Which Regional is the best to work for?

[Cassive Mock]

Hey all -

My hangar partners kid is flying the 99 at Ameriflight and is ready to move up the food chain. He's willing to move anywhere. My advice was to find the shortest upgrade possible. I was hoping to hear from folks who are currently slugging it out in regionals, what are the upgrade times like at different carriers? Conditions? Pay? Please, no flame. I'd really like to help this guy out.
Thanks.

 

[5ontheglide]

If I were him, I would try Air Wisconsin. 1st year pay - 23/hr. 2nd yr pay - 34/hr. He'd get to fly a shiny jet. The contract is not the worst in the business. I've heard pretty good things about the Pilot group. They just closed down a Denver domicile and have opened up one in DC (this has appearently caused a really high attrition rate lately) -which means as it stands now - I've heard upgrade is happening in 22-24 mos. A buddy of mine recently hired there was told that they need 250 captains asap. This all comes from a guy who doesn't work there so maybe you can get some better inside info from a current employee. My 2 cents - I'd apply.

 

[9rj9]

poor everywhere

the regionals are undergoing consolidation, the 35-50 seat cat is being reduced in favor of 70-100 seat cat. Some like Republic and Mesa will see some growth but not enough for a quick upgrade as the regionals will quickly stagnate as few mainline jobs are available and military guys nab at least 50% of those. The pay which was low before is going even lower, so he could be stuck for a long time.
One option is NWA's new regional, if he could get on with them he could quickly move up. It depends if the mainline will allow it. I expect they will in order to save their compensation. Otherwise send him to law school a much better prospect.

 

[FN FAL]

Hey all -

My hangar partners kid is flying the 99 at Ameriflight and is ready to move up the food chain. He's willing to move anywhere. My advice was to find the shortest upgrade possible. I was hoping to hear from folks who are currently slugging it out in regionals, what are the upgrade times like at different carriers? Conditions? Pay? Please, no flame. I'd really like to help this guy out.
Thanks.

He should probably buy his 737 type and get a job with Southwest until he's got enough time to get an interview at FedEx.

 

[flx757]

I would advise him to just stay at Ameriflight, get his 1000 hrs turbine PIC, THEN look to "move up the food chain". That way he can actually look for one of companies that is the "best to work for" and not simply to get a quick upgrade. These are usually exclusive of each other. It's far better to look at the entire picture when choosing a company, since in all likelihood "moving up the food chain" is a slow, arduous, crapshoot that may never pan out. And if it does, it is usually with numerous false starts. Better to be "stuck" someplace that offers as many good (or at least acceptable) quality of life issues as possible instead of focusing only on a quick upgrade that may lead absolutely nowhere.

 

[wheelsup]

If I were him, I would try Air Wisconsin...-which means as it stands now - I've heard upgrade is happening in 22-24 mos. A buddy of mine recently hired there was told that they need 250 captains asap.

...if you were hired a year ago it could happen in <2 years. However, I don't think the turnover will continue for much longer (say after 8-12 months) as they replace the people that don't want to be there with people that do, and as people move to domicile. I would wager that a relative newhire (myself included) probably won't be able to touch the left seat for 3,4, maybe even 5 years as the turnover stagnates.

One good thing about this movement though, if they hire the "300 pilots" and upgrade the "180 captains" - which was the last number I saw - a new hire will be pretty senior within the year with only 800 pilots on property. Although, looking at the lines, there is almost no advantage to being more senior here, except for being off reserve...

~wheelsup

 

[MINIME]

If he "must" go to a regional right now, the only two I would recommend are Air Wisconsin or Horizon. All the others I would recommend staying away from. We are under attack from respective managemets..no question anymore. Some of the ones I'd recommend totally staying away from are, GJs, Mesa, and TSA, there might be others. Those companies are having a field day with their employees and are to a certain extent part of the reason why everyone else is in the dire situation they are in now.

No disrespect toward current Mesa and TSA pilots. TSA pilots are trying to fight their management but the current political scene is not helping it appears. But as a new aspiring pilot, I would not want to deal with those abuses for the sake of tomorrow. Keep in mind, tomorrow may never come..ie. the next level. I'd say, unless he can go to either of the above mentioned, he should stay where he is at.

 

[captpetefam]

WOW... Tough Question

Well, you said it right... slugging it out. The Regionals are having tough times and it's only going to get worse.

DISCLAIMER-----THIS IS NOT FLAMEBAIT!!! I just had to stick that out there. Everyone has their opinion, I'm just giving mine. This is from what I hear in the industry, from friends, from other people who work at these places, from my personal experiences. I know that there are great guys/gals that work at all these airlines but this is a general rule kinda deal. Generally speaking...

-Pinnacle: Low pay, substandard work rules, treat you like crap, upgrades are slowing, possible furlough soon (depending on NWA).
-Mesaba: Decent pay, good work rules, good pilot group, indefinite upgrades and currently furloughing.
-Air Wisconson: Decent pay, they treat you alright, good pilot group, decent work rules, seem to be doing alright for stability (That's dependant on USAir/AWA future), might be a good place to try for the short term.
-Great Lakes/Big Sky: Horrible pay, no work rules, no respect, not worth the trouble for the upgrade time.
-PSA: fairly standard pay, decent work rules. I have a friend that works there and he doesn't complain. He's a great guy but I can't really vouche for the rest of the group.
-Shuttle America/Republic/Chautauqua/Mesa/*************************/Freedom: SUB-substandard pay, horrible work rules, treat you lousy, no respect from rest of pilot community. The may be upgrading soon but it's like being sprayed by a skunk, you just can't get rid of the smell. The big incentive is "nice, new shinny jets".
-ASA: Things are going to get very ugly, best to stay away.
-Skywest: Not too bad from what I hear. Decent to better than average pay, they seem to treat you about average to better than average, great pilot group, diverse routes, lots of bases, decent work rules, fairly quick upgrade times. They don't have a union but I wouldn't let that bother you. A good company shouldn't need a union. They are on the edge of needing one but not quite yet. This would get a vote from me.
-ExpressJet: Average pay, average rules, things are going to get worse there before they get better because of what CO is doing.
-Tran States: Average pay, I don't know about work rules, Not the best place to be right now with the way Mgmt is jerking around the pilot group. Some great people in the pilot group but not really the funnest place to be around.
Horizon: Fun planes to fly, great routes, awesome pilot group, and the best rates in the industry. The upgrade times aren't the greatest but it's a place he could stay if things at the majors don't improve. Of all the regionals, it seems to be the most stable. --No, I don't work there-- I know many pilots that do and they love it.

Many places are furloughing right now or are about to furlough. The pay is being dropped and some strikes are going to happen. If I was in his shoes (and still decided to stay in this industry - no sarcasm, I'm serious) I would check out Horizon or Skywest.

If you want info on just pay and very basic work rules (min. monthly guarantee), check out http://www.airlinepilotcentral.com/airlines/airlines/airlines-2005030344.htm

Tell your friend good luck. And thanks for trying to help him out. It's a messed up industry right not but I am an optimist. As you probably know, this industry has it's ups and downs; we're just really deep in a down right now and I don't think we're at the bottom yet. But someday... it will turn around.

Cya,

CP

 

[Dodge]

Try Mesaba. Oh, wait....Mesaba will have Saab FO's with 1997 hire dates in a few months. Nevermind.

 

[threegreen]

Ameriflight seems like a good place to be right now. If I were him I'd stay put and get some turbine pic. Otherwise he is just rolling the dice that whichever regional he goes to does not slash pay, stagnate, and/or furlough.

 

[satpak77]

I would tell him to leave aviation immediately before he wakes up one day and is 53 years old and furloughed with multiple ex-wives and teenage kids who hate dad

 

[RP170]

I would tell him to leave aviation immediately before he wakes up one day and is 53 years old and furloughed with multiple ex-wives and teenage kids who hate dad

Best advice yet. I'm contemplating leaving the industry myself.

 

[BusDriver12]

[/URL]

OK this guy knows nothing and his whole post of advice is totally wrong. I have worked at both companies and air wisconsin was much worse working for than Republic. by far. crew sched treated you like complete trash, captains were old and pissed off all the time, and the pay was not very much better, and if you love getting junior manned on your kids birthday and there aint nothing you can do about it,(happened to me) then go to awac.... Republic can under no circumstances junior man you, ever. you never even have to worry about it. all my buddies at Air Wisconsin are absolutly miserable and have potentiall upgrade in the next few months and still want to leave... its really bad over there, this guy knows nothing, i have experienced this first hand.

I would tell him to not get into the industry in the first place, its not at all what it seems to me

 

[MINIME]

Truly the best advice!! This isn't the time in history for anyone to consider becoming an airline pilot. If you can still help it, do something more concrete. Medicine is always going to be needed. Unfortunately sometimes..so are attorneys. This may sound a little selfish given that alot of us are already here. But this is sound and honest advice for anyone who's considering this profession. Stay away if you can help it. Perhaps sometime in the future but definitely not now. I think it's the worst it has ever been.

 

[PCL_128]

"Which regional is the best to work for?"

Simple: none of them! Stay away from the regionals. Stick to freight. Tell your friend to work for Ameriflight until he is able to get a job at one of the good supplementals (Kailitta, Capital, Gemini, ATI, etc...), and then wait to see if he's lucky enough to ever get a job at one of the big freight companies (UPS, FedEx, Astar, ABX). Freight is the only stable job right now, and probably in the future. Stay away from the pax business.

 

[psysicx]

Yes the business world never lays people off or cuts pay only the airlines.:erm:

 

[AviatorTx]

"Which regional is the best to work for?"

Simple: none of them! Stay away from the regionals.

Agreed! 100%

If anything, stick to freight. If he has to fly PAX, have him go to a fractional.

I work for Expressjet. If he comes to work here, odds are good he will be furloughed in 2007 when we more than likely downsize.

 

[jeroom]

Well, you said it right... slugging it out. The Regionals are having tough times and it's only going to get worse.

DISCLAIMER-----THIS IS NOT FLAMEBAIT!!! I just had to stick that out there. Everyone has their opinion, I'm just giving mine. This is from what I hear in the industry, from friends, from other people who work at these places, from my personal experiences. I know that there are great guys/gals that work at all these airlines but this is a general rule kinda deal. Generally speaking...

-Pinnacle: Low pay, substandard work rules, treat you like crap, upgrades are slowing, possible furlough soon (depending on NWA).
-Mesaba: Decent pay, good work rules, good pilot group, indefinite upgrades and currently furloughing.
-Air Wisconson: Decent pay, they treat you alright, good pilot group, decent work rules, seem to be doing alright for stability (That's dependant on USAir/AWA future), might be a good place to try for the short term.
-Great Lakes/Big Sky: Horrible pay, no work rules, no respect, not worth the trouble for the upgrade time.
-PSA: fairly standard pay, decent work rules. I have a friend that works there and he doesn't complain. He's a great guy but I can't really vouche for the rest of the group.
-Shuttle America/Republic/Chautauqua/Mesa/*************************/Freedom: SUB-substandard pay, horrible work rules, treat you lousy, no respect from rest of pilot community. The may be upgrading soon but it's like being sprayed by a skunk, you just can't get rid of the smell. The big incentive is "nice, new shinny jets".
-ASA: Things are going to get very ugly, best to stay away.
-Skywest: Not too bad from what I hear. Decent to better than average pay, they seem to treat you about average to better than average, great pilot group, diverse routes, lots of bases, decent work rules, fairly quick upgrade times. They don't have a union but I wouldn't let that bother you. A good company shouldn't need a union. They are on the edge of needing one but not quite yet. This would get a vote from me.
-ExpressJet: Average pay, average rules, things are going to get worse there before they get better because of what CO is doing.
-Tran States: Average pay, I don't know about work rules, Not the best place to be right now with the way Mgmt is jerking around the pilot group. Some great people in the pilot group but not really the funnest place to be around.
Horizon: Fun planes to fly, great routes, awesome pilot group, and the best rates in the industry. The upgrade times aren't the greatest but it's a place he could stay if things at the majors don't improve. Of all the regionals, it seems to be the most stable. --No, I don't work there-- I know many pilots that do and they love it.

Many places are furloughing right now or are about to furlough. The pay is being dropped and some strikes are going to happen. If I was in his shoes (and still decided to stay in this industry - no sarcasm, I'm serious) I would check out Horizon or Skywest.

If you want info on just pay and very basic work rules (min. monthly guarantee), check out http://www.airlinepilotcentral.com/airlines/airlines/airlines-2005030344.htm

Tell your friend good luck. And thanks for trying to help him out. It's a messed up industry right not but I am an optimist. As you probably know, this industry has it's ups and downs; we're just really deep in a down right now and I don't think we're at the bottom yet. But someday... it will turn around.

Cya,

CP

Are you a medium??

 

[psysix]

What's the QOL at the regionals now? Any with west coast base?

 

[Mr Biggelsworth]

Yeah there's Skywest, Horizon, and ahhhh!, Mesa. Qol, well, I deliver pizza while on reserve so I can pay rent. I love seeing the look on people's faces when I tell them I do this (deliver pizza) so that I can make ends meet since I work at a regional airline. Thank God I get free food and beer at the end of the night (oh yeah, after I've been released of course)......

 

[jws717]

I delivered chinese while flying for Comair, great job to fall back on after getting furloughed. now i am still competing with the mesa punks across the street at Dominos. poor bastereds just do not understand and i have to suffer for it.

 

[FCPhotography]

Do not come to Pinnacle. Contract is one of the worst. He would be much happier at Ameriflight.

No upgrades anytime soon. Will be mowing lawns this summer.

 

[PHXFLYR]

"Which regional is the best to work for?"

Simple: none of them! Stay away from the regionals. Stick to freight. Tell your friend to work for Ameriflight until he is able to get a job at one of the good supplementals (Kailitta, Capital, Gemini, ATI, etc...), and then wait to see if he's lucky enough to ever get a job at one of the big freight companies (UPS, FedEx, Astar, ABX). Freight is the only stable job right now, and probably in the future. Keep away from the pax business.



Yeah....what he said! . Seriously though, great advice. Freight is poised to to grow quite a bit the next several years.To give you an idea ,we saw 2 DC10's(ex-AA;ex-UA) and one MD11 (ex VARIG) sitting on the Fed Ex hangar ramp at LAX getting ready for conversion and overhaul while taxing into the gate this morning. That and the recent 747-400 and A380 orders by UPS should give you an idea where the good jobs will be going forward, Stay away,,,,stay VERY far away from anything large or small that is involved in carrying passengers and stay put at Ameriflight until you get some multi-PIC time. Good luck !


PHXFLYR

 

[Going2Baja]

Skywest hands down if you are talking regionals. Stay away from Air Wiskey - people are jumping off as quick as they can.

Better advice - stay put for 1000 turbine pic and then pick your next company.

Best advice - run away from aviation as fast as you can.

 

[DwayneWorthless]

There is no such thing as the Best Regional. If you are not at a Legacy, you are not worthy of being called an Airline Pilot. You are one step away from being Cargo Trash. Pay your DUES.