Continental Express FA kicks mother and child off Houston flight.

[El-Rushbo]

http://www.wsbtv.com/news/13664685/detail.html

POSTED: 4:51 pm EDT July 11, 2007
UPDATED: 8:21 pm EDT July 11, 2007

GWINNETT COUNTY, Ga. -- A Gwinnett County mother says she wants answers and action after she and her baby were kicked off a plane.
Kate Penland said she was glad to board the plane in Houston after an 11-hour delay to visit her father in Oklahoma. But she said a rude and aggressive flight attendant caused her to get to Oklahoma a day late.
Penland thinks her 19-month-old son, Garren, has a bubbly personality. But Penland said when they were aboard a Continental Express plane, a flight attendant became annoyed by Garren’s personality when he kept saying three words.
“As we started taxiing, he started saying ‘Bye, bye plane,’ said Penland. “At the end of her speech, she leaned over the gentleman beside me and said, ‘It’s not funny anymore. You need to shut your baby up.’
In disbelief, Penland asked the woman if she was kidding. It was then, Penland said, the flight attendant went too far.
“She then said, ‘You know, it’s called baby Benadryl. And I said, 'Well, I'm not going to drug my child so you have a pleasant flight.'
Penland said when the other passengers began speaking up on her behalf, the flight attendant got angrier and soon announced they were turning around and that Penland and Garren were going to be taken off the plane.
“I was crying, I was upset and I was thinking, ‘What am I going to do? I don’t have anything with me, I don’t have anymore diapers for the baby, no juice, no milk,” said Penland.
The young mother said she later learned the flight attendant told the pilot that she had threatened her. Penland said that never happened.
Express Jet Airlines released a statement that said, "We received Ms. Penland’s letter expressing her concerns and intend to investigate its contents."
A fellow passenger told Channel 2's Rachel Kim none of the other passengers had problems with Garren and that Penland never threatened the flight attendant.
Penland is considering legal action.

 

[John Pennekamp]

Typically, when this sort of thing happens, the passengers side of the story is very different from the crewmember's. The passengers tend to say they did nothing and the "rude FA" was to blame. This has been the case every time I've kicked someone off my plane. The passenger always tries to lie their way out of it.

We may never know what really happened in this incident unless we were there. No point debating it.

 

[El-Rushbo]

The article clearly states that the other passengers were not upset and the passengers have verified that the mother made no threats to the FA.

My vote goes to the mother and child unless there is additional evidence to support the FA's side.

 

[John Pennekamp]

The article clearly states that the other passengers were not upset and the passengers have verified that the mother made no threats to the FA.

My vote goes to the mother and child unless there is additional evidence to support the FA's side.

Just because the other pax took her side, doesn't mean it happened that way.

As a captain, I take my FA's side. Let them sort out the details later.

 

[Captain Overs]

Why is this on the major boards. Shouldn't it be in the Regional?

 

[27 driver]

Just because the other pax took her side, doesn't mean it happened that way.

As a captain, I take my FA's side. Let them sort out the details later.

I tend to agree with you JP and will stand behind my crew, but you were locked up front and really have no idea what happened. If there are many other passengers stating that the FA was out of bounds then that was probably the case. I am a flight crew member and have seen it many times dealing with some of these old hags that think the passengers are a nuisance rather than the reason they have a job. If that FA did kick her off for no reason there will be repercussions for her and the airline.

 

[Blucher]

I find it most interesting that a woman from Gwinnett, GA was flying "Continental Express." To me, that speaks volumes.

-Blucher

 

[Tejas-Jet]

Typically, when this sort of thing happens, the passengers side of the story is very different from the crewmember's. The passengers tend to say they did nothing and the "rude FA" was to blame. This has been the case every time I've kicked someone off my plane. The passenger always tries to lie their way out of it.

We may never know what really happened in this incident unless we were there. No point debating it.

Really??? In my experience, I have seen no shortage of passengers who are more than willing to be witnesses when someone was taken off the airplane doe to weird/bad/obnoxious behavior....in this case, it's just the opposite.

In my years working for a legacy carrier, I had seen F/A's treat passengers like they were the "enemy". With that kind of attitude, I'm not surprised at the recent Bankruptcies. It's pretty obvious that this F/A feels the same way.

Lets not forget, these passengers have choices on where they spend their money.

 

[Amish RakeFight]

The young trailer park mom strikes again...

 

[Deuce130]

The young trailer park mom strikes again...

You obviously didn't watch the video. She's young, definitely, but she lives in a nice house, nice yard, well done up, cute kid, well cared for. Somehow I don't think she's what you have in mind. Looks to me like another case of mean ol' battleaxe FA striking again. And another reason the pax carriers are getting slammed on a daily basis. Captain should have asked what was going on before kicking anyone off. You can back your crew whenever you want, but you should at least make sure they're in the right first. I side with the mom on this one.

 

[Secret Squirrel]

So deuce what would you do. Interview the lady and when she denies it let her stay on the flight? With the same FA? Even though your FA said the lady threatened her? Maybe the witnesses were all traveling together with the lady. I would have to side with my flight crew. There was some sort of disturbance and at this point I would say the lady has to go or your FA has to. The last thing I want is to allow the lady to stay on board and have some sort of confrontation erupt and have to divert.

You can not judge a person by their home or how they dress. Some of the biggest dirtbags drive BMW's and live in the best neighborhoods.

 

[pianoman]

I think the lady was probably in the right. Had I been up front, though, I would have done what this captain did. Believe the FA, and then if something happens down the road it's her fault for lying to you and not yours.

 

[NEDude]

I can't speak specifically for ExpressJet, but given the quality of flight attendants at most regional airlines these days, I would tend to side with the passenger. Most regional FAs are pretty bad in my experience.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Let's resurrect the same issue on Airtran... where is that thread??

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

I think the lady was probably in the right. Had I been up front, though, I would have done what this captain did. Believe the FA, and then if something happens down the road it's her fault for lying to you and not yours.

Then you show the FA that she can do a poor job and get away with it, she might even take it to the next level...knowing she has carte blanc..... exercise some leadership man!!! It is better to be respected than liked...

 

[Stifler's Mom]

Some of the biggest dirtbags drive BMW's and live in the best neighborhoods.

So you've been to Peachtree City too?

 

[~~~^~~~]

These FA's have a very tough job, particularly on something as small as an E145 where there is no room to decompress. Some are bound to snap with all the difficulties of the position.

As a Captain I would hesitate before considering a Mom and an two year old a "threat" and try to calm the situation down. But, if the flight attendant can not work with the problem passengers the airplane can operate without the two year old & Mom. It can't operate without the Flight Attendant. At some point pragmatism makes sense for the other 48 people on the airplane.

 

[Hagar17]

Incidents like this are why I've never liked the single flight attendant crews that you usually see on the RJs;

one petite female in the back with 50 pax.....

 

[~~~^~~~]

one petite female in the back with 50 pax.....

Obviously you have never flown my airline. Most of them over heat the trim motor whenever they do a walk through.

It is the guys with 45 pieces of "flair" that you have to worry about getting beat up.

 

[clickclickboom]

I have had numerous situations where our 20 something single flight attendants and felch fest male fa's have bitched moaned and complained a whole flight about the " Rude mother in seat 5A with her 3 kids trashing the plane on a transcon"

Let me start by saying that I will give the benefit of the doubt to any parent traveling with small children as it can be a borderline nightmare on a perfect day..

They have no concept of the energy that can go into caring for children 24/7..

I would have consulted the other Fa's or spoken with the woman myself before i kicked a mother and a kid off a plane

 

[igneousy2]

If it's the same "witnesses" that have been on my airplanes at my past 3 airlines I would say that the "witnesses" didn't see jack...they were all sitting there reading their newspaper and maybe they hear a comotion in the seat in front...by the time they look up after taking a sip of their coffee all they see is a pissed-off flight attendant belittliing a "poor innoccent passenger." Then they get word that now they have to go back to the gate! Now they are really pissed. Now when the media asks "was this poor little lady and baby bothering you" they answer No! we should of continued to Twidledum, GA because this poor lady wasn't doing anything that justified her getting kicked off.

As far as the Captain kicking the passenger off! I say absolutely! As far as "questioning" the flight attendant before making the decision. Beyond "this lady threatned me" what more do you want? She says she wants them off, they are off.

There is only one FA in the back of these airplanes and if your one crewmember (eyes and ears) can't handle the situation, regardless of the reason she can't handle the situation (her bitchy attitude pax fault whatever) and she wants them off then they are off; period. If the situation gets any worse the first you are going to hear about it is when you open the door at your destination and go to bitch her out for not bringing you your coffee at cruise and you find her knocked out in the aisle because the ladies boyfriend got fed up and knocked her out.

If it turns out that it is the fault of the flight attendant then MANAGEMENT will deal with her. If it turns out to be the FA's fault then to prevent further problems MANAGEMENT can either A. - hire better flight attendants, or B. - treat the FA's better to prevent bitchy attitudes.

In either case - not the Captains problem. Captain had a safety issue - FA can't do her job because of pax - solution: get pax off. Done. Nice job Captain. This is a difficult situation only if you think your job is larger than it is.

Later

 

[Deuce130]

So deuce what would you do. Interview the lady and when she denies it let her stay on the flight? With the same FA? Even though your FA said the lady threatened her? Maybe the witnesses were all traveling together with the lady. I would have to side with my flight crew. There was some sort of disturbance and at this point I would say the lady has to go or your FA has to. The last thing I want is to allow the lady to stay on board and have some sort of confrontation erupt and have to divert.

You can not judge a person by their home or how they dress. Some of the biggest dirtbags drive BMW's and live in the best neighborhoods.

Just what I said I would do - find out what was going on and decide accordingly. Simply hearing "she threatened me," wouldn't do it. I'm not saying the FA didn't explain herself to the CA - I don't know what she said. I do know, however, that if I were the CA and the FA explained the story the way the passenger explained it, there wouldn't have been anyone kicked off the plane. And, as a decent human being, I would sure as heck get the facts straight before I booted a mom and toddler off the jet and back to the terminal. That's why the CA gets paid the big bucks.

 

[Deuce130]

If it turns out that it is the fault of the flight attendant then MANAGEMENT will deal with her. If it turns out to be the FA's fault then to prevent further problems MANAGEMENT can either A. - hire better flight attendants, or B. - treat the FA's better to prevent bitchy attitudes.

In either case - not the Captains problem. Captain had a safety issue - FA can't do her job because of pax - solution: get pax off. Done. Nice job Captain. This is a difficult situation only if you think your job is larger than it is.

Later

Sounds like you may be better suited for a job in MANAGEMENT. Either that, or MANAGEMENT needs to C) Hire Captains who can think and make decisions without emotion. Anything that happens on an airplane is the Captain's problem. I figured you'd learn that after three airlines.

 

[Charlie Brown]

I actually laughed when I heard this on the local news last night. Keep in mind I live 800 miles from IAH.

In any case, I can see countless FA's that I flew with saying those things to a mother, or any other passenger for that matter. Did this happen according to the media reports? I am inclined to believe there is a fair amount of truth to the mother's claim, based on my past experiences. Having other passengers verify her story, to me, speaks volumes. IF this really happened the way it is portrayed, the FA needs to be let go. Trying to build a brand is hard enough without negative press. If there are other factors, then I trust it will be found out. The truth has a way of always surfacing. I hope there are many inaccuracies in the media story, and they will be found out. If she takes legal action, which she has said she's considering, we should all learn "both sides" of the story.


Automatically defending the actions of this crew, just as automatically crucifying them, is ridiculous. No one, the crew or the Mom and Baby, should be thrown under the bus just yet.

 

[gt1900]

You have to look at the FA before you make your decision... With some of the rude, condescending FA's ive flown with, I would believe the pax 100% if they were treated like crap... But then again, ive flown with some wonderful FA's and know that if there was a problem is was most likely the pax fault.. This could have very well been a discruntled FA and in that case, I would believe the pax.. But, if it was a good FA that knows how to deal with pax well, than you have to back your FA 100%.... Every situation is different, and there is not nearly enough info from the media for anyone of us to actually comment on how best handle the situation..

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Where's the threat to flight safety? The FA's ego...?

Like the other poster said... if you'd never traveld with kids then its impossible to understand.... I'd like to see opinions on this based on who has kids..

A good Captain would have resolved the issue by addressing the FA concerns and taken the mother and her kid to the desitnation.

 

[pianoman]

Where's the threat to flight safety? The FA's ego...?

Like the other poster said... if you'd never traveld with kids then its impossible to understand.... I'd like to see opinions on this based on who has kids..

A good Captain would have resolved the issue by addressing the FA concerns and taken the mother and her kid to the desitnation.

Rez, I often agree with you. But we don't know what the alleged threat was, and we don't know the personality/quality of the FA. So this is mostly like armchairing an accident investigation. Not enough facts to assign fault. I can't say I would have taken her. Depends on what the "threat" was and who the FA was.

I know there are some FA's I've worked with whose word I would never question. There are also those I'd rather not fly with again, in which case Mom and baby probably would have gone.

 

[airplane wizard]

I take the FA's side. I hate kids and people need to shut them up. Or else use a condom next time. Soccer mom pays like 2 cents for her ticket and then thinks everyone should kiss her ass.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

I take the FA's side. I hate kids and people need to shut them up. Or else use a condom next time. Soccer mom pays like 2 cents for her ticket and then thinks everyone should kiss her ass.

I'm sure more than one person has wished your parents took your advice.....

Not that it is an orginal statement... so it is quite possible some one said it before your lifetime.... thus your parents didn't need to count on you to say something to prevent your birth...which would've been impossible.... clear as mud?

Now call your mother (or yell up from the basement) and thank her for what you don't understand, with any luck your Mom and Dad did a decent job and there is still hope for you....

 

[Stifler's Mom]

I'm sure more than one person has wished your parents took your advice.....

HA HA HA.

I have small children and I try not to travel with them (too much of a headache) However, my son loves being around airplanes and constantly points them out as we sit in the terminal. Every 45 seconds he gets excited and says, "Daddy, look, a red and blue one." (Delta paint job) or "Daddy, there goes your airplane." (POS RJ)

Sounds like this 19 month old toddler was probably excited and fascinated by his airport experience. God knows I can thank my parents for numerous trips to watch airplanes takeoff and land when I was young caused me to fall in love with them to the point I decided to make a career out of it.

Were not talking about a screaming baby or some unruly brat who trashed the airplane by throwing his cookies all over the floor.

Probably just a FA having a bad day, and she lost her cool. For all we know, the ExpressJet plane was probably trapped on Ramp 3 for 30 minutes while "2-plane Jane" was working ramp control, and then they had to wait in a 30-deep money line for departure.