Maintenance Test Flights

[yaya]

Ever done a maintenance test flight at your airline or do you have separate mx pilots for that purpose? If so, did the mx guys ride along? Any restrictions or guidelines?

Details... Thanks...

 

[Prop2Jet]

Cover your arse.... Make sure they enter in the flight log the req. MX sign off for the test flight. Make sure you are willing to accept such a flight.....

 

[Guitar Guy]

Did a few check flights at my old regional. On one flight (a stall horn calibration flight), the mechanic rode along so he could tweak the setting on the avionics board. On another series of flights, maintenance did not ride along but were nearby as we flew out of a maintenance base.

 

[yaya]

We are doing a lot of these at my airline, and they are for the return to service checklist. Takes 1-2 hours.

 

[BankAccount=0$]

Done a bunch of MX test flights at my airline. It's part of being on reserve I guess. Mostly flap checks, and a couple of pressurization controller test hops. Sometimes one of the MX guy's will go along for the ride (one happens to be a pilot himself) but most of the time they are too busy to go if it's not required...

 

[SpoilerFault]

At the last company I worked for we (maint) almost always rode along on the flight test. I don't know if our SP's required us to or not. It's not that I wouldn't trust a crews word that everything is ok but I always prefered to fly with the aircraft if I was going to be signing off the return to service. Plus, if there were a problem I would have concise first hand knowledge of when the fault or failure took place.

 

[Rook]

Did a MX test flight on the CRJ. MX rode along and had us deploy the ADG to run some checks.

 

[91100 100 set]

I did a few ferry flights to return an aircraft from a heavy check. We were required to do a "test flight" which was only a quick lap in the traffic pattern, not enough time to reveal many problems. The return flight was usually 2 hours or so, and we usually found a few little issues (like the galley was completely empty!). The most notable was an improperly seated baggage door seal which resulted in being unable to reach the maximum pressurization differential, so we were stuck down low for the rest of the flight. Pretty tame stuff, but I'd rather not see anything too crazy, you know?

 

[rickair7777]

I got to do a variety, a lot of ADG drops. The best one was post-MX following control column problems on the FO's side...since I was an FO I got to fly it, headed to a VFR practice area. The problems had only occurred during large control deflections so, with Mx on board, I got to do near-aerobatic manuevers...in a CRJ.
:beer:

 

[Soverytired]

Like most things in aviation, a "test flight" sounds a lot sexier than it really is.

Basically, you take off and see if they fixed the stupid thing yet. No special training required.

I've always been more nervous about maintenance ferry permits . . . .those f'n mechanics will sign off anything to get it back to base, and you're the one who's butt gets in a sling if anything goes wrong.

"Careless and reckless operation" is a very broad brush.

 

[yaya]

Like most things in aviation, a "test flight" sounds a lot sexier than it really is.

Basically, you take off and see if they fixed the stupid thing yet. No special training required.

I've always been more nervous about maintenance ferry permits . . . .those f'n mechanics will sign off anything to get it back to base, and you're the one who's butt gets in a sling if anything goes wrong.

"Careless and reckless operation" is a very broad brush.

Have to agree with you here. I think it is important to have mx ride along for the stuff after heavy check... at my airline they do this no problems... Alsways very helpful guys. We used to have mx test pilots but now it falls on reserves. Seems to me it would be more cost effective to get a mx test crew that is more familiar with the checklists.

 

[PCL_128]

Ever done a maintenance test flight at your airline or do you have separate mx pilots for that purpose? If so, did the mx guys ride along? Any restrictions or guidelines?

Details... Thanks...

I did one or two at PCL, but I usually refused them unless it was something very benign. If anything was done to the primary flight controls or engines, then I told them no way. On the couple that I did do, the mx guy did ride along on the jumpseat.

 

[yaya]

I did one or two at PCL, but I usually refused them unless it was something very benign. If anything was done to the primary flight controls or engines, then I told them no way. On the couple that I did do, the mx guy did ride along on the jumpseat.

What they r giving us is a mostly rebuilt aircraft from long term storage to a ca with less than 100 hrs in type. A very long checklist.

 

[PCL_128]

What they r giving us is a mostly rebuilt aircraft from long term storage to a ca with less than 100 hrs in type. A very long checklist.

I'd tell them, politely, to *%&$ off.

 

[CosCrj]

I've always been more nervous about maintenance ferry permits . . . .those f'n mechanics will sign off anything to get it back to base, and you're the one who's butt gets in a sling if anything goes wrong.
quote]

Have to disagree with you. Not all f'n mechanics will just sign stuff off. Every plane I work on I treat as if my family were going to be flying on it. Sure there are hacks around but not all of us are.

 

[Soverytired]

Have to disagree with you. Not all f'n mechanics will just sign stuff off. Every plane I work on I treat as if my family were going to be flying on it. Sure there are hacks around but not all of us are.

Ok. Fair enough. SOME f'n mechanics then. But not you.

 

[OPECJet]

Done several. Like the other guy said, it's generally a quick flight with a mechanic on board to see if they fixed the stupid thing....

The Feds took away our in house ability to write ferry permits. I've done three since that happened, and I like it a lot better with having a neutral third party looking at the airplane who doesn't care that the airline needs the airplane back in service an hour ago. All three times the mechanics agreed the airplane was safe to ferry, but told us they would refuse to sign it off we weren't comfortable with their diagnosis.

 

[SpoilerFault]

Soverytired, I also feel that saying those f'ing mechanics will sign off anything is a rather broad and ridiculous statement. That's as absurd as saying that every pilot out there will cut corners on the last leg of a four day trip just to get home. We both know thats not the case. I'm sorry if you've had a bad experience in the past with Maint. Of course you always have a few hacks that will sign anything off but the majority of us would never do anything illegal or to otherwise endanger you. I wouldn't sign off ANY disrepancy that I wouldn't put myself and/or my own family on that aircraft! I want you to make it home safely to your family just as I would if I were on a flight you were piloting. Just try not to lump all of us in the same boat!

 

[Soverytired]

Soverytired, I also feel that saying those f'ing mechanics will sign off anything is a rather broad and ridiculous statement. That's as absurd as saying that every pilot out there will cut corners on the last leg of a four day trip just to get home. We both know thats not the case. I'm sorry if you've had a bad experience in the past with Maint. Of course you always have a few hacks that will sign anything off but the majority of us would never do anything illegal or to otherwise endanger you. I wouldn't sign off ANY disrepancy that I wouldn't put myself and/or my own family on that aircraft! I want you to make it home safely to your family just as I would if I were on a flight you were piloting. Just try not to lump all of us in the same boat!

Well reasoned, temperate discourse is not exactly a virtue or a commonality on flightinfo.com.

Don't get your panties in a knot. I've had some bad experiences with questionable ferry permits and paperwork screw ups where I was asked to just "get it back to base" by either maintenance or by a chief pilot.

I'm happy to hear that my experiences are the aberration, not the norm. Still, one can only draw upon one's own experiences when forming a world view.

 

[yaya]

Here is one I heard from a colleague... Would you do a mx test flight on a totally rebuilt aircraft after it had been in storage,,,,, during t-storms all around the airport and total IMC 3000 ft ceiling from the airport to 50 miles? Response.

 

[flyboy06]

Did my first one not too long ago at XJT out of SHV fresh out of C-check.


Nothing like asking the MX guy "Why do 2 of you have to come"

"well i'll be riding up front with you for the flight, and the other guy will be in the back to listen for strange noises"

what did I get myself into?

All and all it was mostly fly around at 12000 ft and time how long the gear and flaps go up and down and test the ICE system at 310 followed by a CAT II app.

 

[Thedude]

\
Basically, you take off and see if they fixed the stupid thing yet. No special training required.

I hope your company/ies dont do test flight like that. If I do a test flight it requires a min of 2 hrs flight time and most likely at least 2 hrs gnd time prior to thr flight to check was has been done. If an engine has been changed, that means a min of at least on engine shut down and relight in flight. I wont do a test flight unless it is day-vfr and the crew-members must have at lest 500hrs in type.
Its more than just a hop around the patch

 

[Lance Uppercut]

I did one or two at PCL, but I usually refused them unless it was something very benign. If anything was done to the primary flight control or engine, then I told them no way. On the couple that I did do, the mx guy did ride along on the jumpseat.

Pu$$ie.......

 

[yaya]

Pu$$ie.......

********************ing management puke. You know who the real *ussy is? YOU and your family.

 

[Lance Uppercut]

********************ing management puke. You know who the real *ussy is? YOU and your family.

What, the airplane is gonna test fly its self?
Think before you type moron. If your sissy a$$ won't do it someone else will.

 

[yaya]

What, the airplane is gonna test fly its self?
Think before you type moron. If your sissy a$$ won't do it someone else will.

Here's another litttle note for ya, grand pubah... No Pilot ever has done something that they did not want to do...

 

[PCL_128]

What, the airplane is gonna test fly its self?
Think before you type moron. If your sissy a$$ won't do it someone else will.

I'm not a test pilot. If some management puke wants to go be a "big man" and test fly airplanes, then he can have at it. Meanwhile, I'll fly my regular schedule and keep my certificate protected to the greatest extent possible.

 

[yaya]

I'm not a test pilot. If some management puke wants to go be a "big man" and test fly airplanes, then he can have at it. Meanwhile, I'll fly my regular schedule and keep my certificate protected to the greatest extent possible.

Thankyou. Any pilot will agree. No Wasty My ticket bubi! So, so sowwie! I go home and kiss my sweetie! Buh by, goodnight!

 

[RJP]

I always cringed when realizing that generally it's the two most junior people in their seats doing these test flights. Reserve CA and reserve FO. Just doesn't make much sense.

 

[Soverytired]

I always cringed when realizing that generally it's the two most junior people in their seats doing these test flights. Reserve CA and reserve FO. Just doesn't make much sense.

My experience as well. And they're usually done at night, without a filed flight plan and without VFR sectionals (company doesn't provide them)

That last is enough to refuse a flight right there. (Must have charts pertinent to flight even for Part 91). Which I have successfully done in the past.