Wonderful Read. We should LEARN and PROSPER

[becket]

A first year narrowbody FO in the middle east makes approximately 150kUSD/year.

Here's what I know about the middle east. A new hire Emirates wide body co-pilot earns about HALF of what you're suggesting.

Exactly which airlines pay what you claim? Care to offer any proof?

 

[pilotyip]

Man. That's one elaborate hoax then right? I mean really. You expect me to believe that the vast majority of airline managements are more concern.........employees and I can tell you it's a mother ********************er. If life were as easy as you're claiming it it is, all I have to do to get rich is stop paying well, hide enormous amounts of revenue, buy off the entire legal process and convince shareholders that it's actually in their best interest to flush their cash down the toilet just so I can show my employees who's boss.

This actually makes sense to you?

nice touch

 

[pilotyip]

Down to 1/3?

At some point we advocate for ourselves- this isn't a hobby for me Yip, whether it is for you or not

of course not by a 1/3, but the drop ridership in the spring of 08 started the mass layoffs in the industry and the cessation of hiring at SWA. Remember SWA makes money on the 1 cheap seat per leg.

 

[G4dude]

hmmm

It seems to me the death knell of any airline is the phrase "Industry Leading Contract." How can United compete while paying the world's most highly paid pilots? Just curious.

 

[maru657]

Ahhh, United Airlines in 1985. Just before they royally screwed the Frontier Pilots.

 

[AnimalTale]

Man. That's one elaborate hoax then right? I mean really. You expect me to believe that the vast majority of airline managements are more concerned with low pilot wages than they are with increasing shareholder value? Do you realize that the entire US Industry has lost something in the order of 20 Billion dollars over the last 9 years? You're telling me that this FACT is actually just another smoke screen so that management can just keep paying the pilots less Because....Because they just WANT to pay low wages so badly?

Am I to believe that the US Bankruptcy courts are also so filled with "pilot" specific hatred that they routinely look the other way and approve of multi-national, multi-billion dollar companies declaring bankruptcy and stiffing manufacturers, suppliers and ever OTHER employee group as well as vaporizing billions of dollars of shareholder value? The BK courts approve of all of this because they "hate pilots too"? Shareholders are on board with this movement to screw pilots as well? They'd rather lose all of their invested money than see a pilot Earn what he thought he was worth? You're telling me that CEOs and Judges would rather violate the law and go to prison for abusing BK laws and ignoring Sarbanes/Oxley than pay a pilot more money?

Are you out of your Effing mind?! There is no grand conspiracy. The money does not exist. Pilots will NEVER be paid as well as the CEO. They never have been. EVER. I know it's comfortable to believe that it takes the magical, rarefied "right stuff" to fly a jet but let's be honest. It's not nuclear science. What profession that existed 30 years ago, is making more money today in real dollars than they did back in the day? Doctors...No way. Lawyers...a very few. Virtually all brick and mortar jobs have gradually been devalued over the years. The new way to make a ******************** ton of money is in computers, not V1 Cuts.

I agree. It sucks. I'd much rather be buying myself a new cadillac every month but it's just not true anymore. What kind of narcissism exists to convince oneself that the entire world is against them earning more money? How does one come to the conclusion that if a CEO can get a 100k bonus, then that MUST mean there is another 200 million dollars around to pay the pilots? I own a small business. I have employees and I can tell you it's a mother ********************er. If life were as easy as you're claiming it it is, all I have to do to get rich is stop paying well, hide enormous amounts of revenue, buy off the entire legal process and convince shareholders that it's actually in their best interest to flush their cash down the toilet just so I can show my employees who's boss.

This actually makes sense to you?

Please re-read what I posted. DO it without emotion and re-read it carefully. Please dont be naive either.

You, my friend, are already thinking you are worthless. It is a great science to fly airplanes. It is a great ordeal to be a pilot. Never ever discount the fact that flying airplanes is a very demanding job.<----You do need the "right stuff" and proper pay and benefits...

You are a professional and because of that you have learned to make this job easier. Your experience has done that for you. Dont sell yourself short.

I understand, you are a capitalist. I am too. That is why, we as pilots, collectively, deserve so much better.

CYA

 

[AnimalTale]

nice touch

A little too naive for my taste. But, you seem to be happy at where you are at. Enjoy.

Your company must love your hard work and determination. You give them a great discount too, from what I hear.

But then again, you are doing what you love to do and you never went to college.

To me it seems like you made it to the "BIG SHOW!" Good job.

CYA

 

[DIAMONDDD]

Shoot, I know times are tough. Times are tight and have been for a while. I don't want a big raise. I'll settle for the same % increases in pay/bonus that airline CEO's and managers have gotten over the last ten years. Anybody have that info?

 

[pilotyip]

A little too naive for my taste. But, you seem to be happy at where you are at. Enjoy.

At my age getting out of bed everyday with a current medical is happiness

Your company must love your hard work and determination. You give them a great discount too, from what I hear.

Salary you know few people make per hour what I do for flying an airplane

But then again, you are doing what you love to do and you never went to college.

It has been an adventure, and I would change little, BTW A BS Mich State and MA Cent Mich is my college exposure, but it has nothing to do with flying an airplane

To me it seems like you made it to the "BIG SHOW!" Good job.

CYA

Thanks as I said it has been an adventure. I have been real lucky and it has been an adventure and I would do it all over again, particularly the military flying. I wanted to fly from the first time in 1947, I saw a P-51 Mustang buzz the National Guard Armory. I built the models, took flight lessons and pursued getting a slot in the military from my first day of college. Joined the Navy, in 1965, flew all over the world, did neat things, landed on boats, flew in Vietnam. Married a great gal who supported me, raised the family, put up with deployments, unemployment, and moves every 3 years and never threatened to bail out. She can pack up a household in one day to move to the next job. We are all hostages to fortune (thank you E Gann), and do not have the control over our lives we would like to think we do.

 

[AnimalTale]

At my age getting out of bed everyday with a current medical is happiness

Salary you know few people make per hour what I do for flying an airplane

It has been an adventure, and I would change little, BTW A BS Mich State and MA Cent Mich is my college exposure, but it has nothing to do with flying an airplane

Thanks as I said it has been an adventure. I have been real lucky and it has been an adventure and I would do it all over again, particularly the military flying. I wanted to fly from the first time in 1947, I saw a P-51 Mustang buzz the National Guard Armory. I built the models, took flight lessons and pursued getting a slot in the military from my first day of college. Joined the Navy, in 1965, flew all over the world, did neat things, landed on boats, flew in Vietnam. Married a great gal who supported me, raised the family, put up with deployments, unemployment, and moves every 3 years and never threatened to bail out. She can pack up a household in one day to move to the next job. We are all hostages to fortune (thank you E Gann), and do not have the control over our lives we would like to think we do.

Excellent, seems like you could teach E. Gann a few things! For some reason, I think you posted you did not go to college.

I truly think we, as pilots, need to demand better pay and conditions, no matter how much we love flying airplanes. The pilot hourly rate may be higher than the rest of the working industry, but we (pilots) dont get paid our hourly rate on an overnight or layover. So basically, our hourly rate makes our pay "look" higher than the rest but in essence it is lower.

Thanks for your service.

CYA