Will I get my medical taken away?

[bobbysamd]

Hipaa

Unless you disclose it to your AME/FAA, there is no way anyone will ever find out.

Not necessarily. An employer might ask a prospective employee to sign a HIPAA medical records release. A HIPAA release can state the purposes for which the records are needed.

Review of this web site shows that health information can be disclosed for a variety of reasons. I would not assume that your health information cannot be found out elsewhere - not to mention the penalties for being untruthful on an FAA medical app.

 

[PC12Cowboy]

oil...are you a member and the doc from an HMO ppo?????
thay are easily accessed by the fed.....
If the FAA researched the flight decks of many airlines...the pilots would be looking for werk....especially after 9/11
And some are still on the anti's...but its a dont tell dont ask situation.

 

[HPaul3]

Flylo,

I do believe that, in all the time I've frittered away at Flightinfo, that is the single funniest thing I've read here. I think you might be going straight to he11 ;-) but you've probably done that math already. God bless you sir.

(PS I do catch myself checking out the ladies on the way to the altar a little more than I should...hmmmmm....time to visit the Friar for a little tune-up I guess.)

Son, do you know how many first rate pussum's there are out there just pining away for a caring, sensitive, confused boy like yourself??

I can't tell you what to do about your medical but as one who's been around for over 60 years, married 4 times, isn't paying a dime of alimony and still gets a little off all my ex's every now and then, let me give you a little free advice that WILL help your woman problems.

CHURCH!!

That's right, go to church. All you have to do is take a bath, act lonely, don't pick your nose or fart a lot, and join one of the groups that you know will have a bunch of available women in it; like, "Christians with Throbbing Genitalia" or something like that. Let them help you ease your loneliness and, before you know it, you'll be up to your ears , in women and you won't have time to be depressed.

I can personally recommend the Lutherans, Presbyterians, Catholics and Episcopalians but you most certainly do not want to settle for only one denomination, just like you should never settle for, or worry about, one unpredictable woman.

Variety my boy, variety is the sure cure for depression and.... it's FAA approved.

PS: If anybody is gonna' flame me for being chauvinistic, save the wear and tear on your fingers; I admit it. Like it or lump it.
.
.

 

[Ty Webb]

I can personally recommend the Lutherans, Presbyterians, Catholics and Episcopalians but you most certainly do not want to settle for only one denomination, just like you should never settle for, or worry about, one unpredictable woman.

This post has to be one of the best I have seen on this board in 7 years. Hope you continue to post.

As for the student- if you have gotten yourself to the point where you are a happy, well-adjusted dude who is not taking any unapproved medications, then I would forget about this whole chapter, and chalk it up to youthful indiscretion.

If not- then get help, take care of yourself first, and worry about your medical later, but deal with your own doctor(s), not an AME, until you are ready to return to flying, and then seek out professional advice before proceeding.

 

[Vik]

I dont feel like reading 3 pages of posts but here is what I say:

1) Don't report it
2) Don't fly until you solve the problem
3) If you feel like you no longer need the drug, ask to be slowly removed off of it
4) If you're depressed without it, get on an anti-dep thats FAA certified.

 

[rumpletumbler]

My wife took Wellbutrin once and said it made her feel "Fuzzy headed." I took Prozac a few years ago (while not flying) and it might as well have been a placebo. I couldn't tell ANY difference between taking it and not taking it. In that case I probably wouldn't worry about it. If it does affect you mentally/physical etc. then I'd either not take it or find something that worked equally well that didn't affect you. Walk into a flight school somewhere and go back into the offices where the instructors are all setup this time of year. You will see cold medicine, tablets, cough syrup, nyquill and the list goes on. It will look like a drug store more than a flight school. Ask them if they are all grounded or still flying. The pilots who say they never take anything that is on the list to not take and fly are either lying or they are lying. Here is a good example....

What is the difference between Baptists and other denominations?





Baptists don't speak to each other at the liquor store.

 

[NuGuy]

Not necessarily. An employer might ask a prospective employee to sign a HIPAA medical records release. A HIPAA release can state the purposes for which the records are needed.

Review of this web site shows that health information can be disclosed for a variety of reasons. I would not assume that your health information cannot be found out elsewhere - not to mention the penalties for being untruthful on an FAA medical app.

Hey all,

I have to go with Bobby here. Medical records these days are anything BUT confidential. If you use your real name and pay with anything other than cash, you can bet someone can find out. Insurance claims and perscription information are ALL computerized and can be easily tracked.

If you ding a wingtip or cause ANY kind of accident/incident, the plantiffs and insurance companies in the resulting lawsuit (and there will always be one) will search for ANYTHING even remotely involved with the pilot, and you can bet this will come up. The rules of evidence gathering in civil cases are FAR different than criminal courts, so chances are anything turned up will be fair game.

Past use of unreported and/or unapproved drugs or conditions will be grounds for medical disqualification. A valid medical, of course, is a prerequisite of any insurance coverage. If this is discovered, the pilot's insurance won't pay, and the pilot (or his estate) may become liable for the ENTIRE judgement. Remote chance? Maybe....but do you want to take that chance?

This is NOT worth it. Talk to AOPA or qualified professionals like those at leftseat.com. DO WHAT THEY SAY.

Not disclosing is a bad, bad idea.

Nu

 

[rumpletumbler]

If this is discovered, the pilot's insurance won't pay, and the pilot (or his estate) may become liable for the ENTIRE judgement. Remote chance? Maybe....but do you want to take that chance?

Your desire should be that no one rejoice at your death. If ANY bills (even the water bill) can be payed as a result of your death then you have failed. Let them all cry out with a great cry "let him live!"

 

[bobbysamd]

Meds and medical records

If you're depressed without it, get on an anti-dep thats FAA certified.

There may be no such animal, according, e.g., to 14 CFR 67.113(c):

Sec. 67.113 - General medical condition.

The general medical standards for a first-class airman medical certificate are:

(c) No medication or other treatment that the Federal Air Surgeon, based on the case history and appropriate, qualified medical judgment relating to the medication or other treatment involved, finds --

(1) Makes the person unable to safely perform the duties or exercise the privileges of the airman certificate applied for or held; or
(2) May reasonably be expected, for the maximum duration of the airman medical certificate applied for or held, to make the person unable to perform those duties or exercise those privileges.

Technically, there is no such thing as "FAA-certified" medications, because, pursuant to 14 CFR 67.113, if you need medication you are unable to safely perform the duties of your airman certificate. Also see 14 CFR 67.213 (general medical standards for second class airman medical certification) and 14 CFR 67.313 (general medical standards for third class airman medical certification).

As far as release of medical records goes, HIPAA notwithstanding, the FAA has a right to review your records pursuant to 14 CFR 67.413:

Sec. 67.413 - Medical records.

(a) Whenever the Administrator finds that additional medical information or history is necessary to determine whether an applicant for or the holder of a medical certificate meets the medical standards for it, the Administrator requests that person to furnish that information or to authorize any clinic, hospital, physician, or other person to release to the Administrator all available information or records concerning that history. If the applicant or holder fails to provide the requested medical information or history or to authorize the release so requested, the Administrator may suspend, modify, or revoke all medical certificates the airman holds or may, in the case of an applicant, deny the application for an airman medical certificate. (b) If an airman medical certificate is suspended or modified under paragraph (a) of this section, that suspension or modification remains in effect until the requested information, history, or authorization is provided to the FAA and until the Federal Air Surgeon determines whether the person meets the medical standards under this part.

(emphasis added)

So, like it or not, to obtain or retain your medical, your medical records are fair game. You have to give permission to disclose them to the FAA. Or, if you choose not to disclose a condition, your records can be obtained through other means, eventually, and failure to disclose could cost you your medical and/or opportunities.

Best thing, still, in this situation is to get real, professional advice.

 

[GogglesPisano]

The medical profession is the natural enemy of the aviation profession.

 

[bobbysamd]

The medical profession is the natural enemy of the aviation profession.

. . . . and an enemy from within.

Don't forget the stories about doctors and Bonanzas.

 

[Singlecoil]

If you think using psycho-active drugs and flying mix, I would suggest you read this accident report: http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief2.asp?ev_id=20010816X01703&ntsbno=ANC01FA093&akey=1After this accident, I would think anti-depressants would be a red flag for the boys in Oklahoma City.

My advice would be to stop the drugs, see a psychologist if you need further help, not a psychiatrist, and keep your mouth shut about it with the FAA. They only found out about the above pilot because he died and they did an extensive investigation after the toxological results showed drugs in his system.

 

[rumpletumbler]

I can't even sit on the couch good taking codeine......I'm not sure how this guy flew.

 

[ifly4food]

OK Ifly4food, let me see if I understand you correctly. Are you saying to lie to the FAA when it comes time for my medical this June? I'm looking at an example of the medical exam application right now in the book "Practical Aviation Law, 4th Ed" by J. Scott Hamilton. He is an aviation attorney, and I have this book for an aviation law class I'm taking at school right now.

Question # 18 of the application asks if you have ever been diagnosed with any of these conditions...it lists many other serious conditions, and one of them is "Mental disorders of any sort; depression, anxiety, etc." So if I was being honest, I would have to put a check next to this.

Then question #19 asks you to write in "Visits to Health Professional Within Last 3 Years." If I was being honest, I would have to write in the times I visited this doctor.

Are you saying to just act like I've never been diagnosed with depression and act like I've never been to the doctor? According to this guy's book, it is a federal felony to make a false statement on any FAA form. Then I could be punished by them revoking my medical and pilot certificates, up to five years in prison, and a $250,000 fine. Those are stiff penalties.

Suppose I were to not put this stuff down on my medical app. What are the chances of the FAA finding out that I really DID have depression and I really DID go to the doctor? How likely would they be top find something like this out, and how would they find out?

It is very tempting to not put this stuff down and act like nothing ever happened, but then again, I would be taking the chance of losing my certificate forever, not to mention thrown in jail, and fined all to he!!. But on the other hand, if I do tell them, I may not get my medical, or I may have to appeal it and all that crap, which will not be a fun process.

The bi!ch of it is, I've never, ever, ever, ever, not even once suffered from ANY kind of side effect of this medication. No drowsiness, no dizziness, NOTHING. I can't even tell I'm on it.

I am definitely in a complicated position, and I have no idea what the f*$k I'm going to do. I need serious advice guys. Please. The jokes are nice and all, but to be honest, I don't really find too much humor in the situation, and I don't think any of you would either if you were in my shoes. Thanks for all the help.

Uh, yeah, that's pretty much what I'm saying. With the new HIPPA law, the chances of anyone finding out (unless you tell them) are ZERO. But you do what you want... I only told you what I and most other pilots would do.

 

[ifly4food]

Not necessarily. An employer might ask a prospective employee to sign a HIPAA medical records release. A HIPAA release can state the purposes for which the records are needed.

Review of this web site shows that health information can be disclosed for a variety of reasons. I would not assume that your health information cannot be found out elsewhere - not to mention the penalties for being untruthful on an FAA medical app.

That would be illegal. A prospective employer cannot coerse you to sign an HIPPA release.

 

[ifly4food]

Hey all,

I have to go with Bobby here. Medical records these days are anything BUT confidential. If you use your real name and pay with anything other than cash, you can bet someone can find out. Insurance claims and perscription information are ALL computerized and can be easily tracked.

If you ding a wingtip or cause ANY kind of accident/incident, the plantiffs and insurance companies in the resulting lawsuit (and there will always be one) will search for ANYTHING even remotely involved with the pilot, and you can bet this will come up. The rules of evidence gathering in civil cases are FAR different than criminal courts, so chances are anything turned up will be fair game.

Past use of unreported and/or unapproved drugs or conditions will be grounds for medical disqualification. A valid medical, of course, is a prerequisite of any insurance coverage. If this is discovered, the pilot's insurance won't pay, and the pilot (or his estate) may become liable for the ENTIRE judgement. Remote chance? Maybe....but do you want to take that chance?

This is NOT worth it. Talk to AOPA or qualified professionals like those at leftseat.com. DO WHAT THEY SAY.

Not disclosing is a bad, bad idea.

Nu

I'm sorry, but that's incorrect. The HIPPA act of 1996 went into effect last year and it bans ANYONE from disclosing your medical records to anybody without your permission. The penalties are stiff.

This includes doctors and insurance companies. This has made it hard to get a doctor to doctor records transfer, and is also why doctors make you sign so many forms now.

 

[bobbysamd]

HIPAA release of records

I'm sorry, but that's incorrect. The HIPPA act of 1996 went into effect last year and it bans ANYONE from disclosing your medical records to anybody without your permission. The penalties are stiff.

This includes doctors and insurance companies. This has made it hard to get a doctor to doctor records transfer, and is also why doctors make you sign so many forms now.

We started dealing with it in the law office in 2003. Our clients have to sign a HIPAA-compliant release form for us to obtain their medical records. The form states the purpose for which the records will be used, i.e., litigation. On our form we can forbid release of the records to insurance companies, etc.

A key point is opposing counsel, insurance companies, etc. have a right to obtain medical records to evaluate a case. They provide their own releases. If a client refuses to sign such releases, defense counsel can apply to the court for an order compelling the releases. In other words, the case stops if a client refuses to sign the release. Also, the records can be subpoenaed if the provider refuses to release them, even after being provided an appropriate release. So, the long and short of it is if there is anything in which you have an interest and it involves medical records, your records can be obtained. I go back to my earlier example of an employer giving you a HIPAA release to sign. Don't sign it and you won't be considered for the job.

 

[ifly4food]

We started dealing with it in the law office in 2003. Our clients have to sign a HIPAA-compliant release form for us to obtain their medical records. The form states the purpose for which the records will be used, i.e., litigation. On our form we can forbid release of the records to insurance companies, etc.

A key point is opposing counsel, insurance companies, etc. have a right to obtain medical records to evaluate a case. They provide their own releases. If a client refuses to sign such releases, defense counsel can apply to the court for an order compelling the releases. In other words, the case stops if a client refuses to sign the release. Also, the records can be subpoenaed if the provider refuses to release them, even after being provided an appropriate releae. So, the long and short of it is if there is anything in which you have an interest and it involves medical records, your records can be obtained. I go back to my earlier example of an employer giving you a HIPAA release to sign. Don't sign it and you won't be considered for the job.

Yes, they can be obtained under court order if they are relevant to a court case. No, the FAA nor airlines can't compel your insurance company to turn them over. And an airline can't force you to sign a release, as I previously said.

 

[bobbysamd]

And an airline can't force you to sign a release, as I previously said.

As a practical matter, don't go along with the airline and you won't be considered for the job. It's your choice.

 

[B GUMPS]

As long as you havent listed it on any FAA medical forms dont say anything about it. Have your Doctor help you get off it the right way and maybe some counseling in the future if you have any problems arising. When you do go renew your medical dont list it. I know its a little dishonest but if your are no longer on it you should be fine. As far as reporting this you will surely lose your medical privledges. It is distressing that MDs prescribe meds to people for such problems in which they are not qualified to deal with. This type of depression is to be dealt with by counselors . Best of Luck.

 

[rumpletumbler]

I've heard a litre of Jack Daniels a day keeps the doctor away. Harrrrrrrrrrrr!