What's been Happening at Flex?

[laser]

For the Flex guys. I left FlexJet 3 1/2 years ago, when upgrades and general growth seemed to be slowing down. I know upgrades came to a virtual standstill for a while, but was wondering how things have been going for the last year or so. I've seen and heard some of the Challenger 300's flying lately. How many are there and what is the planned #? How has that affected the flow of upgrades? Also, is there a pay increase for the airplane? When I was there the pay jump came when leaving the Lear fleet.

 

[Heavy Set]

I really like the look of the Challenger 300 - it has a great ramp presence. From what I hear, the flightdeck is very nice as well. I recently saw a Flexjet Lear 31 on the ramp - I thought Flexjet had replaced those with the Lear 45/40s?

Are things starting to look up at Flexjet with the addition of the Challenger 300 and Lear 40? What is the approx first year pay for a newhire?

 

[TailDraggerTed]

Hope everyone is OK

Saw that an FX jet had a some trouble the other night. What happened? Looks minor. Just pilots on board, No pax. Hope everyone is OK.

FROM NTSB

Regis#: 245FX Make/Model: LJ60 Description: LEAR JET 60
Date: 10/25/2004 Time: 2354
Event Type: Incident Highest Injury: None Mid Air: N Missing: N
Damage: Minor

LOCATION
City: WICHITA State: KS Country: US

DESCRIPTION
FLEXJET, N245FX, A LEARJET 60 ACFT, ON LANDING ITS LEFT MAIN GEAR CAUGHT FIRE, NO INJURIES REPORTED, WICHITA, KS

INJURY DATA Total Fatal: 0
# Crew: 2 Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 0 Unk:
# Pass: 0 Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 0 Unk:
OTHER DATA
Activity: Business Phase: Landing Operation: Air Taxi (On Demand)

Departed: DENVER, CO Dep Date: 10/25/2004 Dep. Time: 2354
Destination: DALLAS, TX Flt Plan: IFR Wx Briefing: Y
Last Radio Cont:
Last Clearance: CLRD TO LAND

FAA FSDO: WICHITA, KS (CE07) Entry date: 10/26/2004

 

[On Your Six]

Are things starting to turn around at Flexjet? I hear the Challenger 300 program is selling really well. Any thoughts from Flex guys out there? Would you recommend Flexjet to people out there?

 

[Pilot's Wife]

I've been waiting to see if an actual Flex pilot responds, but it appears they are all out flying now, so you are stuck with me, a Flex pilot's wife.

The new challenger seems to be doing really well in sales. I think it has boosted a lot of interest in Flexjet. I do not have any specific numbers to give you though, since I have not kept up on the details lately, due to other things going on in our life.

The question we often hear about Flexjet is about the morale and upgrades. It does seem the moral issue is getting better. If you read any of my past posts you will see that Flexjet has treated my family very well, but my husband reached captain before the slowdown, so we have not struggled with some of the financial issues those longtime FO's have. Upgrades are happening, but they are still slow. I think they have hired some new guys as FO's in the 300, but I'm guessing upgrades to Captain in that fleet will be especially slow, since seniority always rules, and any captain senior to you in another fleet can get preference (I am not totally sure on this, maybe someone else can confirm). We don't hear too much complaining any more. Flexjet has tried to address concerns many had with the slow upgrades etc. They adjusted the payscale and did some other things for those pilots who have been getting FO pay for a long time. Something interesting happened the other day though. My husband was cleaning out his flight bag and found a union card slipped in one of his pockets. He has no idea who or when it was put in there, but apparently people are still trying to go that route. Though hopefully they are looking at what has been happening at Netjets and see that a union is not the answer to all their problems.

The schedule is still difficult. A seven on seven off would be sooo much better, but they do not offer that now.

As I said before, Flexjet has been good to us. It still is not perfect (especially the schedule and slow upgrades). This can be a difficult job for those with a family. Our kids seem to suffer the most with their daddy being gone so much.

I hope I answered some of your questions and will do my best to find out anything else you want to know.

 

[On Your Six]

I've been waiting to see if an actual Flex pilot responds, but it appears they are all out flying now, so you are stuck with me, a Flex pilot's wife.

The new challenger seems to be doing really well in sales. I think it has boosted a lot of interest in Flexjet. I do not have any specific numbers to give you though, since I have not kept up on the details lately, due to other things going on in our life.

The question we often hear about Flexjet is about the morale and upgrades. It does seem the moral issue is getting better. If you read any of my past posts you will see that Flexjet has treated my family very well, but my husband reached captain before the slowdown, so we have not struggled with some of the financial issues those longtime FO's have. Upgrades are happening, but they are still slow. I think they have hired some new guys as FO's in the 300, but I'm guessing upgrades to Captain in that fleet will be especially slow, since seniority always rules, and any captain senior to you in another fleet can get preference (I am not totally sure on this, maybe someone else can confirm). We don't hear too much complaining any more. Flexjet has tried to address concerns many had with the slow upgrades etc. They adjusted the payscale and did some other things for those pilots who have been getting FO pay for a long time. Something interesting happened the other day though. My husband was cleaning out his flight bag and found a union card slipped in one of his pockets. He has no idea who or when it was put in there, but apparently people are still trying to go that route. Though hopefully they are looking at what has been happening at Netjets and see that a union is not the answer to all their problems.

The schedule is still difficult. A seven on seven off would be sooo much better, but they do not offer that now.

As I said before, Flexjet has been good to us. It still is not perfect (especially the schedule and slow upgrades). This can be a difficult job for those with a family. Our kids seem to suffer the most with their daddy being gone so much.

I hope I answered some of your questions and will do my best to find out anything else you want to know.

Thanks for the update. Wow, people being hired into the 300? I thought that was not going to be the case. Does anyone know what proportion of newhires are hired into either the 300 or the 604? Do most go directly into the 40/45 or 60? I have heard good things about the 604.

 

[Cpt Splash]

Flex is still hiring and they are growing. About 10 Fos a month. If you want specifics, PM me. Fly safe

 

[sunkilr73]

Thanks for the update. Wow, people being hired into the 300? I thought that was not going to be the case. Does anyone know what proportion of newhires are hired into either the 300 or the 604? Do most go directly into the 40/45 or 60? I have heard good things about the 604.

FLEXJET IS NOT HIRING F/O'S INTO THE CL-300,INTHE FUTURE THEY PROBABLY WILL. THEY HAVE BEEN HIRING ABOUT 10 F/O'S A MONTH INTO THE 40/45, 60, 604.

 

[On Your Six]

What are you guys hearing about the 300? As nice to fly as expected? Are they flown over to Hawaii and across the Pond for Flexjet?

Gotta admit, I really like Flexjet's fleet or aircraft... Just wish they still had a few Globals...

 

[TWA 2 ASA FO]

Info from the school house:

I am one of the luck ones who got hired at FlexJet and is currently going through ground school. I am being trained on the Lear 40/45 (a great aircraft, but the FMS is so backwards from EVERYTHING else I have flown). They are planning on hiring 10/month next year, but since attrition is always low around the holidays (no one wants to be in training) they have not put another class behind us yet. We are only a class of 4 that start on the 14th of October.

As for hiring into the 300, that is going to happen soon. From what c/p's etc told us, they released some F/O's to bid lateraly (F/O - F/O) when they got the 300 on the property, but all those people have already been awarded it and are awaiting training. All future 300 slots will be filled by new-hires. The CP explained it to me as, whatever equipment you get hired into as an F/O is what you will stay on until you upgrade. There are exceptions, but that is what the norm is.

As for anyone wanting to come here, their training has been fabulous. The schoolhouse here in DFW is top-notch and all the instructors we have had so far are really great guys. They do the 1 month as an instructor, then 1 month fliyng the line here, so the guys aren't burnt out of either. One of the main complaints I had about airline training was that instructors didn't fly the line enough to relate real-world experiences in the classroom. That is definately not the case here. If you were to ask, "But how does this actually function on the road?" they don't look at you with a blank stare and say, "The book says this."

Looking forward yo getting out and flying the plane, can't wait to climb more than 500 fpm above FL200, man the CRJ is a pig.

 

[LXJ31]

Hey all,

I'm one of the FO's who switched fleets on to the 300. Fantastic airplane, roomy, good performer and designed specifically for fractional use. I came off the Lear 31 so the bugger feels like a cruise liner to me. One of the cool things about it is the simplicity of the systems; they were designed by both the pilots and mechanics, rather than some techno-geek trying to re-invent the wheel. Most of the aircraft's systems, especially engine parts, accessories and hydraulic were designed as Line Replaceable Units. The LRUs can be swapped out within 20 minutes with the part on hand. The paperwork takes longer.

Overall the aircraft is very reliable. We've been doing a decent number of demos which seem to be going pretty well. We'll just see where it goes from here. (The 31 is finally going away in about a year. It wasn't for lack of interest; I know alot of people are sad to see it go but it was just too expensive to operate for what could be charged for it. My understanding is that the overall operating costs of the A/C were comparable with the 60 for obviously lower revenue.)

As far as Flexjet itself, things are fairly decent; I'd like to upgrade and make more money but who doesn't? But I'm gradually getting near the top of the FO list so it will come one of these days. They've upgraded a few people recently and there were a couple of retirements. The health and dental is a good package. Wish there were more gateways (if that happens, I'd pack for a cold rotation in Hell.) Three vacations a year, each worth about two weeks.

The negatives continue to be some screwed up schedules, not for everyone but when a guy gets a bad schedule he screams bloody murder so you hear about it. Seniority doesn't seem to be a big priority on crew scheduling or crew assignments. It has more to do with convenience and cost. If they have to send a pilot to PIT and they can send a guy either from NYC or LAX, they'll send whoever is cheapest in terms of airline ticket, regardless of seniority. Which I can understand from a cost-benefit point of view but... The hotels are generally ok, you get some good ones and some bad ones but overall they are decent but not spectacular. I wish they'd listen to us more on the road when a nice hotel close by with restaurants is passed over in favor of a more expensive hotel further away.

The new sales teams looks like they are doing a much better job than that knucklehead they had brought in from Gulfstream, a definite upgrade .

Not sure when they will fly the 300s oceanic, but I've heard a rumor about February. However, that is not official, so I really don't know. But it is certainly capable.

Overall, I'd say I'm cautiously optimistic.

 

[laser]

What is the pay increase for captains going from the Lear fleet to the Challenger 300? At the time I left it was about 15K more to go to the 604.

 

[LXJ31]

Not sure. I'll make the next guy I fly with buy dinners till he says "uncle." That should give me a good idea.