Which book

[GravityHater]

Do these entries get made in?

Use
A for airframe log
E for engine
P for prop

alt
carb
vac pump
starter
alt belt
exhaust
prop governor
fuel hose
oil hose
hydraulic pump for gear on accessory case
hydraulic hose

 

[bocefus]

Typically these entries would be made in the engine logbook, however there is nothing regulatory that would prevent airframe work from being recorded in an engine logbook or vice versa. They are seperated for convenience and to standardize recordkeeping. The engine or prop could be removed and installed elsewhere, so it would be a good idea to have all of the history follow it. Again there is nothing in the regulations that requires seperate logbooks for Airframe-Engine or Propeller.

 

[avbug]

As a matter of practical application, I double up on the log entries for certain items. An inspection, for example, gets recorded in each logbook...a phase check or 100 hour will include entries in the airframe, powerplant, and propeller logs, as applicable. If a repair is done to the left aileron, it won't show up in an engine log. If a propeller is removed or replaced, however, it will also show up in the airframe log, as well as the engine and propeller logs. I log each item of maintenance where ever it may be applicable. Often this is in several logbooks.

 

[bocefus]

Sounds like one of the guys who signs off an "annual inspection" in engine and propeller logs.

 

[avbug]

Absolutely I do, with a full description of what was done. At a minimum, even if one doesn't believe in putting a description in the engine and propeller logs of an annual inspection, one needs to include any relevant work or inspection work that was done, including oil changes or samples, dressing blades, AD's performed, required engine or propeller inspections, etc.

In such a case, rather than simply note that the blades were dressed, the hub greased, the oil changed, etc, one may appropriately note that an annual inspection was performed, and the following engine or propeller work done in conjunction with that inspection. One should include compressions or other values, cite compliance with airworthines directives (and as appropriate, service bulletins), and any work done in connection with the inspection). At the same time, I'll include that information in the airframe logs that stay with the airplane.

When the engine gets pulled and sold or sent away the logs for that engine go with it. But for the person looking at the maintenance history of the airplane, having some of that engine history in the airframe logs is telling, and a good idea. I was invited by a local drop zone a few years ago to bring an airplane up to speed prepatory for it's annual inspection. I learned that some 30 cylinders had been changed out on that airplane, and it had been through a couple of engines. A mere airframe entry saying the engine was replaced wouldn't have told me a whole lot, but I found a lot of airframe entries regarding engine work that had been done...cylinders off, repairs to this and that, engine changes. I had a clear pattern of an abusive history for that airplane, and it caused me to dig deep and look very closely at the airplane.

The airplane had a lot of serious problems that might not have been found had it not been for the fact that the log entries were included in the airframe log as well. The history of the cylinder replacements, for example, would have been lost when the engines were traded out...but it wasn't lost because someone was professional enough to make duplicate entries...I had them in the aiframe log, too.

I like to include full details in a logbook entry. I hate seeing entries that include only a hobbs or tach time or airframe time, and a one liner like "changed oil." I put engine and airframe times and cycles on every entry, reference to the documents approving the work (maintenance manual #, etc), part numbers and serial numbers on and off, when the work is next due, etc. If there's a standard to which the work must have been accomplished, I reference that, too. If I'm changing a tire on a King Air, I'll include references to having zyglo'd the wheel assembly, the results, and magnaflux testing of the wheel bolts, as well as the part number for the wheel half packing, and the type of grease with which I repacked the wheel bearings. I'll note how and by what value I balanced the wheel assembly, and the nitrogen pressure in the tire, as well as noting that it's nitrogen I put in the tire. I realize a lot of mechanics simply note that they've changed the tire and assume the rest by putting "in accordance with xxx," but I'e always found that lazy, and I believe it's a risky entry to make.

If there's a problem later, of any kind, weather I had anything to do with it or not, a very good chance exists that I'll be the target of legal action. My word after the fact that "the log entry doesn't say I did it, but I really did," is hardly as effective in court, or before an ALJ or the FAA, than a concise, professional, detailed log entry that lists everything anybody might want to know about the work performed.

Some might call it overkill, I call it professionlism and accountability. There's no substitute.

 

[bocefus]

Nothing wrong with entering a full and accurate description in the aircraft records, but only there is no such thing as an annual inspection of an engine, appliance or propeller. If a seperate log is maintained for an engine or propeller, the entry in these books should only be for a 100 hour inspection, not an annual. Noting and annual inspection and signing off an annual inspection are two different things entirely.

 

[avbug]

I don't sign off such an inspection in the engine or propeller log, but I do include an entry attaching it to the inspection. If AD's were performed, propellers dressed, compression checks performed, fuel nozzles pulled and cleaned, engine boroscoped, etc...these things will be identified as being done, and the entry will state that they were done in conjunction with the particular inspection being performed. One doesn't approve the engine for return to service as part of that log entry, or sign it off as having completed an annual inspection on the engine or prop...but a thorough log entry is very appropriate.

The signoff for the annual inspection occurs in the airframe log.

With respect to 14 CFR Part 43, Appendix D, the "engine group" does include numerous items that shoud be addressed as appropriate, and which are required in the scope of all inspections:

43xD.d
Each person performing an annual or 100 hour inspection shall inspect (where applicable) components of the engine and nacelle group as follows:
(1) Engine section - for visual evidence of excessive oil, fuel, or hydraulic leaks, and sources of such leaks.
(2) Studs and nuts - for improper torquing and obvious defects.
(3) Internal engine - for cylinder compression and for metal particles or foreign matter on screens and sump drain plugs. If there is weak cylinder compression, for improper internal condition and improper internal tolerances.
(4) Engine mount - for cracks, looseness of mounting, and looseness of engine to mount.
(5) Flexible vibration dampeners - for poor condition and deterioration.
(6) Engine controls - for defects, improper travel, and improper safetying.
(7) Lines, hoses, and clamps - for leaks, improper condition and looseness.
(8) Exhaust stacks - for cracks, defects, and improper attachment.
(9) Accessories - for apparent defects in security of mounting.
(10) All systems - for improper installation, poor general condition, defects, and insecure attachment.
(11) Cowling - for cracks, and defects.

Noting that the engine, propeller, appliance, etc, has been inspected in accordance with an annual inspection, in it's individual respective log, is appropriate and correct.

 

[MtrHedAP]

Ok i've got a question.
Which log book would you include the prop spinner or bulkheads?
I have always gone on the reasoning that anything that is not part of the powerplant or propeller themselves it would be an airframe entry. Such as lycoming makes the engine and some accesories and McCauley makes the prop itself, so anything else would be airframe- such as alternator or starter.

 

[avbug]

Generally the propeller spinner and spinner bulkhead plate are part of the airframe. Many engine items may also be customer items that are applicable to the airframe, too. Sometimes people incorrectly assume that whatever is forward of the firewall pertains to the powerplant, and this isn't the case. The engine mount, certain accessories, pumps, etc, are often "customer" items that apply to the airframe, not the powerplant.