Virgin America cleared to fly!!!

[AA717driver]

Hey, I wanted to go to VA since I heard what the concept was. If I was making less than CA pay there, I'd do it. I can't take the pay cut. Bummer.

Lear's right. For those who got kicked to the street, exactly why should they take one for the team and stay in some crappy job when they can get something better? Guess no one should go to work for a Regional, either...

Ralph--Virtually all of my classmates went to RIC (11/87). I thought I would but one spot opened up in FWA. (In retrospect, I should have gone to RIC...)

Take care. TC

 

[The Victors]

The issue is that these guys/gals are going to work for below standard wages and bennies, which allows V america to charge $5.95 for a ticket from SFO to JFK or whereever, which forces everyone else to charge the same, which will eventually force you and me to except below standard wages and bennies, or worse, out of a job.

 

[Lear70]

The issue is that these guys/gals are going to work for below standard wages and bennies, which allows V america to charge $5.95 for a ticket from SFO to JFK or whereever, which forces everyone else to charge the same, which will eventually force you and me to except below standard wages and bennies, or worse, out of a job.

The same could be said for every pilot who went to a regional job...

I don't see everyone blasting them in one specific thread.

Believe me, I don't like the constant lowering of the bar. I'm one of the most vocal advocates for trying to get low-time guys to stop hiring on for $18.50 an hour.

But, at the same time, I recognize that people have to feed their families, and if it's not Scabbing or a HoJets maneuver that DIRECTLY takes flying jobs away from people, then I have a hard time getting upset at people for improving their lot in life after a pretty crappy last decade.

Just my .02 cents.

 

[pipe]

"Good job. So where are these VA pilots coming from? If they ever want to call in a union, f*ck 'em. They had their chance."

Oh, let me see, can you say, Independece Air, United, TWA/AA, Skywest, come on! I am not one of them but, these people I guarantee you have all been somewhere previously that they paid union dues to ALPA, APA, Teamsters, or, an independent union and that union f!@#!@ them at some point. I know I am on my third union and oh boy is it wonderful.(Inject sarcasm) The point I am making is these guy's wouldn't be there if, 9/11, if they were not layed off, if their previous job didn't suck, if going back to USair wasn't more of a gamble, if........................................We as either former or current ALPA/APA/Teamster/indepentdent union members are to blame for a large part of this current mess. If we had the balls and stuck together as pilots first, and not show up for work just one day to protest the further eroding of the pilot pay and work rules we might see something turn around. A lot of us like to think of ourselves as a professional like a medical doctor is and that is fine, but as my brother(the smart one) who is a medical doctor told me after I explained what I have to go through every six months to keep my job, commute to work through TSA, line checks, etc, he said the doctors would shut the hospitals down.
If we as a total pilot group would yield a fraction of the power we have we could drive the industry. Just mho.

MACDU is right on the money.

The APA who stabbed the TWA guys, the United "mainline" guys who sold out the "LCO", the 59 year-olds who are cramming age 65 down everyone's throat - these are the reasons that VA can find plenty of pilots.

The aforementioned groups will spend far more political and financial capital fighting the VA and JB driven salary wars than they ever would have spent if they had maintained some unity in the first place.

I loathe what is happening in the industry, but it isn't too difficult to see why it's happening.

PIPE

 

[Notorious PIC]

What's the starting pay going to be at Virgin America? I hear it's supposed to be $95/Hour for Captains and $45/ Hour for FO's according to AirlinePilotPay.com. Any truth to this?

 

[Lake Alice]

All the original LCC's are to blame but in the end it all started with the regionals and for that we are all guilty. A good majority of all airline pilots started at a regional. The irony here is they are also the most vocal. In reality this started many, many years ago and not in the post 9-11 environment.

Virgin America beginning to fly domestic is just another chapter in the further erosion of a US airline career.

 

[AA717driver]

I know the $95 figure is correct. TC

 

[The Victors]

The same could be said for every pilot who went to a regional job...

I don't see everyone blasting them in one specific thread.

Believe me, I don't like the constant lowering of the bar. I'm one of the most vocal advocates for trying to get low-time guys to stop hiring on for $18.50 an hour.

But, at the same time, I recognize that people have to feed their families, and if it's not Scabbing or a HoJets maneuver that DIRECTLY takes flying jobs away from people, then I have a hard time getting upset at people for improving their lot in life after a pretty crappy last decade.

Just my .02 cents.

Agreed somewhat, but taking a regional job at 23 years old is alot different than someone with some actual experience going to skybus for a 60K CA spot.

 

[Occam's Razor]

Somewhere, the decomposed skull of Milton is smiling.

It appears I'm the only one who's read Paradise Lost.

"It's better to rule in Hell then to serve in Heaven"

 

[Lear70]

I did... in High School. almost 20 years ago.

Can't quote it verbatim, sorry.

 

[The Victors]

Do you mean Milton Burle?

 

[taylor01]

My prediction,

With the economy slowing, and it is thats not a guess, and the addition of new capacity at every major airline not to mention LCC, capacity will out paced demand. If this hold true for another year, you will see most amjor posting losses again. For a company, not just an airline but any company, to have 3 billion in revenue and post a profit in the 20 - 50 mm range is horrible. Granted it not a loss, but there isnt much wiggle room either.

All airlines need to watch domestic capacity and demand growth as if it is the last parachute in a burning plane. maintianing load factors in the 79% + range while at the same time not engaging in price wars will be essential for all carriers if they are to survive in this industry for the long term.

 

[AA717driver]

Do you mean Milton Burle?

Berle... Henny Youngman must be spinning in his grave. TC

 

[Phaedrus]

I prefer Dante.
For the aspirant--
"All hope abandon, ye who enter here."
For the defunct airlines--
" As fall the light autumnal leaves, one still the other following, till the bough strews all its honors."
For the deregulation haters--
" No greater grief than to remember days of joy when misery is at hand."
For those who but for the grace of God go--
" Thou shall know by experience how salt the savor is of others' bread, and how sad a path it is to climb and descend another's stairs."

 

[Lear70]

For the deregulation haters--
" No greater grief than to remember days of joy when misery is at hand."

That's about the most poignant and accurate sentiment ever spoken on that topic.

 

[Cappy]

VA is Virgin Atlantic

Those are not Virgin America rates.

$85 / hour for captains is the number I've heard.

The rate is $115/hr.

 

[Jonny Sacko]

• From Airline Pilot Central
• Received DOT approval in May to begin operations in summer
• Tentatively planning on serving several Canadian cities
• Hourly pay rates: $95/hr for captains, $44/hr for FOs
• Upgrading captains return to Year 1 pay
• Monthly guarantee unknown
• Upgrade to captain is merit-based
• $5/hr yearly raise
• Two 5-day blocks of vacation per year
• Focus will be on transcons
• Inaugural route: SFO-JFK
• Fleet plans: 34 A319/A320s
• Eight seats will be First Class
• A319/A320 proposed interiors
• Chairman of Virgin America is Donald Carty, ex-AMR CEO
• This page last updated: May 19, 2007

http://www.airlinepilotcentral.info
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Furlough

 

[AA717driver]

A good friend is currently employed by Virgin America as a line captain. His pay is $95/hr. at 70 hour guarantee (since they aren't flying yet). He's sitting at home now collecting that pay.

The $115/hr. may be for the check airmen. TC

P.S.--They have no shortage of applicants now that the USAir arbitration is out.

 

[Lear70]

P.S.--They have no shortage of applicants now that the USAir arbitration is out.

Sad, but I'm sure very true.

 

[Beetle007]

How come nobody bitches when a new gas station comes to town and lowers prices or Lowes or The Home Depot or other big box retailers????????? Free enterprise baby, let er rip!!!!!!! Aint this a great country????
p.s. I am not working for VA

In Minnesota it is illegal to sell gas for less than the actual costs. The law is designed to prevent predatory pricing.

You praise free enterprise but the airline industry is far from free. It is almost impossible to get the government to approve a merger of two healthy airlines.