Comair MEC recall...

[staylow]

Just read that the "language" of the TA is supposed to be finalized and hopefully released today on the ALPA CMR MEC page. I suspect it will be all the same garbage we have been hearing for the last several months...throw in a cash incentive and some KoolAid at the ALPA roadshow and they will get the 51% they need to pass.

As JC put it, "I have a vested interest in Comair..." What?

 

[DrewBlows]

You want to recall the MEC for what the TA might say? I'm not particularly optomistic, but I'll at least read it first.

 

[JECKEL]

Over course it is the same crap that it has always been. Don't tell me you actually thought Delta would have changed any of the CORE items (which I believe is everything) on their "forced action".

 

[c140billy]

maybee you should read it first... its out now.

 

[~~~^~~~]

Before being too critical of the Comair MEC (which I am likely to be from here) we probably should remember that even the Delta pilots signed off on their Company's final offer with only very minor changes. The Comair MEC had less power and was in much worse a position than the Delta MEC was.

 

[WWEfan]

Can any of you Comair guys post the TA here?

 

[imacdog]

It's not great but it could be worse. I'm not sure how I'll vote yet but I didn't look at it and automatically think "heck no" like I expected to.

 

[wanagethi]

The pay rates are not that much different from what the company wants to impose

 

[standaman]

The pay rates are not that much different from what the company wants to impose

But at least they are better. See everyone at the road show. I am curious to hear the union opinion.

 

[wrigley23]

Anybody understand the longevity restoration? One step now, the rest in four years. Strike longevity restored. There's a mention of retro pay but compares the freeze to new rates which wouldn't pay anything. I'm coRnfused.

 

[PA44Jockey]

2011 is a long time. Things to be null and void under a sale? Hmm. Let's throw some Future payscales for larger airplanes out there and get them to bite on that and then sell them. Figures

 

[Troy208]

..

2011 is a long time. Things to be null and void under a sale? Hmm. Let's throw some Future payscales for larger airplanes out there and get them to bite on that and then sell them. Figures

You are right....That is a cause for concern. Looks like a carrot on a stick.

 

[wrigley23]

I don't think anyone wants to be here in 2011, God I hope not, except for the Florence/Burlington lifers. The commitment langauge is bogus anyway, they've never followed through before so why should they now?

 

[michael707767]

Before being too critical of the Comair MEC (which I am likely to be from here) we probably should remember that even the Delta pilots signed off on their Company's final offer with only very minor changes. .

if you think there were only minor changes between the company offer and what the Delta TA said, you obviously don't know what you are talking about. Our TA sucked, no doubt. But compared to the other pilots groups who went through BK, we did dammed well.

 

[PA44Jockey]

You notice how in the summary it has CL-65, 700, 900 and Emb 170 scales. Look in the the contractual language and there are pay scales for emb 140-45 pay scales.

 

[PuffDriver]

Before being too critical of the Comair MEC (which I am likely to be from here) we probably should remember that even the Delta pilots signed off on their Company's final offer with only very minor changes. The Comair MEC had less power and was in much worse a position than the Delta MEC was.

You would think you might get something right just once or twice through sheer luck, but no.

List of things management did not achieve in their 1113 wish list:

19.5% pay cut with no raises
No 401k company contribution
5 year duration
Delete all furlough protections
No financial returns
325 million in concessions per year with no credit for DB termination
79 seat DCI aircraft
Delete change of control provisions
Establish a sick leave reliability program and impose draconian sick leave terms
minutes under offset by minutes over
15 minute release per duty period
no xtra captain on crew for over 12 hour flights(1 captain, 3 f/os
change contractual max duty scheduled time
change duty period minumum
deltte duty period average pay
delete trip rig (1:2)
reduce rotation credit (1:3.5)
delete OJI
increase category freeze
100 seater upgrade restriction
change trip assignment ladder
reserve assignment up to alv +15
delete pay back x-days for reserve
reduce inverse assignment pay
establish flight attendant satellite base parking without benefit to pilots

Not even close to "very minor changes" from their "final" offer

BTW, I voted no anyway

 

[surplus1]

As JC put it, "I have a vested interest in Comair..." What?

YOU may not have a vested interest in Comair. In fact based on your profile you really don't have a "vested interest" in anything. However, JC and a whole lot of other people do. It's spelled s-e-n-i-o-r-i-t-y.

Do not expect them to fall on their swords in support of your lack of a vested interest.

The drop dead in event of sale clause is not pretty. And the longevity is less than clear in the summary. I'm sure they'll explain it in the presentation, and it may still be unsat. There is no way to make these things perfect. There are always a lot of things not to like.

If you are going to compare the deal only on the basis of the book rates, consider the following.

• Compare the 07 TA CL 700 rates with those of the 05 TA which was for a seat range of 69 to 80 seats. The rates have been improved and the seat range of 69-80 has been eliminated. A significant improvement.

• Compare the CL705/900 rates to the rates negotiated at NWA for the 76-seat "Compass" operation. They are virtually identical. In fact CMR’s are better in that Compass has no rigs.

• Compare the CL705/900 rates to the rates for the EMB-190 (100 seats) at USAirways, Delta and Jet Blue. In making that comparison, remember that the CL705/900 rate is for CMR’s largest (potential) aircraft. The rates at USA, DAL and JBLU are for their smallest aircraft.

• If Comair should operate the CL705/900 it is very unlikely that any CA with less than 10 years seniority would fly that aircraft, whereas the pilots at USA, DAL or JBLU are likely to have less than 5 years seniority, plus the E190 is substantially larger. The rates compare favorably on that basis. No, that doesn't mean they are good - it just means that is where the industry is today.

The principle reason for rates in that aircraft being low are the low ball rates created by mainline pilots in order to hold on to that flying or try to take it back.

• Under the circumstance of bankruptcy, CMR negotiators have not done poorly on book rates.

Does it "suck"? Sure it does. There has never been an agreement negotiated in bankruptcy that didn't suck compared to what was there before. Just ask a UAL pilot, a USA pilot, a DAL pilot or a NWA pilot. There aren't a lot of "smiles" on those faces either.

Under the circumstances, your negotiating committe deserves a hand shake for their efforts - even if you don't like this and decide to vote it down.

Life is full of hard knocks and this is one of them. Nevertheless, reality cannot be ignored. When you get to where you have a "vested interest" in something you'll figure that out.

 

[embdrvr]

Rates still better than SkyWest with the new deal?

 

[FightingIrish]

Can someone post the details of the agreement?

 

[737 Pylt]

YOU may not have a vested interest in Comair. In fact based on your profile you really don't have a "vested interest" in anything. However, JC and a whole lot of other people do. It's spelled s-e-n-i-o-r-i-t-y.

It's also spelled R-E-T-I-R-E-M-E-N-T!!
Enjoy the shuffleboards, viagra, and bright Florida sunshine old man!
The cmr boys and girls will vote as they see fit! You don't have a say pops, you're out.
Worry about your aarp benefits!

737