife, or politics. Just pull up to the jet-bridge, parking brake on, and you are done until you come back to the jet! Whatever happens at work, you can absolutely guaranteed not bring it home or deal with it off work. 100% Guarantee.

Hey, its your life, your family. You get issued one life coming out of the womb.

How you play the cards is up to you.

 

[bagasticks]

FOUL bags. YGBSM. If I knew someone that did that I would knock him on his a$$.

FOUL on me? I dont roll like that. . I get activated enough without creating "bogus" orders. .

 

[Tnkr Pilot]

Foties,

I just made the big decision to go Govt job and hope it's the right one. It will be a non-flying career, but deals with aviation and something I like to do. I am praying I can get hired by a Reserve unit in the same town/same AC I fly now as an IP. I want to continue to serve and fly. QOL for my family trumped possible $$ earnings for me at this time in my life, and time will tell if it was the right choice...I look at it this way, I didn't have to sign a 9 year contract to give it shot like UPT, and will make the same $$ as on AD. Make a decision move forward and excel...wait a minute did the UPS window just open?!? Good luck!!!