will net jets change bases policy?

[netjetwife]

That analogy only works when there's a fair distribution of the winnings. That was not the case for the NJA pilots until they ratified the new CBA, and that isn't the case for many other frac pilots. Yes, compromises have to be made, but they should be made by both sides. If your side isn't sitting at the table that isn't as likely to happen. Based on the experience of many in the industry, a high number of pilots are doing way more than their share of giving... without getting enough back.

 

[xpdriver]

Yea, it might be a little confusing..I think i forgot a line. I and others don't feel it will work. But if it does work or do what mgmt wants then all that came here thinking the domicile system will go away in a couple of years will be stuck. Pilots need to accept a job here thinking that they will have to live in a domicile. That was all I was trying to say. i hope it changes!!!

Just remember BB had a master when he was playing hardball with us. Don't believe in white knights.....

 

[xpdriver]

If they are so confident about the domicile system, why haven't they implemented it for NJI? They told us the 7/7 sched would never work. Low and behold they open a 7/7 sched for NJI. They tell us that HBAs cost an arm and a leg, yet NJI has had HBAs from the beginning.

Ofcourse they told us that the hba and 7/7 would not work. they were trying to get us on 8/6 and all live in 5 domilciles..NJI is non-union and rts's little baby(soon on our list) but for now he is going to give those guys what ever to keep them non-union.

 

[TORCH67]

Everything is open for discussion in 4 years. That doesn't mean that both parties will want to discuss it. It all depends on economics (supply and demand). If they can get pilots to come to work in 5 domiciles then it will never change.

 

[Hogprint]

I agree Torch, as long as people line up to fly here, why change. On the other hand I think it will be used as a negotiating tool for the '09 arm-wrestling match. How ever the HBA pans out, it will be used as leverage by either side. I'm confident that if they want to hire as many as they say, then the HBA will open up to everyone.

 

[netjetwife]

It could get interesting if they try to close a domicile and then wanted to reopen it at a later date. There is that matter of seniority governing domicile assignment.

Didn't they originally start out with just a few gateways? I think some people are hoping the company will figure out that there are lots of cities that would make good domiciles. If they don't, it can be pointed out to them at the bargaining table. I can't imagine it not being an issue, even if it's not at the top of the list.

 

[zman300]

Netjetwife: "That analogy only works when there's a fair distribution of the winnings. That was not the case for the NJA pilots until they ratified the new CBA, and that isn't the case for many other frac pilots. Yes, compromises have to be made, but they should be made by both sides. If your side isn't sitting at the table that isn't as likely to happen. Based on the experience of many in the industry, a high number of pilots are doing way more than their share of giving... without getting enough back."

Ah, but that's the eternal question, isn't it: What IS "fair?" Is "fair" getting everything you want? Is it the employer getting everything he/she wants? It will never be fair, and if you're not happy now, you never will be.

I think it's a cultural difference between employees in the two companies (Disclaimer: at least those who post on this forum). We know we're not getting everything we want (or you have), but we're generally happy with what we have. We don't lose sleep over how we're getting screwed or how we're going to make things "fair" in the future by sitting at this table you keep referring to in your posts. Less than six months after your contract was ratified, many on this forum are still dissatisfied, already planning four or five years into the future. You might be dead tomorrow....

"Sufficient for the day is the trouble thereof."

 

[netjetwife]

Well obviously the NJ pilots didn't get everything they wanted or we wouldn't be discussing domiciles... That said, the new CBA based by a comfortable margin so that should tell you that most of the NJ families thought it was fair and are satisfied. They voted down the first pathetic TA by over 70% so that tells you just how fair they thought that offer was. Fairness isn't as difficult to judge as you seem to think.

Both parties signed the deal because it met most of their goals. A compromise was reached. The FOs wages don't meet professional standards so they have a right to be dissatisfied and look to the future. Many of my posts about going to the table are made with thoughts of Options pilots and other posts are just general encouragement for frac pilots who are getting a raw deal. I realize that those of you who aren't in that position may not relate. That's OK. The posts are not made for NJI pilots.
NJW

 

[BBJPILOT]

It could get interesting if they try to close a domicile and then wanted to reopen it at a later date. There is that matter of seniority governing domicile assignment.

Didn't they originally start out with just a few gateways? I think some people are hoping the company will figure out that there are lots of cities that would make good domiciles. If they don't, it can be pointed out to them at the bargaining table. I can't imagine it not being an issue, even if it's not at the top of the list.

What many pilots, and non-pilots at NJA or planning on coming to NJA seem to misunderstand is this concept of "closing" domiciles. The company does not have to close a Domicile to eliminate new hire pilots from "getting" to use them. On any given pilot, on any given class of pilots, the Company has sole discretion as to which of the 5 current domiciles are offered. In fact, the Company doesn't have to tell a new hire applicant, until THE OFFICIAL OFFER OF EMPLOYMENT, which Domicile he will be assigned to, and expected to report to. The "Closing" of a domicile is not likely! Why? Because if the Company elects to close a domicile, all pilots assigned to that Domicile become HBA pilots, with rights to scatter to wherever they want. They can open new Domiciles, or I suppose, open a "Closed" Domicile back up as a Domicile, but even then, all those currently living withion 90 miles would retain their ability to leave to an HBA, and only new hires would once again be required to use such a Domicile.

CLOSING of Domiciles is very unlikely, and as I said, not offering a specific Domicile to a new hire applicant is completely within the Companys rights under the CBA. If they need 20 Falcon pilots and figure they need them in the East, because of existing crewing locations, then they can only offer TEB if they wanted to. That was the whole point, to control the staffing at each Domicile. Currently, out of the "goodness of their hearts", they are informing applicants early in the game, or even letting them provide their dream list of Domiciles, but this is not required. Clearly it is in their interest to know that a new hire has read and understood the Domicile rules and that they allow, as early as posible, for an applicant to tell them that they will not come to work here if they have to go to X. So, I expect it will continue. The rumors of which Domiciles are "closed" is just that, rumor. At best, it was fact for a specific applicant on a specific date, as no Domiciles have been closed.

 

[FLYLOW22]

I predict that the DOMS will increase in number. Pilot hiring will be sucking air again soon enough. Eventually the system, as it is, will backfire on NJA in the form of inability to grow as desired due to lack of qualified meat in the seat willing to relocate.

I like to call the phenomenon "self correction".