Who went 4x4 with the Lear at Fort Laud??

[SCT]

Fox was showing a Lear 45 (?) off the end of the runway at F. Lauderdale this afternoon. The gear was knocked off. Anyone been down there today?

 

[rumpletumbler]

N-number : N55LF
Aircraft Serial Number : 112
Aircraft Manufacturer : GATES LEARJET CORP
Model : 55
Engine Manufacturer : AIRESEARCH
Model : TFE731 SER
Aircraft Year : 1984
Owner Name : 55-112 LLC
Owner Address : 6701 NW 12TH AVE
FORT LAUDERDALE, FL, 33309-1111
Type of Owner : Corporation
Registration Date : 11-Jan-2002
Airworthiness Certificate Type : Standard
Approved Operations : Transport

 

[C601]

Well I was over by the Exec Terminal, 2mins after it happened we heard about it, Can't say much, but the weather and wind was a big factor as its been your typical South FL summer weather, All 3 gears where ripped of, the Lear 55 looked in kinda bad shape. Lucky they won't have to go far for repairs.

 

[otis33]

Think it was Hop a Jet's plane. Was flying into FLL at the time and heard them repositioning the plane VFR from FLL to FXE . Weather was crap at FXE

KFXE 191539Z 22025G30KT 1 1/2SM RA SCT036 28/25 A3000 RMK AO2 PK WND 22030/1538 RAB37 P0012

and only the short runway was open 13/31 . Hope there ok.

 

[SAMRA]

Sorry big guy, thats isn't crappy weather. One and a half miles and a scatered at 3600'? Today alone my alternate was an airport that didn't have a public gas station (no such things as FBO's round these parts) All the others within range were below limits. And today was nothing special. For the last week alone my home airport has been called +TSRA in almost every METAR and TAF.


Cheers.

 

[supsup]

KFXE 191539Z 22025G30KT 1 1/2SM RA SCT036 28/25 A3000 RMK AO2 PK WND 22030/1538 RAB37 P0012

"and only the short runway was open 13/31"

Sounds crappy to me, a direct x-wind at 25 kts sustained with low visibility. Add a shorter runway and increased ref for the gusty winds. Hope everyone is ok.

supsup

 

[Bandit60]

I used to fly the Lear55 and I cannot imagine landing it on a 4000ft runway with driving rain. I haven't looked up the numbers, but I dont think that is enough runway with it being wet. There is alot of airports in the area with longer runways.

Looking at the video of the accident, they werent even close to making it.

 

[Gulfstream 200]

hate to MMQB this one but..

25kt xwind, wet 4000 ft strip in a Lear 55.

thats all I would have needed to know.

 

[Jump Pilot]

17,000 lbs @ 27c

part 91 - 3186

part 121/135 - 5310

wet runway factor - multiply distance by 1.6

so...

5098 & 8496

That sucks.

 

[learflyer]

You must fly out of HOU or IAH!

 

[LJDRVR]

Sorry big guy, thats isn't crappy weather.

Not to be rude, but until you can even concieve of, let alone alone possess the skillsets to drive a Lear 55 onto a short contaminated runway with that kind of a crosswind, maybe you shouldn't be commenting publicly about what's "crappy"

Do you honestly know what a complete TOOL you come of as in your post? Take your garbage to some student pilot board where you've actually got a snowball's chance of impressing some novice.

 

[Jump Pilot]

Was it drag chute equipped? I think it was max x-wind limit for the chute, though.

LJDRVR - ouch, man.

Gulfstream 200 - Your avatar gives me the shakes. Your man put Sprewell's on that fly ride. Word to the mother.

 

[SAMRA]

LJDRVR. I didn't realize you had such a crush on me. I will stand by my comments.
You seen like an even bigger TOOL for taken offence to my comments. Maybe they should teach you instructors types a little more about the flying world, rather than something you can read in a book.

Can you even tell me where to start looking for the wind direction when your flying over a frozen lake? For kicks lets say the outside temp is -25 and has been at least that for the last week.
I don't expect you to answer that, but there is an example of learning from the real world and not a book.

If you want a pissing match PM me and don't waste the bandwidth of this forum.

 

[LJDRVR]

...and don't waste the bandwidth of this forum.

But dude, that's what flightinfo is for!

Yeah, I came of like a jacka$$ there, but my point was this: your "Sorry big guy, thats [sic] isn't crappy weather..." comment was nothing more than condecending, chest-thumping, implying that an aviator of your skills and abilities wouldn't possibly be troubled by such trifling "VFR" weather. The problem with that is not so much your attitude, (I had one when I posted.) but your myopic certainty that a metar that wouldn't trouble you in a Navajo or Beaver, most certainly shouldn't trouble a Learjet crew.

Pompous Rant Alert: My point is that until you have some experience operating the type of aircaft involved, (transport category jet) you should refrain from making blanket statements desingned to stroke your ego about what's easy and what's not. The average Lear Captain (and I was one for 4 1/2 years.) would have not even attempted the approach given the surface observation and runway condition. I'm not dissing the guys who took it off the runway, (There but for the grace of God...) I'm simply attempting to illustrate that a "one-size fits all mentality should be avoided when discussing what's "normal" Rant off.

DHC-2 on wheels? Fun airplane. Just like a big J-3. (Except for the sink rate.)

 

[Sunnfun]

The average Lear Captain (and I was one for 4 1/2 years.) would have not even attempted the approach given the surface observation and runway condition.

Given your experience, let me ask you why someone (And I'm NOT limiting this question to this particular incident) would even attempt a landing in these conditions. Was it

a) Because the operator was pressuring the crew to bring the plane back? FXE was closed over the weekend and they were apparently just repositioning back from FLL, maybe to pick up Pax. But the Pax were only a 20 Minute Cab-ride from the airplane if they would have went back to FLL.

b) The Cpt. thought it would work out. But according to some data posted above, the required runway was over 1000 feet more than what they had.

If it was a) why didn't they return to FLL and tell the operator that they didn't want to risk it, apparently backed by the required runway req.?

I don't want to badmouth or MMQB the crew either, I just would like to get a grip on what kind of decisionmaking process could lead to an incident like this.

Thanks,
Sun'n Fun