XJ to NWA -- Perhaps not.

[IbeFlyenhye]

I offer this bit of information for those attempting to career plan.

The source: an NWA manager who asked HR directly.

If you are an XJ pilot wanting to move to NWA your conduit is the forthcoming flow-through program, and only the flow-through. Being an XJ pilot wll prevent you from being considered if you have an individual application on file with NWA.

A policy to consider and, as with every other policy in the aviation industry, probably not absolute, and subject to change without notice.

 

[johnsonrod]

I offer this bit of information for those attempting to career plan.

The source: an NWA manager who asked HR directly.

If you are an XJ pilot wanting to move to NWA your conduit is the forthcoming flow-through program, and only the flow-through. Being an XJ pilot wll prevent you from being considered if you have an individual application on file with NWA.

A policy to consider and, as with every other policy in the aviation industry, probably not absolute, and subject to change without notice.

We get your point. However, any career plan should also consider other alternatives like Delta, UAL, UPS/Fedex, SWA, Netjets (now has an MSP domicile), etc. NWA isn't the be all end all airline out there...

 

[T-prop]

Probably the easiest way to NOT get hired by a Legacy is to fly feed for them... with the exception of CAL.

If you want to get on with NWA, fly anywhere by an airlink feeder.

If you want to get on with AA, don't go to eagle.

If you want to go to Delta, don't fly for a DCI carrier.

 

[SEVEN]

Probably the easiest way to NOT get hired by a Legacy is to fly feed for them... with the exception of CAL.

If you want to get on with NWA, fly anywhere by an airlink feeder.

If you want to get on with AA, don't go to eagle.

If you want to go to Delta, don't fly for a DCI carrier.

Why?.

 

[big shacks]

History

 

[Raskal]

I've heard this same thing from other sources at NWA, but for the life of me I can't understand it. I mean, what's the difference?

 

[Quack]

I've heard this same thing from other sources at NWA, but for the life of me I can't understand it. I mean, what's the difference?

Because when they hire you from Mesaba/PNCL/CPS, they are only shooting themselves in the foot. They now have to train you at NWA and find a new hire to be your replacement and train at Mesaba. By hiring outside the group, they only are paying for one person to train. Simple economics...

 

[Dumb Pilot]

That is not helped by the culture of hate that the mainline drivers have againts their feeders

 

[T-prop]

Because when they hire you from Mesaba/PNCL/CPS, they are only shooting themselves in the foot. They now have to train you at NWA and find a new hire to be your replacement and train at Mesaba. By hiring outside the group, they only are paying for one person to train. Simple economics...

Exactly,

When the AA eagle flowthrough was working it was supposed to be one for one. One eagle ca for every off-the-street hire. AA was hiring 100 pilots a month. Eagle (owned by AMR) could not afford 50 CA's leaving a month. So instead of letting them leave, they issued them AA seniority numbers and would be released to AA when they could afford to let them leave. Instead of 50 a month, only 5-6 a month got to flow through 'till 9-11...

Only 150 flowed through. 400 more got stuck in Eagle purgatory.

Of those 150 that flowed through they were 10-15 year Eagle captains that finally got into a Legacy at 40+ years old. At the same time, AA was hiring 24 year old Great Lakes pilots. Think about it...

If you are going to Compass or Mesaba and plan on flowing into NWA. Go to Colgan as a street captain and you will get hired by NWA a couple of years sooner than you would if you waited to qualify for a flowthrough at Compass or Mesaba.

You don't need to have 1000 TPIC or know anyone at NWA to get hired. Why go to or Mesaba/Compass and wait years to qualify for flowthrough?

Flowthroughs only works for the senior pilots and the ones that cannot get hired anywhere else...

 

[Speedtape]

Probably the easiest way to NOT get hired by a Legacy is to fly feed for them... with the exception of CAL.

If you want to get on with NWA, fly anywhere by an airlink feeder.

If you want to get on with AA, don't go to eagle.

If you want to go to Delta, don't fly for a DCI carrier.

Although there may be some truth to this at AMR and Eagle, it is untrue at Delta and DCI. Delta has always hired ASA pilots, as many as 10-12 a month, during at least the last two hiring cycles. Other DCI pilots have been hired there as well. It was metered at ASA to about 10-12 per month to allow for replacement, according to a former VP of flight ops.

NWA has also hired pilots from it's feeder ranks.

 

[John Pennekamp]

Although there may be some truth to this at AMR and Eagle, it is untrue at Delta and DCI. Delta has always hired ASA pilots, as many as 10-12 a month, during at least the last two hiring cycles. Other DCI pilots have been hired there as well. It was metered at ASA to about 10-12 per month to allow for replacement, according to a former VP of flight ops.

NWA has also hired pilots from it's feeder ranks.

Delta doesn't own ASA, therefore ASA attrition is not their problem. Compared to ASA pilots, how many Comair pilots has Delta hired?

 

[YourPilotFriend]

Simple economics mostly; It's also a conflict of interest if NWA is holding a more senior pilot at mesaba to the flow agreement(seat locks, waiting for a number, etc), while hiring junior pilots to bypass them on seniority. Also, in a pilot shortage, you want to pull pilots from your direct competitors.

 

[Mesabi Miner]

This thread is accurate. I have a buddy with my seniority that left XJ in the spring of 07 for Spirit. He's now at NWA in DC-9 class - with less than 500 PIC T. The only XJers now at NWA outside of the flow that I know of were previously hired into the pool long ago.

MM

 

[Occam's Razor]

That is not helped by the culture of hate that the mainline drivers have againts their feeders

1. Pilots don't hire. At NWA. Anywhere else. Ergo, your lame premise fails ipso facto.

2. Flow-thru agreements negotiated by the mainline for the benefit of their feeders would indicate something other than "hate".

3. Learn from your parent's mistake and sterilize the turkey baster first. That might prevent future undesirable traits in your blood line.

 

[MusicMan]

1. Pilots don't hire. At NWA. Anywhere else. Ergo, your lame premise fails ipso facto.

2. Flow-thru agreements negotiated by the mainline for the benefit of their feeders would indicate something other than "hate".

3. Learn from your parent's mistake and sterilize the turkey baster first. That might prevent future undesirable traits in your blood line.

You're a real gem. Congrats on being the first person I've read today who has made himself look like a complete muppet!

 

[Occam's Razor]

Thanks!

We all do what we can.

 

[profit]

Well, since nobody else has, let me state for the record.

Thanks to the NWA MEC and negotiators for providing the flow through to XJ. Most people out there don't realize that it didn't have to exist if it weren't for them. (and to Wychor who has wanted this for years, but will never personally benefit from it)

It may not be the seniority integration you all dream of, but its a lot more than you will find currently at any other Major/Regional.

And if Occam's Razor is a "Muppet," he must at MINIMUM be Dr. Bunsen Honeydew.. By the way, what the hell does that mean anyway, calling someone a MUPPET?

 

[XJohXJ]

I always thought the Sam the Eagle would fit in well on this site.

 

[Occam's Razor]

Maybe...but I do look a lot like Dr. Bunsen Honeydew

 

[xjhawk]

having the flow does a couple things for my career. It opens up the possibility of being at NWA without a interview in about four years. Also it makes movement of the seniority list a guaranteed thing. It also will for the same reason make my schedule better in the future, for people will still be going to such places as other legacy's fedex to name a few as well the extra 3-9 a month going to the flow. So the way I see it, I will now only have to look for work and interview for those places I covet the most. And when my time is up for the flow and I could not get on somewhere better........(there are better options out there even though there is not a base in MSP) I will flow. So in the next 4 years I get a opportunity to fly for SWA FEDEX etc, I will go. If not, I wait for the flow. But I will say this to many out there. If XJ stays a solid feeder for NWA, it is not a bad option to stay. Living in the base you work and flying a okay schedule while making about a 100 grand is not a bad thing.