XJT Upgrades and Newhires

[Truckdriver]

A new system bid just posted today which shows an additional 4 classes of upgrades in June, July, and August with corresponding newhire classes. Should be about 65-70 upgrades and about the same number of newhires during those three months. This is in addition to the 32 upgrades and newhires in April and the 33 upgrades and newhires in May. So we should upgrade about 130 more by August and hire about that many more newhires by August. Some of these upgrades will be guys who waited to upgrade, but most of them will be guys who were hired in Spring 04. This is probably to cover the increase in block hours that we have for CAL before Jan 07.

I just thought I would throw that out there for anyone considering coming to XJT this summer. In my opinion, you wouldn't see upgrades and newhires continuing if XJT management thought they were going to lose flying in Jan. They would just junior-man guys during the summer and save the cost of training guys they would just have to furlough a few months later. I think you will see XJT use the 69 aircraft elsewhere and 2 year upgrades will be the norm at XJT for the next few years.

 

[Superpilot92]

Hey boss, just read that myself followed by G.S message, and it was nice what he tossed in about the Fuel savings plan and how it is helping us now and for the possibility of flying on our own and or another carrier. Interesting isnt it. I know i am looking forward to this year and am staying optimistic.

 

[Turtlesfly]

What do you think - with a seperate list or with a joint one?

 

[mckpickle]

......In my opinion, you wouldn't see upgrades and newhires continuing if XJT management thought they were going to lose flying in Jan. They would just junior-man guys during the summer and save the cost of training guys they would just have to furlough a few months later.....

Completely untrue.

 

[BeachBummer]

Completely untrue.

I agree, managment will take care of the now... right now, and F@#$ you later. It's the cost of operating.

 

[JetlinkFO]

These guys they're hiring in August wouldn't even be online until Aprox. Oct. at the earliest... after the summmer wave of block hours. Why hire them in Aug. if block hours are going to go down in the fall and then airplanes leave in Dec..... ?

 

[Paul R. Smith]

These guys they're hiring in August wouldn't even be online until Aprox. Oct. at the earliest... after the summmer wave of block hours. Why hire them in Aug. if block hours are going to go down in the fall and then airplanes leave in Dec..... ?

I think it may have somin to do with the fact that we don't lose all 69 a/c at once..Secondly he said hired "by august", not in august

 

[Griswold]

The rumor I've been hearing, from two good sources.
We will all know by the end of April what will be going on with the 69 airplanes.
I'm trying to add fuel to the fire, I'm just posting what I found out during my last 4 day. I hope it's true, so we can move forward with whatever the result is.

 

[Alchemy]

Well, those new upgrades better enjoy the few hundred hours of PIC time they might get before the december 06 displacement bid takes them all back to FO.

At least you can wave to some cheerful, happy, Waterski and Acey pilots flying our old airplanes from your permanent vantage point in the right seat. I'm looking forward to spending my next 10 years there.

 

[ProLine4]

Well, those new upgrades better enjoy the few hundred hours of PIC time they might get before the december 06 displacement bid takes them all back to FO.

At least you can wave to some cheerful, happy, Waterski and Acey pilots flying our old airplanes from your permanent vantage point in the right seat. I'm looking forward to spending my next 10 years there.

OK, so what do you know thats so negative the above will happen? You must be on ARC or a Louisiana/Mississippi overnight if youre that pissed.

 

[Alchemy]

Nah, I'm not pissed, just facing reality....thankful that I can withstand the first round of furloughs when we lose the 69 though.....once we lose the next 69 in 2008, I'm on the chopping block.

 

[dojetdriver]

Nah, I'm not pissed, just facing reality....thankful that I can withstand the first round of furloughs when we lose the 69 though.....once we lose the next 69 in 2008, I'm on the chopping block.

Wouldn't be the first time I was wrong, but can't they only pull 25% of the fleet at a time?

Making it only 51 airplanes the next time.

 

[Superpilot92]

Wouldn't be the first time I was wrong, but can't they only pull 25% of the fleet at a time?

Making it only 51 airplanes the next time.

Correct!!

 

[phishhman]

Correct!!

I may be wrong but I am pretty sure that they can take up to 25% of the original order (275 a/c) within a rolling 3 year look back. Since they took the max, they can't take any until Jan 2010 at which time they can take another 69 airplanes.

 

[chuychanga]

A little common sense and simple math says that if they could only take 25% of the current fleet at a time, then they would never ever be able to get them all. It would take about 19 rounds of withdrawals (which would take 57 years under the CPA) to finally get it down to just one airplane left and then you can't take 25% of the one last airplane.

 

[Alchemy]

So the question is, should us Xjet FO's start applying to Colgan now, or later?

 

[Griswold]

I didn't say we would loose the airplanes, just that we should know by the end of April what happens. Don't be so negitive.

If you have 2000 hours or something, just get a little more time, a ATP and apply to Netjets or Flexjet. I wouldn't go to ColdOne.

Look at the pay at airlinepilotcentral.com for Netjets and Flexjet. The both could be a career move.

Upgrade time at Flexjet is 2-3 years and Netjets is probably 4-6. Netjets has the best new contract around.

If we loose the 69 planes, stay postive and it could lead you to better things, and get you out of the race to the bottom

 

[chuychanga]

I like loose women, but not loose airplanes. I hope we lose all the loose ones.

 

[145 Lawndart]

Alchemy says....

"As a mid-04 hire, I'm going to be thrilled with anything less than a 5 year upgrade at Expressjet. A 4 year FO can make about 40k so it's not thaaat bad, sure, it could be better, but it can always be better.

I think everyone is encouraged by the G-tard upgrades on the last perm bid, but we should all listen to Peter Sailer. This guy knows what he's talking about. As a matter of fact, he told us a year ago in indoc that we would see a G captain by the end of 2005.....dead on. If Peter says movement is going to slow to a grinding halt after 300 more upgrades, it probably is."


It is a little too soon to be bitter isn't it. You still might upgrade before '09:laugh:

 

[Alchemy]

Upgrade in '09 would be a miracle. I'll be lucky to have a job in '09. I've just gotta figure out a way to stop thinking about this, since there's apparantly nothing we can do to control it.

 

[BigDave]

Upgrade in '09 would be a miracle. I'll be lucky to have a job in '09. I've just gotta figure out a way to stop thinking about this, since there's apparantly nothing we can do to control it.

Dude do us all a favor and quit, I am getting tired of flying with people that are completely negative and unhappy all the time. If you do not like the job find a new one. You really have nothing to complain about, you are being paid, you are in a safe environment and you are home every week, think about the people serving in the military, they are gone 6-8 months at a time to Iraq and Afghanistan, they are putting their lives on the line every day and living in miserable conditions and getting paid a lot less then you are. Every time I want to belly ache about the job I think about the people I served with in the military who are over there and those I know that were killed over there and I know I have nothing to complain about.

Semper Fi

 

[Alchemy]

Why would I quit when I still like the job? I'm not bitching about the job itself, I'm bitching about the liklihood of losing it in a couple of years and the pathetic state of affairs in the arena of small jet operators toay. I'd gladly go fly for the military in Iraq (what do those guys make, 100k?), but oh wait, I don't have 20/20 uncorrected, and I'm still working on my degree, so looks like I can't do that. You guys that rag on everyone who never served in the military crack me up, as if there was someone holding a gun to your head, forcing you to do that. I appreciate your service, but don't belittle me because I wasn't able to make the same choices as you.

 

[Alchemy]

Let me get this straight, you work 7 days on, 7 off, 1st year FO makes $46K a year, you stay at nice hotels, you get free food. I am supposedly at the top regional, I have been there 2 years, make $34K a year, have 13 days off a month and overnight in crap place at crap hotels, and pay for my own food, but oh yes I do make a hefty perdiem of 1.40 and hour. Why am I staying at the regionals? Oh that's right I am may or may not be upgrading soon. I assume that more and more of us regional guys are looking to the fractional as a move to a better life. So what the downside? Do you guys have to clean toliets or something?

Wow, and you say I'm negative? Dare I say, do us all a favor and quit?

 

[Griswold]

Upgrade in '09 would be a miracle. I'll be lucky to have a job in '09. I've just gotta figure out a way to stop thinking about this, since there's apparantly nothing we can do to control it.

You just said all you needed to say, so SHUT UP, get a drink, listen to some Buffet and relax

If you plan on spending the next 10 years here, you should just give up now. I hope I never fly with your bitchy ass

 

[Griswold]

Alchemy,

Go to ColdOne, they could use a guy like you, I'm sure you could find someone to bitch with you about something going on over there

 

[Alchemy]

I hope I never fly with your bitchy ass

The feeling is mutual.

 

[Griswold]

Please take me advise and relax on this whole issue. Your career will be ok, if you change you attitude. I'm just trying to help you. You seem new to this whole airline thing. If you haven't noticed, we are not the only airline with something crappy going on. Everything will work out, even if you get pushed out of a job, it's only a regional, not a major. Hope you understand what I'm trying ot say.

We will never know if we have flown or will fly together, but if we have or will, I'm a good guy, and I'm sure you are too, just please wake up and don't worry so much.

 

[~~~^~~~]

Why not request some help from your national union? If ALPA would allow any of us to negotiate scope within our brand, this would not be happening.

I keep hoping resolutions will start popping up at LEC meetings, LET IT HEREBY BE RESOLVED, that we will not negotiate contracts to facilitate bidding on eachother's flying....