instructor question

[Lazy8]

instructor/flight school question

For those of you teaching or who have instructed in the past...

Have you ever worked for a flight school that did not allow you to fly in other people's aircraft or freelance on the side? In other words, you were only allowed to fly THAT schools airplanes or be at risk of being repremended. If you have worked at a place like this what were/are the reasons why?

g

 

[unreal]

Heeeeeeeeeeeeell no. It's just a CFI job; they're a dime a dozen. Unless it's the only one in town, I'd go find somewhere that doesn't make you sign any kind of binding contract.

 

[Lazy8]

Heeeeeeeeeeeeell no. It's just a CFI job; they're a dime a dozen. Unless it's the only one in town, I'd go find somewhere that doesn't make you sign any kind of binding contract.

There is no signed contract of any kind. Only a verbal warning from the school management. I just can't wrap my head around why this rule would be in-place other than to slow down employee turnover to the airlines. They've mentioned b.s. about liability before, but I have a hard time figuring out how they would be liable if I went and wrecked someone else's aircraft. It's not right, but it is by far the best place to instruct 'in town'.

 

[Amish RakeFight]

Reason = Liability

The flight school which employs you may be liable if something goes wrong while you're instructing in another aircraft. Suing a broke CFI is like squeezing blood out of a turnip. Lawyers like to go after companies that have insurance which translates into money. Since you're an employee and loosely a representative of their business, they may in some way be found guilty, which of course is ridiculous. They're just covering themselves. Even if they aren't found culpable, at that point they've probably spent a few thousand in attorney bills defending themselves.

Anyway, unless you signed something when you were hired you can do what you want outside of their school. Just keep quiet about it.

 

[Lazy8]

Reason = Liability

The flight school which employs you may be liable if something goes wrong while you're instructing in another aircraft. Suing a broke CFI is like squeezing blood out of a turnip. Lawyers like to go after companies that have insurance which translates into money. Since you're an employee and loosely a representative of their business, they may in some way be found guilty, which of course is ridiculous. They're just covering themselves. Even if they aren't found culpable, at that point they've probably spent a few thousand in attorney bills defending themselves.

Anyway, unless you signed something when you were hired you can do what you want outside of their school. Just keep quiet about it.

Have you ever heard of a school with this policy?

I know there is a real far-fetched risk of liability in regards to freelance instructing on the side, but what if I had access to a private aircraft to fly whenever I want. No instructing, just a plane for pleasure flying that only cost me the fuel i put in it. Even this is off-limits according to management. I don't get it. It just seems a bit extreme and irrational especially when good opportunities arise.

 

[Amish RakeFight]

Have you ever heard of a school with this policy?

I know there is a real far-fetched risk of liability in regards to freelance instructing on the side, but what if I had access to a private aircraft to fly whenever I want. No instructing, just a plane for pleasure flying that only cost me the fuel i put in it. Even this is off-limits according to management. I don't get it. It just seems a bit extreme especially when good opportunities arise.

The place I used to instruct at had the same unoffical policy. Just ignore it and keep your instructing on the side quiet if need be.

It's not the flying on the side they're worried about, it's the instruction you're giving. They don't care about pleasure flying in your own plane or rental.

 

[Lazy8]

It amazes me that a flight instructor could get reprimanded or fired for trying to legitimately pay the bills and gain aeronautical experience. The fun thing is we have a flight instructor that has worked there for 7 years or so and does just that. Freelances on the side and there's no problem with it. I guess if you're 70 you can do whatever the hell you want.

.....ever just have one of those days? :nuts:

ah well, time to fly under the radar i suppose

g

 

[SlipAway]

I had that happen to me. Their reasoning didn't involve liability, however. They were more concerned about competition/lost business. They were the only flight school on the premises and were very sure that their agreement with the airport authority gave them the monopoly on flight instruction there.

So even if the student owned his own airplane and did not want anything to do with their flight school, in their mind they still had the right to his flight instruction dollars.

The first time they mentioned their position to me, I kind of laughed it off. It seemed like such a silly position for them to take. However, I was a part-time contract CFI, and their response was simply to stop sending new students my way.

 

[taters]

tell your flight school to kiss your ass

 

[JediNein]

If you are an employee, you probably signed a binding contract that included a non-compete clause.

If you are a contractor, every contract you perform outside of the school makes your contract relationship more credible.

If the flight school provides you with a client, and you want more business from that flight school, keep that client relationship through the flight school. Start instructing that same client on the side and you might not ever be found out. Get found out and things can get quite ugly at that airport and beyond.

Aviation is a small world and gets smaller every day. You never know who your boss just had lunch with, and whom that who does the hiring for.

 

[oops!]

It's not liability, it's the fact that they know you want to fly.. that means you will have to fly their airplane and make them money... If you have a chance to make a real wage on the side I recommend taking it.. never burn bridges, especially in this business but joe blowflight instruction school doesn't want to miss out on making a buck niether should you...

 

[RemoveB4Flght]

Liability? I don't think so

Ask to see the private owner's insurance. If you check the insurance policies of most single engine aircraft, there is a clause that extends the policy to cover any authorized instruactor, designated examiner, or FAA inspector. Premiums drop with increased dual instruction, especially in that particular aircraft. The Insurance companies want the pilots to seek additional instruction and ratings beyond the bare minimum needed becuase statistics show a decrease in accidents in relation to the amount of instruction received. Otherwise most DE's wouldn't do checkrides in owner aircraft if they were at all liable.

Now renting an aircraft is a whole other ball of wax.. there it's usually the flight school that is covered, and the insurance company can subrogate the cost to the renter.

Your school sounds like the have a "if you have enough free time to instruct elsewhere, you could be working more hours for us" philosophy

 

[avbug]

This isn't that uncommon. Schools don't want you teaching in other aircraft...they want others renting their aircraft, and you teaching in the schools rental aircraft.

 

[nosehair]

This isn't that uncommon. Schools don't want you teaching in other aircraft...they want others renting their aircraft, and you teaching in the schools rental aircraft.

This is the main reason. But percieved liability factors in there too. No matter if it is legal or not, people who have airplane accidents get advised by lawyers to sue whomever could be held accontable in the public's eye.
You are a 'professional' flight instructor who is 'profesionally' employed by The Ace Flying School - that's why he picked you;because of your 'professional standing' in the flying school business. So the school gets sued - even if itn is a personal deal. Even though the school may not be held accountable, they l.ose time and money defending.

It happens. Consider these things every time you complain about busuness practices. The rotten few f*kd it up for the rest of us.

 

[Lazy8]

Would you pass up $1400 for a couple weeks worth of occasional flying?

Would you risk getting fired from a great flight school over it?

I love this industry. Thanks for your replies!

g

 

[Lazy8]

Your school sounds like the have a "if you have enough free time to instruct elsewhere, you could be working more hours for us" philosophy

nail on the head

g

 

[nosehair]

tell your flight school to kiss your ass

Yeah, that'ed be reeel professional wouldn't it?
Well, maybe not too "pro-fess-shu-nul", but it'ed reeely tell'em, wouldn't it? Cain't tell me whut to do, by gawd.

 

[wrxpilot]

There is no signed contract of any kind. Only a verbal warning from the school management. I just can't wrap my head around why this rule would be in-place other than to slow down employee turnover to the airlines. They've mentioned b.s. about liability before, but I have a hard time figuring out how they would be liable if I went and wrecked someone else's aircraft. It's not right, but it is by far the best place to instruct 'in town'.

Hmm... Does your employer start with "J"? The one I'm thinking of has really been irritating me lately with their policies.

 

[Lazy8]

Hmm... Does your employer start with "J"? The one I'm thinking of has really been irritating me lately with their policies.

No, I'm at the first one on Airport Way. It's really a great place to fly & instruct, but every place has its irratations.

By the way, we got the official word from the control tower yesterday. Starting March 15th Jeffco Tower will be called "Metro Tower". eck

g

 

[svcta]

If you are an employee, you probably signed a binding contract that included a non-compete clause.

Way to piss me off first thing in the morning. This is the problem with aviation any more. Noone can just have a job flight instructing; someone wants to someone to sign a (*(($&#*&(^&)_)W)(#W&*#^&#&@$)#$ contract.

If you're reading this and you don't already know, IT IS NOT NORMAL TO SIGN A CONTRACT TO FLIGHT INSTRUCT! There should be no contract if you are emplyed by a flight school. It's a flight school!

That's like signing a contract saying that you won't deep fry potatoes at home when you get a job at McDonald's.