what's a sub 1500TT Lakes dude to do?

[Twisted Mind]

There is more than one way to accomplish your goals.
I have bought a few airplanes. The best day was when I sold them for several thousands in profit. AND I was able to fly them for a while and enjoy the time I had with them. Would you pass up the oppourinity to buy a yacht for 1/2 it's value enjoy it for a year and then sell it?

 

[acpilot]

How about stop the buy your own airplane BS. Get paid to fly, CFI, Banner tow ect. Do not buy an airplane!!!!

Why not buy?

The GA crowd is much more pleasant than the pros. Flying GA is actually fun.

 

[acpilot]

Glider time is a fixed wing aircraft, and yes it counts. I had 600 hrs of glider when I got my ATP with 1500 hrs total (oh, and you can do cross country in a glider as well). Your statement of serving no purpose, I would have to strongly disagree. If you or anyone needs the total time I would suggest that going for your glider add on rating and seeing if you have the skill to stay aloft and build time would serve a great purpose. I guarantee you will be an far better pilot after the experience.

You can also fly a lot higher than any airliner. Just need to find a big wave. Do a loop or two on your way down, too. Maybe a hammerhead for good measure.

 

[SpauldingSmails]

What? Just don't bend it. No need for insurance. $0

Just be very careful not to bump into anything that isn't yours, and hope the rest of the world is as careful. :erm:

 

[BGSkyGuy]

You could flight instruct or fly 135 like the rest of us had to.

One bitter dude. You should do something else for a living. Life's too short.

How does that make him bitter? I've been watching this thread with great interest, and I don't see what the big fuss is about. I see a lot of entitlement mentality. The FAA has changed the rules and like it or not you"ll have to live by them.

I did the CFII MEI thing and busted my ass at it. Still didn't have the time I needed so I drove 700 miles to a place where I could build lots of MEI time and fly fire patrols in 150's while I was at it. 8.0 in a 150 at 1000 AGL was pure misery but the logbook got fatter and fatter. I could have easily stopped midstream and got on at a regional but that wasn't what I wanted to do. I wanted to fly corporate. So rather than go for the Big shiny jet I drove another 900 miles to take a gig flying checks in 310's and Barons. Built some quick time there and impressed the boss enough that i got tapped for a BE20 slot. Built a ton of TPIC and great experience that I took into my next job managing a twin turboprop for a wealthy doctor. Spent two years there learning the admin side. Even bought and sold a plane for him in the process. All this time I had been networking at my dream job. Last year it all paid off. Went from a 30yr old turboprop to a Hawker and two brand new Challenger 300's.

My way is not the only way by any stretch and a lot of it had to do with luck. But most of it is a direct result of hard work and good references. There are still ways to get the time and get paid while doing it. It just takes sacrifice and hard work. I enjoyed every minute of it (except the fire patrols) and wouldn't change a thing. Every pilot out there who is in a tough spot can get out. The next job may not be the brass ring but it is one step closer if you play your cards right.

If a major is where you want to be then get your ass in gear and build that 1500 any way you can. Go to the best regional you can and work your ass off. Don't complain about the conditions unless you're willing to change them. It's just a stepping stone to your ultimate goal. People will notice. Eventually that hard work will pay off.

Rant over

 

[pilotyip]

How does that make him bitter? I've been watching this thread with great interest, and I don't see what the big fuss is about. I see a lot of entitlement mentality. The FAA has changed the rules and like it or not you"ll have to live by them.

I did the CFII MEI thing and busted my ass at it. Still didn't have the time I needed so I drove 700 miles to a place where I could build lots of MEI time and fly fire patrols in 150's while I was at it. 8.0 in a 150 at 1000 AGL was pure misery but the logbook got fatter and fatter. I could have easily stopped midstream and got on at a regional but that wasn't what I wanted to do. I wanted to fly corporate. So rather than go for the Big shiny jet I drove another 900 miles to take a gig flying checks in 310's and Barons. Built some quick time there and impressed the boss enough that i got tapped for a BE20 slot. Built a ton of TPIC and great experience that I took into my next job managing a twin turboprop for a wealthy doctor. Spent two years there learning the admin side. Even bought and sold a plane for him in the process. All this time I had been networking at my dream job. Last year it all paid off. Went from a 30yr old turboprop to a Hawker and two brand new Challenger 300's.

My way is not the only way by any stretch and a lot of it had to do with luck. But most of it is a direct result of hard work and good references. There are still ways to get the time and get paid while doing it. It just takes sacrifice and hard work. I enjoyed every minute of it (except the fire patrols) and wouldn't change a thing. Every pilot out there who is in a tough spot can get out. The next job may not be the brass ring but it is one step closer if you play your cards right.

If a major is where you want to be then get your ass in gear and build that 1500 any way you can. Go to the best regional you can and work your ass off. Don't complain about the conditions unless you're willing to change them. It's just a stepping stone to your ultimate goal. People will notice. Eventually that hard work will pay off.

Rant over

couldn't agree more. It fits with what I have been stating for years. It will take you approximately 10 years to get to a job that will allow you to start making QOL a goal in your job search. Pilots get hired at good places because they have Turbine PIC, you must build turbine PIC to have control over your career. You have to go wherever that job is that gets you turbine PIC. You stay in that job until you can get another job that gives you better turbine PIC, i.e. Bigger airplanes, Turbojet, 121, etc. It is called paying your dues everyone must do it. Some do it in the military, some do it at the regionals, and some do in the on-demand business. Everyone pays his or her dues. We are all hostages to fortune (thank you E Gann), and do not have the control over our lives we would like to think we do. The guys who make it to the FedEx, SWA level are very fortunate to be where they are, but there is an element of luck and timing that has nothing to do with their skill or desire.

 

[Hollywood82]

One bitter dude. You should do something else for a living. Life's too short.

Bitter? You clearly don't know me. I've worked hard to get where I am, and I loved every minute of the challenge. Some of my fondest aviation memories are of wiping the dew from a Tomahawk windshield before flying with a student, or helping the UPS driver load boxes into my Metro. It was all a lot of work, but I enjoyed it, and it made me a more well-rounded pilot, better preparing me for the challenges of the 121 world. Sorry if you think I'm bitter, but I have a hard time not doing a face-palm every time I hear some sub-ATP experienced pilot whine about the new regs.

It's also funny you should mention changing careers, because I think the same thing about the pilots who can't see the value of building experience via traditional methods. It just seems lazy. Maybe it's the difference between earned and entitled.

 

[livin'thesim]

Actually, being forced back into the small stuff might get some of the magenta-line kiddies some much-needed stick time.

Here's one for ya:

Career pain is weakness leaving your skill set.

 

[Hollywood82]

Career pain is weakness leaving your skill set.

Bingo!

 

[Twisted Mind]

You would be whining to if you had the door slammed in your face.
Just because you suffered does not mean every one else has to.
How a person gets to 1500 hrs is irrelevant and there is a lot of value in owning and flying your own airplane.

 

[livin'thesim]

I will agree that it is beyond unexplainable that the FAA did not create a grandfather clause for those who were already employed by 121 carriers.

It makes zero sense.

 

[Hollywood82]

You would be whining to if you had the door slammed in your face.
Just because you suffered does not mean every one else has to.
How a person gets to 1500 hrs is irrelevant and there is a lot of value in owning and flying your own airplane.

If you think non-121 flying is "suffering" then you should reconsider your career choice.

Door slammed in your face? You mean while you were taking a sub-poverty shortcut at a job that you weren't qualified to do? Have a little respect for the profession.

1500 IS relevant. Do you think 1500 hours was an arbitrary number pulled from thin air? Read the NPRM??lots of good info. Studies, stats, and numbers don't lie.

http://www.faa.gov/regulations_policies/rulemaking/recently_published/media/2120-AJ67NPRM.pdf

 

[PBRstreetgang]

If you think non-121 flying is "suffering" then you should reconsider your career choice.

Door slammed in your face? You mean while you were taking a sub-poverty shortcut at a job that you weren't qualified to do? Have a little respect for the profession.

1500 IS relevant. Do you think 1500 hours was an arbitrary number pulled from thin air? Read the NPRM??lots of good info. Studies, stats, and numbers don't lie.

http://www.faa.gov/regulations_policies/rulemaking/recently_published/media/2120-AJ67NPRM.pdf

Exactamundo,
1500hrs sitting in the right seat of a 152 in the pattern is OK, 1500hrs flying 135 freight or other stuff is night and day. I fly every day with both pilots and hands down prefer the freight, 135, ect dog as a pilot. Sorry guys learning how to fly in an airliner is a poor value to the pax who paid for a safe fully qualified ride, 0 to 1500ish is the apprentice phase, otherwise look at Colgan 3407.

 

[livin'thesim]

I always felt that those sub-1000 hour new hires really had no business in an airline cockpit. Most are just not all that good yet.

Also, if you fly an airliner, you should have an ATP, seems obvious. You can't fly SIC on an airplane that requires a commercial certificate without a commercial cert. Should be the same for airlines.


Can you imagine how different everyone's career would be right now if they passed this law a decade ago or more?

First thing, we would not have all those minimum-standard gulfstream pukes cluttering up the sky with their substandard airmanship.

 

[Twisted Mind]

Hollywood,

You sound like the guy that is entitled. Just because you did some thing one way does not make it "the best". Airline CA's are suppose to be mentors to the newer pilots. Experience is gained only by doing. Look at the eropean model of training they spend a considerable amount of time developing their pilots. When they are finished the 200hr guys go directly into the right seat of 747 and 777. Yet maintain a high safety record. I talked with the director of training for KLM after he met with Debora and the NTSB. He said she ignored every thing he said and the evidence to support his explanations.