Leaving Regional for charter

[rattler]

Hey guys,

I have been presented with a unique situation. A long time friend of mine is trying to recruit me to a charter operation he is running. He has offered me left seat in a G5 starting at $130K(I have no experience with this type of equiptment). I will be traveling to "visit" this operation and to try and get a feel of whether this is a good move or not. The oportunity requires me to move far from where I live now, away from family and I will be taking a girlfriend and 2 year old with me.

Currently I make $90K as a CA on the ERJ with weekends and hollidays off. I usually have 13-15 days off a month, and enjoy a pretty good "quality of life". I am activally trying to move on to a major, and I have excepted the fact that I will take a huge pay cut. I know I will miss the benefits of being an airline pilot. (Example: My girlfriend and I are going to Germany in April free of charge.{vacation passes}) an other example I jumpseat to visit family on a regualar basis.

I know there are alot of charter guys out there that make great livings and enjoy a wonderful quality of life. I am interested in hearing their opinions. If I go to a major, I am optimistic I will be presented an oportunity within a year. I am 32, so I have lots of time left.

The important things to me are 1)being home for my family 2) making money 3) stability.

Thanks.

 

[Flybet3]

Hey guys,

I have been presented with a unique situation. A long time friend of mine is trying to recruit me to a charter operation he is running. He has offered me left seat in a G5 starting at $130K(I have no experience with this type of equiptment). I will be traveling to "visit" this operation and to try and get a feel of whether this is a good move or not. The oportunity requires me to move far from where I live now, away from family and I will be taking a girlfriend and 2 year old with me.

Currently I make $90K as a CA on the ERJ with weekends and hollidays off. I usually have 13-15 days off a month, and enjoy a pretty good "quality of life". I am activally trying to move on to a major, and I have excepted the fact that I will take a huge pay cut. I know I will miss the benefits of being an airline pilot. (Example: My girlfriend and I are going to Germany in April free of charge.{vacation passes}) an other example I jumpseat to visit family on a regualar basis.

I know there are alot of charter guys out there that make great livings and enjoy a wonderful quality of life. I am interested in hearing their opinions. If I go to a major, I am optimistic I will be presented an oportunity within a year. I am 32, so I have lots of time left.

The important things to me are 1)being home for my family 2) making money 3) stability.

Thanks.

As sweet as the deal sounds, it seems like you already know what you want. It seems like you have your heart set, and are happy at your regional. My advice. I would go where the money is, and a G5 is a great type to have, you can always do contract as well. But it all depends, how much are you going to fly? How many pilots are they going to have for the G5? How many days can you expect to be on the road? What kind of benefits are they going to offer you? It sounds like a good deal, but just make sure that you get everything they offer you. Good luck.

 

[Rxflyer]

If I were presented with such a choice, I would be considering where you are moving to & cost of living there vs your pay raise. Would your and your family be happy living in that part of the US ?

Sounds like you have a pretty good QOL now, IMO. When you say your friend is "running" the charter op, does that mean he owns it ? If he's going to be a building block of your security, you need to know how secure his position is.

I know you're aware of the bigger jet = longer trips away relationship. I wonder what a "typical" trip (if there is such a thing) is on a G-V ?

You have a really interesting decision to ponder ! Good luck ! (in a few years, I suspect your priorities #2 and #3 will trade places, too...)

 

[junkjockey]

Sounds like a great opportunity! Like the last post said...make sure its stable. QOL can be very very good with a charter. Im flying a King Air 200 with a 135 outfit in Mobile, AL and im usually looking at 10-15 days off a month plus im home every night. Rarely do we have an overnight. But....i never know my schedule...I worked Thanksgiving day, Christmas Eve, and Christmas Day straight thru til Jan. 2nd. It has its ups and downs just like any other flying job. Good luck! BTW Ill take the job if u dont want it!!!

 

[Mason]

As previously mentioned, you at minimum will be facing a large QOL change. GVs don't do too many out and backs.

 

[rattler]

I am hoping to get all of these questions answered when I go in to see the operation next month. My friend is a partial owner in this company which has a small fleet of jet aircraft, including G5s. The move would be from a moderatly high cost of living area to a higher cost of living area.

 

[jobear]

remember is cheaper up by Lake Castaic

 

[freighthumper]

If quality of life is your number one factor, RUN away from it. A charter operation in a GV is the relationship kiss of death. As the other guy said, there are few if not NO out and backs. Im flying a charter GIV and Im gone 18 days straight, then 10 off. this means that your gone for 18 days, the first 3 days you are home you are re-getting used to the time zone and being home, then you have 4 days off, then 3 days of getting your head and wife ready for you to go again. 90 a year isnt that bad, and if you have holidays and weekends, that and being home more often means alot more than that extra 40k.

-another former Rattler

 

[Makesheepnervus]

The GV position at 130k to start sounds like a fantastic oportunity, and you will likely be making well over 150k in no time. However you said your priorities are;

Quote, "The important things to me are 1)being home for my family 2) making money 3) stability"

Well, working charter on a GV means you will be away from home more and as for a schedule, well, forget it. Exactly how much you are away and how erratic your schedule depends on the operation you are working for.

Where I work we have no schedule, but I average 18 days a month with a mix of day trips and longer 5-7 day trips, typically averaging around 10 or 11 overnights a month. I'm usually able to arrange my FAR rest days and vacation times to cover most family occasions, but the bottom line is you (and your spouse) have to be flexible in order to make it work. This line of work is not for everybody. If you are happy at the airlines I recomend staying where you are.

 

[StarHustler]

I agree with the above post. Based on your priorities, you need to stay put. While I would certainly recommend that you 'check out' the new job potential with a visit, it sounds to me that it would not fit your lifestyle. Charter is so much different from airline work that it is like moving from Florida to Alaska. Is 40K difference worth not having a skd, holidays, and weekends off? That is ultimatley your question.

 

[Makesheepnervus]

In a somewhat ironic twist I am faced with the exact opposite of
Rattlers' dilema;
Do I take a position with a major airline, and accept the initial 75k pay cut along with the prospect of weekly cross country commutes for the benefits of a schedule and an eventual increase in pay that might equal my current pay in a few years?
Throw in the fact that I'm nearly 44 and you can see I don't have so many years to "catch up". Plus the fact that I know I will miss flying to exotic destinations, (TEB doesn't count!). And you can see It's not an easy decision, even the wife can't make her mind up, other than to say, "But why can't you just stay at this job and not go away so often?"

BTW rattler, will you be moving to the SoCal area? If so, bear in mind that even the crappiest houses out here cost upwards of 500K and that's with a commute! Typical prices in the outer areas are around 700k

 

[ultrarunner]

I would think the ONLY reason to move to this charter gig would be to gain the experience necessary to reach your goals. But you already have that experience, so unless you simply have a hard-on to go fly a GV, I'd say you'd be wasting your time. I would see a charter gig on a plane like that as BIG step backwards in QOL, and you rank that as important. I'll call the salary a wash, as you'd be moving to a more expensive area.

What gives? WHY do you want this, if at all???

 

[rattler]

What gives? WHY do you want this, if at all???

Well, the $40K bump in pay would be nice, plus I would expect the pay to up from there over time. Untill listening to all of your experences I really didn't know much about how it is to work for a charter operation.Thank you for all your imput. I really want nothing to do with a 18 on schedule like one of you mentioned, that's just not for me. But I will still check the operation out, and I will have lots of questions that need answering.

 

[rattler]

Hey Makessheepnervous, want to trade jobs for a month? No it's in South Fla, so it's not that bad.

 

[Makesheepnervus]

Which job, the regional or the GV?
A GV in south florida sounds pretty good to me!!!

 

[Freight Dog]

I'll echo the majority here... if the QOL is what matters to you, you'll be hard-pressed to match the airline lifestyle. Question to ask is regarding hard days off at the charter outfit. Any pop-up trips?

Charter flying is night and day from the airlines. You'll go from a set schedule at an airline to on-demand, and that can be rough on some people. Other people thrive on that.

My personal experience is that you get substantially more job satisfaction flying charter than with the airlines primarily because you are more intimately involved with the entire aspect of the operation, and not just picking up paperwork, loading up the FMS and blasting off...

G-V is an awesome airplane and an extremely valuable type rating to have.

If I were presented with the same option at this point, I'd happily trade my 737 job for a G-V gig.

 

[TheDogsBollocks]

Hey guys,

I have been presented with a unique situation. A long time friend of mine is trying to recruit me to a charter operation he is running. He has offered me left seat in a G5 starting at $130K(I have no experience with this type of equiptment). I will be traveling to "visit" this operation and to try and get a feel of whether this is a good move or not. The oportunity requires me to move far from where I live now, away from family and I will be taking a girlfriend and 2 year old with me.

Currently I make $90K as a CA on the ERJ with weekends and hollidays off. I usually have 13-15 days off a month, and enjoy a pretty good "quality of life". I am activally trying to move on to a major, and I have excepted the fact that I will take a huge pay cut. I know I will miss the benefits of being an airline pilot. (Example: My girlfriend and I are going to Germany in April free of charge.{vacation passes}) an other example I jumpseat to visit family on a regualar basis.

I know there are alot of charter guys out there that make great livings and enjoy a wonderful quality of life. I am interested in hearing their opinions. If I go to a major, I am optimistic I will be presented an oportunity within a year. I am 32, so I have lots of time left.

The important things to me are 1)being home for my family 2) making money 3) stability.

Thanks.

If I am not mistaken, I think the insurance company that underwrites that GV is going to be most reluctant to allow you to fly that aircraft as PIC with a brand new GV type and zero experience-a issue you might want to discuss with your buddy.

I think you should stay put as you have control of your schedule and can thus balance personal and professional commitments, going the charter route generally means a sacrifice in personal QOL. If you are living comfortably on your current salary and working conditions, it will be probably better to wait for a major airline opportunity.

 

[CapnVegetto]

An old grey-headed pilot once told me to look at how many steps are on the airplane door, multiply that by 3, and that's how many days a month you're gonna be away from home flying that thing. 7 steps X 3 = about 21 days a month you're not in your own bed.

The big thing to get out of these fellas is how many HARD days off a month are you going to have? Are you on call 24/7? How many nights a month can you expect to be gone? How many hours a year do you see the airplane flying? Usually, on the last two questions, multiply the number he gives you by 1.5 and that'll be closer to the real number. If an owner tells you he's going to fly 200 hours a year, 200 X 1.5 = 300 will probably be more true.

The biggest thing I've learned in my about 10 years in this stupid business is KNOW WHAT YOU'RE GETTING IN TO. Ask the right questions. QOL is #1 to me, and if an owner is questioning why you're asking stuff like that then you probably don't want to work for him. $130K is great money, but if you're gone 25 days a month and never see your family it ain't worth sheeite.

My $.02.

 

[AMANSWORLD]

Hey guys,

I have been presented with a unique situation. A long time friend of mine is trying to recruit me to a charter operation he is running. He has offered me left seat in a G5 starting at $130K(I have no experience with this type of equiptment). I will be traveling to "visit" this operation and to try and get a feel of whether this is a good move or not. The oportunity requires me to move far from where I live now, away from family and I will be taking a girlfriend and 2 year old with me.

Currently I make $90K as a CA on the ERJ with weekends and hollidays off. I usually have 13-15 days off a month, and enjoy a pretty good "quality of life". I am activally trying to move on to a major, and I have excepted the fact that I will take a huge pay cut. I know I will miss the benefits of being an airline pilot. (Example: My girlfriend and I are going to Germany in April free of charge.{vacation passes}) an other example I jumpseat to visit family on a regualar basis.

I know there are alot of charter guys out there that make great livings and enjoy a wonderful quality of life. I am interested in hearing their opinions. If I go to a major, I am optimistic I will be presented an oportunity within a year. I am 32, so I have lots of time left.

The important things to me are 1)being home for my family 2) making money 3) stability.

Thanks.

Should you not want the job, please PM me all the info. I am sure myself and 1000 other ASA pilots would take it in a heartbeat.

 

[rattler]

If I am not mistaken, I think the insurance company that underwrites that GV is going to be most reluctant to allow you to fly that aircraft as PIC with a brand new GV type and zero experience-a issue you might want to discuss with your buddy

Good point, but it hasn't been brought up. I do know however it is not unheard of to hire into left left seat of jet aircraft. As previously stated I do not have Gulfstream experience, but I do have a fair amount PIC jet time. A very good question, I will look into it.