Senator wants USAir to restore it's pensions

[HelloNewman]

The pensions are what were a joke, keeping them at least semi-dead is best for all. Capping the pensions is what is best for all. There is no reason to pay someone that is retired more than 100 k /year. You must plan for yourself in todays environment. I suggest paying someone like 40 or 50 k /year for their pension. That is what is most fair for everyone.

 

[Pee_nuss]

The pensions are what were a joke, keeping them at least semi-dead is best for all. Capping the pensions is what is best for all. There is no reason to pay someone that is retired more than 100 k /year. You must plan for yourself in todays environment. I suggest paying someone like 40 or 50 k /year for their pension. That is what is most fair for everyone.

You sir are a giant ******************************. If I ever fly with you, i will make your life hell.

That is all

 

[Freight Dog]

The market has done so well in the last 2 years, that most companies wouldn't have had to make any contributions to their pension plans. The market would have done it for them. Instead, the managements wanted the DC plans instead. Fine... so now they have to keep paying regardless of what market does.

 

[Lear70]

The pensions are what were a joke, keeping them at least semi-dead is best for all. Capping the pensions is what is best for all. There is no reason to pay someone that is retired more than 100 k /year. You must plan for yourself in todays environment. I suggest paying someone like 40 or 50 k /year for their pension. That is what is most fair for everyone.

Fine, then negotiate it for YOU. Don't go negotiating something for a group of people who are no longer young enough to go back into the market place.

Just who, exactly, the FU*K are YOU to tell OTHER people how much they should or shouldn't get for their retirement? Especially when you're talking about plans that would have to have been put in place back in the 80's to have enough money to pay anything out?

Oh, wait, I get it, the guys who have retired in the last DECADE should have been clairvoyant enough to know the bankruptcy courts would set a precedent NEVER BEFORE SEEN IN THIS COUNTRY prior to this century for allowing pensions industry-wide to be scrapped with little or no evidence to support their terminations.

Let's hope that, when you retire, YOU have everything you need and something terrible and unforeseen doesn't happen to YOUR money.

Personally, I think it would be kind of amusing to see someone like you become a target of identity theft and someone steals your investment account and shuttles it off overseas and you end up with pennies on the dollar in insurance for your deposit (hint: many banks have caps on how much they insure in one account).

Oh wait, you should have foreseen that.

Like I said, if you don't want a pension, then don't negotiate it back for YOUR contract. It is NOT your place to tell OTHER people they shouldn't get what THEY negotiated for in good faith and then worked for 20-25 years or more at one company to get it.

 

[PHXFLYR]

This is the guy that reamed Parker at the Senate Hearing concerning airline consolidation and the attempted takeover of Delta.

There's your answer. This isn't about what's right. It's just about politics. Somebody's giving the guy the old hand job under the table. It's just some back-door(end) deal to say "back off" US Airways. Hopefully it will work.

Seem's like it did. Parker blinked Feb 1.

PHXFLYR

 

[PHXFLYR]

Offer a better product and reliable service at slightly higher fares.

I agree with what you say but the problem is John Q Public doesn't want to pay for that. He wants the cheapest ticket out there. Period. And then when his flight on El-Cheapo Airways cancels and ruins his vacation ,or if they lose his 15 pieces of luggage on the other end, all he wants to do is "beetch" about it to some poor 19 year old ticket agent with a tongue stud and tattoo who really doesn't give a dam one way or the other about his little "travel problem". Air travel today....all the ambience of a Greyhound Bus Station. Don't ya just love it?



PHXFLYR

 

[vetrider]

I agree with what you say but the problem is John Q Public doesn't want to pay for that. He wants the cheapest ticket out there. Period. And then when his flight on El-Cheapo Airways cancels and ruins his vacation ,or if they lose his 15 pieces of luggage on the other end, all he wants to do is "beetch" about it to some poor 19 year old ticket agent with a tongue stud and tattoo who really doesn't give a dam one way or the other about his little "travel problem". Air travel today....all the ambience of a Greyhound Bus Station. Don't ya just love it?



PHXFLYR

Aint that the truth, a one paragraph dead on description of how it is these days.

 

[rtmcfi]

Sent
J/K in my previous post..... trying to get a rise out of the old guys, you know, raise their blood prssure a little more.

 

[unwashed]

sent to both of my senators, murray,and cantwell. Washington doesn't have any Ch11 airlines (at the moment), but we do have alot of retired pilots in the pilot ghetto.

 

[HelloNewman]

Fine, then negotiate it for YOU. Don't go negotiating something for a group of people who are no longer young enough to go back into the market place.

Just who, exactly, the FU*K are YOU to tell OTHER people how much they should or shouldn't get for their retirement? Especially when you're talking about plans that would have to have been put in place back in the 80's to have enough money to pay anything out?

Oh, wait, I get it, the guys who have retired in the last DECADE should have been clairvoyant enough to know the bankruptcy courts would set a precedent NEVER BEFORE SEEN IN THIS COUNTRY prior to this century for allowing pensions industry-wide to be scrapped with little or no evidence to support their terminations.

Let's hope that, when you retire, YOU have everything you need and something terrible and unforeseen doesn't happen to YOUR money.

Personally, I think it would be kind of amusing to see someone like you become a target of identity theft and someone steals your investment account and shuttles it off overseas and you end up with pennies on the dollar in insurance for your deposit (hint: many banks have caps on how much they insure in one account).

Oh wait, you should have foreseen that.

Like I said, if you don't want a pension, then don't negotiate it back for YOUR contract. It is NOT your place to tell OTHER people they shouldn't get what THEY negotiated for in good faith and then worked for 20-25 years or more at one company to get it.

I am simply stating the pensions should come back, at a reduced rate. The old way was simply to expensive to fund. The pensions shouldn't have been dumped but capped. I would say 50-60k/year is more than fair for retirement. If you have your house, car, etc paid off then you can live a pretty good life. I am just saying why try to get the full pension back when it will simply be dumped again when it gets too expensive during the next downturn? Why not give all the guys at least 1/2 of what they were supposed to get?

Unfortunately I think the days of the pension are pretty much dead. They have already been dumped and quite underfunded. Budgets are based on no longer having to pay out to the pension. I Think dumping the pensions was highway robbery but if they did come back capping it at 1/2 what you were supposed to get is a good deal for all. Perhaps that way they can at least partially take care of the retirees and still have some left for the future retirees. Until there is a law not allowing big bonuses when things like robbing the pensions happen our hands are tied.

 

[unwashed]

Never climb higher than you are willing to fall and never promise more than you can give. These companies have know for decades that they would run into this issue. Why do you think actuaries are employed by these companies. Once again if the penalties for failure where just as harsh for the management teams as for the employees we probably would not be discussing this right now.

 

[Lear70]

I am simply stating the pensions should come back, at a reduced rate. The old way was simply to expensive to fund. The pensions shouldn't have been dumped but capped. I would say 50-60k/year is more than fair for retirement. If you have your house, car, etc paid off then you can live a pretty good life. I am just saying why try to get the full pension back when it will simply be dumped again when it gets too expensive during the next downturn? Why not give all the guys at least 1/2 of what they were supposed to get?

Unfortunately I think the days of the pension are pretty much dead. They have already been dumped and quite underfunded. Budgets are based on no longer having to pay out to the pension. I Think dumping the pensions was highway robbery but if they did come back capping it at 1/2 what you were supposed to get is a good deal for all. Perhaps that way they can at least partially take care of the retirees and still have some left for the future retirees. Until there is a law not allowing big bonuses when things like robbing the pensions happen our hands are tied.

If you're talking about pilots CURRENTLY employed, then absolutely.

Sorry if I went on a rant earlier, baby kept me up most the night and I tried to edit it later but couldn't...

I still believe it's unfair not to give the guys who ARE retired their FULL pensions back. They planned for their lifestyle with the promise that they would get a certain dollar amount every year in retirement and, indeed, 30-40 years of previous pension stability through MANY different airline bankruptcies gave a semblance of reliability in that belief.

What we NOW know doesn't much help those guys.

Enjoy the game!

 

[Jeff Helgeson]

I agree in theory, but you are incorrect....

Anyone who does NOT agree with this should not even be working in this indusrty.
This is the only industry that management can mismanage, misappropriate, and not be held accountable! When the sh*t hits the fan, they ask for concessions, and take away the livelihoods of the workers. I'm still perplexed how this is allowed to happen.......

.......many other industries have lead the way to taking away pensions long before the airline industry thought about it. The US steel industry was one of the more notable ones.

A compromise solution would be to freeze or grandfather a current pension plan and then offer a Direct Account Plan (DAP) based on a percentage of monthly earnings. Air Tran pilots have such a plan with 10.5% contributed by the company.

 

[Jim Smyth]

I am glad someone in Washington is using some common sense! Lets see an airline that washes away Billions through the US Bankruptcy process, screws its employees with massive wage reductions, takes away all the Pensions and then starts to make a small return and wants to blow Billions more to acquire another airlines = Priceless!

 

[737 Pylt]

The pensions are what were a joke, keeping them at least semi-dead is best for all. Capping the pensions is what is best for all. There is no reason to pay someone that is retired more than 100 k /year. You must plan for yourself in todays environment. I suggest paying someone like 40 or 50 k /year for their pension. That is what is most fair for everyone.

No wonder everyone thinks you're an ass! Grow up kid, you got a lot of learning to do!

I just sent mine in!

737

 

[HelloNewman]

No wonder everyone thinks you're an ass! Grow up kid, you got a lot of learning to do!

I just sent mine in!

737

Simply trying to think of what is a fair solution sir. If the retirees get their pension back then everyone should get some slice of the pie no? Have they been contributed to at all for the last year or two? Everyone should get something and yes it is a joke the pensions can be thrown out.

 

[Ex737Driver]

Sent.

 

[Flopgut]

Begging your pardon guys?

I'm thinking we should examine what rail has and push for something silmiliar for us. www.rrb.gov Let's get a pension vehicle for every FAR 121 pilot. If we pattern the same thing rail has now it will answer nearly every question/pitfall on this thread AND be in a form already in place in another transportation mode.

I've read it but would appreciate another set of eyes looking it over if anybody has time. Or maybe somebody has a retired railroader in the family and could comment. It might be a bad idea, I don't know, I'm hoping to get some feedback before I push it too much. Thanks.