SkyWest ALPA VARS Update

[ASADriver]

And this guy left five years at the most lucrative regional airline contract out there to go to a non-union shop why? He's probably pissed at ALPA because he got fired for something so egregious that ALPA couldn't get his job back. Now he has to start over...all because of ALPA.

No he probably left because of upgrade potential. If Skywest is hiring 70 per month, the upgrade is probably quicker for him. At this level it is all about the upgrade potential - for the $ and for the PIC. Capt. at Skywest is better than FO at any carrier - union or not.

 

[Ponchus pilot]

Ya, as you can see from the rest of the alpa carriers....alpa is helping out many pilots!(No one at united, delta, etc took a pay cut....What retirement?) Hey, didn't alpa start the internet too? THEBEST

This is the typical BS you hear from guys that have absolutely no Idea how the Union works. Very weak respose dude.

Pompus Pilot, I need to know soon when ALPA is voted in because we can get the contract settled that afternoon and I wont know what to do with all that extra money. Should I get the new Mercedes or should I go with the new boat?

Same as above. Now go have a CFIT.

 

[ASADriver]

Just FWIW to all the SkyW folks, ALPA isnt perfect (as has been mentioned numerous times before) but their legal and medical departments are top notch. I've known many a pilot who is still employed and flying today thanks to ALPA. To me, its worth having ALPA simply for that reason.

Just my $.02

How many people actually benefit from the medical and legal parts of ALPA? I bet you the majority of ALPA pilots never use either.

 

[Ponchus pilot]

And this guy left five years at the most lucrative regional airline contract out there to go to a non-union shop why? He's probably pissed at ALPA because he got fired for something so egregious that ALPA couldn't get his job back. Now he has to start over...all because of ALPA.

I'm sure you'll recognize this one "If ignorance is bliss why isn't FlightInfo full of happy pilots?"

 

[Stifler's Mom]

How many people actually benefit from the medical and legal parts of ALPA? I bet you the majority of ALPA pilots never use either.

I hope I don't need either of them in my career, but they're a form of insurance in my opinion.

 

[Ponchus pilot]

How many people actually benefit from the medical and legal parts of ALPA? I bet you the majority of ALPA pilots never use either.

You'll be surprised. I was on medical leave for two years and I got paid because we had a contract as well as monthly pay and a 50k lump sum pay from ALPA. I kept my insurance and benefits on top of that at the same rate as when I was flying. I cant say enough good things about what they did for me. Plus the aeromedical office does all the paperwork to get my medical back for free. This costs a lot of money if its out of pocket.
It happens to more pilots than you think and what you get in return in worth every penny and much more. I hope no one ever goes through it, but sooner or later it will happen to most. I'm sure you can get the stats from ALPA.

 

[jetpig32]

Personal Goals? If the pay scale matched ASAs 70 rate, thats an extra 10 g's a year in pay. Doubt performance rewards come close to that.

Im sure the super senior guys don't care. Many of them have certain relations with the company and a union is not good for their personal goals. I have severall friends at skywest and all are exited about the drive.

 

[FanSpinner]

As a former ASA guy, I'm glad we had ALPA there. Different management style at Skywest that seems to work, but have heard some guys who have had bad experiences with no job protection, and management starting to lie to its employees. I will vote yes.

As another former ASA guy I will cancel your vote.

 

[rtmcfi]

As another former ASA guy I will cancel your vote.

And someone else will cancel yours....ad infinitum

 

[atrdriver]

How many people actually benefit from the medical and legal parts of ALPA? I bet you the majority of ALPA pilots never use either.

And what percentage of people benefit from having homeowners insurance? Still have it though, don't you? And yet, every pilot benefits in some way from having a union, be it through pay, workrules, getting their job back, legal, medical, whatever. But of course you don't believe that because you hate everything about ALPA.

 

[Crizz]

As another former ASA guy I will cancel your vote.

Ha...

 

[iahawkeye]

Regional airlines under ALPA are only as strong as their MEC. If ALPA is voted in at Skywest it will be up to YOU to make what you want out of a contract. It is my own belief that this is a much better option than having managment have their own free will. Although many of you may have the mentality of " what has alpa ever done for me" I think that you are missing the main point. You will be in charge of your own contract. Many of you focus on pay, and I think this is just a fraction of what you could hope to have change if ALPA brought in to represent you. Skywest's work rules, vacation, and job security are a joke, among other things! Being from another regional whos MEC gave them an above average contract, (in regards to work rules) it pains me to see my friends at Skywest constantly pressured and abused by crew scheduling, chief pilots, and managment, as well as constantly being afraid for their job. I hope all of you will look at the big picture when deciding on this issue, and make an educated and informed decision before deciding to vote.

 

[txpilot1974]

Skywest's work rules, vacation, and job security are a joke, among other things!

If you say so chief.

 

[thebest]

And what do you think would have happened at those carriers had ALPA NOT been there? Management would have imposed whatever changes they wished and the pilots would not have had a say at all. Grow up.

You have a very weak argument.............

alpa mission statement:
The mission of the Air Line Pilots Association is to promote and champion all aspects of aviation safety throughout all segments of the aviation community; to represent, in both specific and general respects, the collective interests of all pilots in commercial aviation; to assist in collective bargaining activities on behalf of all pilots represented by the Association; to promote the health and welfare of the members of the Association before all governmental agencies; to be a strong, forceful advocate of the airline piloting profession, through all forms of media, and with the public at large; and to be the ultimate guardian and defender of the rights and privileges of the professional pilots who are members of the Association.
—ALPA Board of Directors, October 1992

"To be the ultimate guardian and defender of the rights and privilages of the professional pilots who are members of the Assc." What have they defended? Name an ALPA carrier that has or is going to take a paycut? I'd take the Alpa 2% and put it away for a rainy day.
What about the retiree's? Dontating to ALPA for YEARS only to have their retirements stripped from them, with NO explination or ANY help from alpa! ( $150,000 x 2% = $3000/year x 30years=$90,000) Now this money invested in a 401k for that time would have reached almost $400,000! Now think, what did alpa get me for retirment now that the SHI* hit the fan.....$0! I know lots of you say that alpa raised the bar pre 911. But raising the bar when money is FLOWING is not an accomplishment. What the real challange is, is to get you the money and quality of life when things get bad. That is the reason to HAVE a union...RIGHT! "Is alpa REALLY the defender of the rights and privileges of the professional {pilot}"...History has NOT proven so..........
alpa carrier or not, bankruptcy happened and all your pilot dues do NOTHING!
Now I am not a Skywesty, but alpa was not there for them and my buds say they are doing great? Explain...........
THEBEST

 

[bender]

AOPA offers similar legal and medical assistance for commercial and ATP rated pilots. The insurance that only ALPA has over AOPA, that I know of, is the loss-of-license/medical protection. If the management at Skywest ever got to the point of a TSA or Mesa then I would vote in a union, however management/employee relations are good. Unions can't provide protection to their members from market forces or bankruptcy. They can't save your job if you show up at the airport drunk. However, they can alienate and destroy 34 years of productive and healthy relations with management. If there's such a doom/gloom about being non-union, why is the majority of my new-hire class from unionized carriers? There's even a retired captain from a major ALPA-represented carrier....

I'll vote no until otherwise convinced.

 

[bender]

Skywest's work rules, vacation, and job security are a joke, among other things! Being from another regional whos MEC gave them an above average contract, (in regards to work rules) it pains me to see my friends at Skywest constantly pressured and abused by crew scheduling, chief pilots, and managment, as well as constantly being afraid for their job. I hope all of you will look at the big picture when deciding on this issue, and make an educated and informed decision before deciding to vote.

How's it feel to win the regional special olympics there Jetlinker? Please give a comparision between SKW and XJT so that you can back up your claim with actual facts.

 

[Ponchus pilot]

AOPA offers similar legal and medical assistance for commercial and ATP rated pilots. The insurance that only ALPA has over AOPA, that I know of, is the loss-of-license/medical protection. If the management at Skywest ever got to the point of a TSA or Mesa then I would vote in a union, however management/employee relations are good. Unions can't provide protection to their members from market forces or bankruptcy. They can't save your job if you show up at the airport drunk. However, they can alienate and destroy 34 years of productive and healthy relations with management. If there's such a doom/gloom about being non-union, why is the majority of my new-hire class from unionized carriers? There's even a retired captain from a major ALPA-represented carrier....

I'll vote no until otherwise convinced.

1) AOPA insurance and medial assistance not the same.
2) You cant even compare Skywest to TSA.
3) Mesa has better pay for larger AC and a contract with better work rules, ask a Mesa guy to show you their contract.
4) Jetlinkers airline (XJT) has far superior pay, benefits, and workrules than Skywest. If you know people that work there ask them for a copy of their contract.
5) Copies of many contracts are posted on the net, go study them and see the difference.
6) Skywest has an employee handbook and not a contract.
7) Union provides far more protection from market forces than no Union. There seems to be a myth out there that management can simply file for BK and abrogate the contract, its not that easy.
8) The argument you make about the majority of guys in newhire classes being from Union airlines is weak for a couple of reasons. First I have friends in the Skywest training dept and the majority of newhires are not from other airlines. Second, just as many pilots from ALPA regionals go to other ALPA regionals. You make it sound like its a rush for every pilot to go to Skywest. If that where true there would be not such a shortage of crews there.
9) Even if the one major guy said blah blah blah, It does not matter. In a union the majority rules and if the majority was uhappy there would be no ALPA.

Your info says that you are a CFI and your lack of info on the subject of airline unionism is evident. Try reading flying the line and fying the line 2, excellent books on this subject.

P.S. Being a bender is not a good thing.

 

[Ponchus pilot]

"To be the ultimate guardian and defender of the rights and privilages of the professional pilots who are members of the Assc." What have they defended? Name an ALPA carrier that has or is going to take a paycut? I'd take the Alpa 2% and put it away for a rainy day.
What about the retiree's? Dontating to ALPA for YEARS only to have their retirements stripped from them, with NO explination or ANY help from alpa! ( $150,000 x 2% = $3000/year x 30years=$90,000) Now this money invested in a 401k for that time would have reached almost $400,000! Now think, what did alpa get me for retirment now that the SHI* hit the fan.....$0! I know lots of you say that alpa raised the bar pre 911. But raising the bar when money is FLOWING is not an accomplishment. What the real challange is, is to get you the money and quality of life when things get bad. That is the reason to HAVE a union...RIGHT! "Is alpa REALLY the defender of the rights and privileges of the professional {pilot}"...History has NOT proven so..........
alpa carrier or not, bankruptcy happened and all your pilot dues do NOTHING!
Now I am not a Skywesty, but alpa was not there for them and my buds say they are doing great? Explain...........

So you want do math? lets try it

Delta top now = $200k
delta top pay before concession= $320k
320 - 200= $120k
400k/ 120k= 3.33 years

Let me see 400K in 30 years or 400k in 3.3 years. I would rather take the 3 years. DALPA had some really capable and smart people negotiating on behalf of their pilot group and I'm sure you werent one of them. Talk about weak arguments. Not a signle one of you ALPA bashers has pointed a single fact in your arguments. It's easy to talk $hit and be negative now, people forget rather quickly how it was a few years ago and without a union it would be even worse. Things always turn around.

 

[jea]

i flew with a guy the other day here- he didnt say hi my name is_____ how are you? he said "when were you hired? did you attend the alpa bbq? give me your email and address ill get you on the mailing list" i said no im not behind alpa- i get enough crap in the mail. i didnt argue with him- however- of all the guys and gals ive flown with- this guy was the only alpa nazi- and the least "sop" he didnt ask for a checklist- missed calls-he was pushing alpa for "our protection" do your job a$$hole that is protection- you should be disciplined- dont push your crap on me on the job... im working! after he was done i asked him about his flying experience, where he lived if he liked the area- you know all the stuff that should have come out in a normal conversation at first.... alpa protects pilots that maybe shouldnt be protected- like the senior instructors at colleges who shouldnt have jobs but are guaranteed to never loose it.

now feel free to rip on my grammar and punctuation. its 1:30 am im tired.

 

[sweptback]

AOPA offers similar legal and medical assistance for commercial and ATP rated pilots. The insurance that only ALPA has over AOPA, that I know of, is the loss-of-license/medical protection. If the management at Skywest ever got to the point of a TSA or Mesa then I would vote in a union, however management/employee relations are good. Unions can't provide protection to their members from market forces or bankruptcy. They can't save your job if you show up at the airport drunk. However, they can alienate and destroy 34 years of productive and healthy relations with management. If there's such a doom/gloom about being non-union, why is the majority of my new-hire class from unionized carriers? There's even a retired captain from a major ALPA-represented carrier....

I'll vote no until otherwise convinced.

AOPA medical assistance is a joke. I know, I used it. It's geared towards the weekend flyer who needs a third-class medical. The information they gave me was downright wrong and didn't help one bit.