When you MUST sleep

[mar]

We all know how the lifestyle of a professional pilot is less than favorable to good sleep habits.

What are your tricks or tips for helping to nod off when you find yourself with an early morning departure after two weeks of afternoon departures and late block-ins?

I have a few techniques but I must choose wisely because one or the other may not be entirely "appropriate" for the activity scheduled first thing in the morning.

I might:

--Go workout at the gym and follow that with an extremely hot sauna.

--A variation of the first one: Just have a very hot shower.

--Have a nip of whiskey or vodka after either of the first two (observing all FAR limitations of course, that goes without saying).

--Take two Tylenol PMs and one beer (same caveat).

--Have a cup of herbal tea and read.

--Or I just won't fight it. I'll go to sleep at midnight and get up at four instead of going to bed at eight and tossing and turning for eight hours.

I find that four hours of peaceful sleep is better than eight hours of tossing and turning.

Whatdya think?

 

[OtterFO]

MAR,


I have to agree with your last statement. I find that if I toss and turn for a whole night, I'm tired and feel like my brain is half a step off from the rest of the world. When I get just a few hours, I'm still tired but, but I can stay focused and make it through the day ok. Several days in a row of reduced sleep, and I'm in trouble though. The Tylenol PM trick works for jet lag and changing shifts too. (day to night or the other way around)

 

[Gulfstream 200]

I have tried it all...

Now I just sleep when I am tired. Period... I stopped trying to figure out the "best" time.

I know Melatonin works for some, but I tried it and it gave me a rippin' hangover feeling....
I have also heard others priase the Tylenol PM thing..I just hate taking anything..

The trick is also to strive for hotels with 24hr room service and 24hr health club/gym. That way you can comfortably live like a vampire if you want (need) to.

 

[banned username 2]

--Take two Tylenol PMs and one beer (same caveat).

DO NOT mix Tylenol and alcohol, the Acetominophen (in the Tylenol) and alcohol can severly damage your liver...

 

[saabtrash]

oh oh, probably shouldn't take 3 tylenols before going to bed after going on an all night bender than huh?

 

[avbug]

Sex.

 

[GoABX]

MELATONIN - Works well and is inexpensive ($3/bottle). The first 2-4 times you use it may have the opposite effect and might keep you up in addition to giving you some wild dreams (named hotties with chainsaws chasing me through an abandoned building). So give it a try on off days.

After a few uses the dreams go away and it causes a deep sleep that makes some feel groggy when they wake up. Most pills come in 3mg doses which is overkill. Using a 1/4 or 1/2 tablet under the tongue, will give the desire effect in 5-15 minutes. When opening the bottle, write the date on it and pitch it after 3 months. It will oxidze and cause you to wake up with a headache.

KAVA KAVA is another choice. It too is not very expensive and induces a very deep relaxation. . .somewhat similar to an experience some may have experimented with in college. 1 pill is sufficient, 2 if you are super wired and need to sleep. It is important to only use the high quality stuff that contains only the root and not any other part of the plant. There is some talk that there may be a link to kidney/liver damage.

Personally, I use neither all the time, but chose Kava Kava for light help and Melatonin when I 'need' to sleep.

For those that don't like booze or drugs. Try a very dark room, airconditioning on cold, ear plugs, sleep mask and beating off.

 

[SpiderMan]

Re: Re: When you MUST sleep

DO NOT mix Tylenol and alcohol, the Acetominophen (in the Tylenol) and alcohol can severly damage your liver...

So does a bottle of scotch a day.

 

[banned username 2]

oh oh, probably shouldn't take 3 tylenols before going to bed after going on an all night bender than huh?

Exactly...

So does a bottle of scotch a day.

You're right, thats why I drink Gin!

All joking aside, the Acetomenophen and alcohol will kill your liver much faster.

 

[mar]

I'm not jaundiced yet!

Falcon Capt--Yup. I know about the problem with Tylenol and alcohol. It's certainly not a nightly habit for me--maybe twice this year, so far.

Besides, I figure I've been working out my liver pretty good and it's nice and strong. Or maybe just a big callous, I don't know.

At least the whites of my eyes are still white.

I'm surprised there was only one vote for sex (and one for "beating off").

I'll have to look into the Kava Kava and Provigil thing.

 

[avbug]

Why sleep? You're just going to wake up again, anyway.

 

[Singlecoil]

Once again, Avbug is right on...

 

[avbug]

Something I have found to be helpful in the past, especially when working uneven shifts or schedules, or doing demand-charter type work, is to pick a half and half schedule. Stay up late, sleep a little later. Or take shorter sleep periods where you can get them.

I don't sleep very much, though I have fantasies about going on vacation to a place where I do nothing but sleep.

There's a lot to be said for the "combat nap."

 

[WrightAvia]

I pretty much gave up on caffene...coffee and sodas with caffene in them. It has helped out a lot.

As far as Melatonin, I tried that stuff a couple of times and threw the bottle away. Way too wierd side effects.

My schedule is causing some problems with resting well. I work a 15.5 hour duty day, every other business day, 10 days a month.

I'm not complaining about my schedule, but it winds up leaving me with one day where I can be up at 3:40 in the morning and one day where I can sleep in. One night where I have to go to bed early, one night where I don't get home till 10:00 PM. Then when the weekend comes around, I can't go to bed early to save my life. So I wind up playing catch up at the hotel I lay over at...sometimes sleeping as much as 3 hours during the day.

Which means, a hard time sleeping at night when I get home, which means I wind up staying up late, which means I can't sleep in cause I slept too long at the hotel during the day, which means I'll need a nap on that day off, which means I can't go to sleep early to go into work the next day, which means I'll have to sleep for hours at the hotel, which means...

 

[Gulfstream 200]

Plus,

as much as I hate to say it...if you want good rest AVOID all the alcohol...

oh thats lame.

 

[mar]

I know what they say

They say alcohol interfers with REM and thus your sleep isn't as high quality as it would be without the alcohol.

But I swear I sleep better after a "nightcap".

Too much is too much and counterproductive towards good rest--I agree.

 

[rfeathe1]

I used to haul night freight & if I was tired & had a long night ahead of me the best fix was a 20 oz bottle of Mountain Dew--it would keep me going all night long. Sometimes I would nap while the FO flew, which was beneficial as well--kinda like Avbug's combat nap.

 

[fLYbUDDY]

Valerian is good. No side effects (totally safe) over the counter herb that will put you to sleep and give you a good night rest.

 

[Ty Webb]

Cast my vote for Valerian root . . . . take it more than 8 hrs before show, though, or you might be sluggish. Kava gives me more of a "hangover".

For the dreaded "O'dark-thirty" showtime, GNC has a Ginseng and Ginko Biloba caplet that seems to help you be sharp without the jitteriness of caffeine. They say to take 1 or 2 but I find that one works fine.

On the subject of Tylenol with booze- definitely a no-no (the Tylenol, not the booze!). As Falcon Capt. stated, you can damage your liver that way.

My years as an EMT taught me that if you like to have beverages on the road, before you go to bed, try Ty Webb's patented "Hangover Helper":

BEFORE you go to sleep, drink between a pint and a quart of gatorade or water, with two aspirins and a B-complex. The aspirin helps your body process the alcohol more quickly, the gatorade provides re-hydration, salts, and potassium, and the B-Complex seems to soak up the booze.

Oh, yeah, 8 hours is OK for about 4, if you have more, add an hour and a half for each additional beverage.

 

[Chunk]

Get the ole granparents to take the two little ones in the avatar <------ for a day or so.

 

[WrightAvia]

Whooooo boy... Good thing you're twin rated!

 

[metrodriver]

have your fo fly while you're going to scan the overhead for a while, unless you're single pilot.

 

[avbug]

Red Bull or Go Fast. After the tenth one in a row, you find that you can go solo for a while...after all, it gives you wings.

 

[WrightAvia]

have your fo fly while you're going to scan the overhead for a while, unless you're single pilot.

We don't have an FO, but for safety's sake I set the radar altimeter at it's highest setting, I set the altitude alert of the KLN-89B to it's loudest alarm value and I make sure I set it to my assigned altitude. Also, I find it's just good practice to keep one of the fuel valves off and balance the tanks one at a time (caravan), that way if I have to relight due to running shy of fuel in one tank...I got enough to get back to where I switched tanks last.

In theory...when sombody catches about three REM movements worth of "resting their eyelids"...what's the first thing they look at when their head snaps back up? The DME, the autopilot annunciator, the attitude indicator or the altimeter?

 

[SuperFLUF]

Tylenol makes a product called simply sleep. Its Tylenol PM without the Tylenol.

Whenever I have a short night (scrambling to get 8 hrs in the hotel or less) I pop two of those and hit the sack followed all to quickly by the alarm going off. (It almost seems like the night was shorter when you sleep soundly all night.)
They do leave you with a bit of a "hungover" feeling but its a hell of a lot better than that no sleep feeling.

Quite a few fellow crewmembers have told me that Ambien works great with no hangover but it can be habit forming where as Tylenol PM is not supposed to. (Probably because it doesn't make you feel good.)

 

[avbug]

Or simply notes weather the rocks, trees, and bushes in the windscreen are spinning clockwise, or counterclockwise...

Chew sunflower seeds. Don't unshell them, first. Chew the whole thing. The shells poke your tongue and gums, and keep you awake. It must work. I haven't run into a mountain yet.

 

[banned username 2]

what's the first thing they look at when their head snaps back up?

My Co-Pilot... to see how much drool is on his shirt so I can determine how long we both were asleep.

 

[TurboS7]

Due to the nature of the beast I fly a bunch without sleep and I get to observe my fellow crewmembers who use Ambium and other sleep drugs. Frankly I think that you are better off not using anything and just powering through the day. When I fly to Europe I will use melatonine but I have been using it less and less. I know that I can go a 16 hour day with 3.0 hours of sleep, and I can do fine on 5 hours. The day after the 16 hour I can only go 10 to 12 hours on the 3 and 5. The third day I am so tired I sleep like a baby, so if I have 8.0 hours in the bed I will sleep very hard. We always have 8.0 hours in the bed but as you all know sometimes you just lay there and stare at the ceiling. I think the trance helps though as sometimes I will stare for 3.0 hours and sleep for 3.0 hours and I feel great. The other key is did you dream, if you remember a dream then you got into REM sleep. Reguardless when I have little sleep I am real cranky and I am sure I am no fun to be around. Dicipline when your tired is like pitching a nine inning game, you just have to do it.

 

[Booker]

Tylenol PM

Just FYI, the sleep ingredient in Tylenol PM is dipenhydramine, better known as Benadryl. Not habit forming, but it can leave you quite groggy when you wake up.

 

[spinfreezone]

BEFORE you go to sleep, drink between a pint and a quart of gatorade or water, with two aspirins and a B-complex. The aspirin helps your body process the alcohol more quickly, the gatorade provides re-hydration, salts, and potassium, and the B-Complex seems to soak up the booze.

And you have to get up to wee every 20 minutes.