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What In The Hell Is Going On At Flexjet?

Peter_Griffin

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I ran into a Flexjet crew the other day and I couldn't shake the feeling I knew one of them from one of the recruiting interviews I've sat in on in the past year. I didn't recognize either crewmember but it was the FO who rang a bell. After talking to them and doing a little sly recon, I went back and checked my notes.

Sure enough he was someone we had interviewed. He came in on the recommendation of a friend or else he wouldn't have gotten that far. The dude hadn't sat in a cockpit for almost 3 years! Needless to say it was a serious pass.

I called a few buddies and they verified the only new hires you are getting are the ones no one else would hire. Someone higher up who shall remain nameless admitted 100% of your new hires in the past year would not have even been given a phone interview let alone a job under the old Flex rules.

I knew it was bad over there but this bad?

What you're seeing is the writing on the wall. Qualified candidates are treating your company like it is a career killer. Imagine what will happen if you vote the union out and you become known as an industry killer too. You fools won't even fill the cockpit of the flying dumbo at Disneyland let alone move onto a quality position after Ricci tanks your company and pockets what little silver he can scrape up from the ashes.

Good luck. Unfortunately there's very little I can do to help my old Flex friends if that happens. Union committee members will always get a little extra help from those of us in a position to do it, it's part of the unspoken benefits of fraternity, but if you can't prove your support via a reccomedation from your leadership council it will be a lot of deaf ears.

The Sophies choice for union haters is keeping your union is your only hope for moving on. Accordingly, you have to ask yourself if you honestly believe you can keep up the pace that will be demanded of you post-decert and also figure out just exactly how much you trust Ricci's business plan.
 

Lumpsum

Active member
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Apr 27, 2016
Posts
33
..." keeping your union is your only hope for moving on".


Back 10 or 15 years ago the Fractional jobs were mostly seen as "experience builder" jobs but not any more.
You too are putting the BIG SCARE with no good reason.
The Teamsters have been doing a lousy job for years. Why did all the other fractional pilots without the Teamsters do better than the Flight Option pilots who have the Teamsters? Doesn't make sense to me.
So Flexjet should keep the Teamsters that are doing a crappy job for them just so the pilots that want to leave Flexjet can get jobs somewhere else?
You are either giving little old Flexjet, who wants to fire the Teamsters, way too much credit or you are saying the entire aviation world, who have good unions, are way too fragile?
Which is it?

 

rajflyboy

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Are you new to the industry or somethin ?

this is what happens when the airlines start hiring in mass
 

shanes123

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I look at this vote as a win win for the union pilots. If we win it we retain QOL, and job protections, if we lose it members in good standing move on to a better job ( lots out there ). And the rest learn the true 2NN way of doing business we have all experienced. So I don’t really care which way this vote goes all though I will vote for the 1108.
 

Peter_Griffin

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My point is people who should have never been hired are now sharing your cockpits.

If the airlines are hiring in mass and even they are passing these pilots up, that ought to tell you something about the direction your company is moving. As a former Flexer, that's a bummer.

The fact, and I mean fact, is if Flexjet votes out their union you will become the pariah of the industry. Voting out their union puts the rest of our industry at risk by releasing the hounds of the RTW special interest groups who will now smell blood in the water.

This is not giving Flexjet too much credit or the strong unions too little credit. This is about recognizing there is big politics and big money behind this campaign.

Flexjet just happens to be weak enough in both the solidarity and management combined it is an easy test pool for a much bigger war. If you don't see that, then you are new to the industry and you aren't nearly as worried as you ought to be.

As for the last comment, the self-serving-no-matter-what-happens-it-will-be-good-for-me attitude is what got you into this mess. I'd suggest you rethink whether or not you really will be OK either way. I don't think you are cognizant of the likelihood your name with Flexjet attached will just somehow lose its luster.
 

rajflyboy

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My point is people who should have never been hired are now sharing your cockpits.

If the airlines are hiring in mass and even they are passing these pilots up, that ought to tell you something about the direction your company is moving. As a former Flexer, that's a bummer.

The fact, and I mean fact, is if Flexjet votes out their union you will become the pariah of the industry. Voting out their union puts the rest of our industry at risk by releasing the hounds of the RTW special interest groups who will now smell blood in the water.

This is not giving Flexjet too much credit or the strong unions too little credit. This is about recognizing there is big politics and big money behind this campaign.

Flexjet just happens to be weak enough in both the solidarity and management combined it is an easy test pool for a much bigger war. If you don't see that, then you are new to the industry and you aren't nearly as worried as you ought to be.

As for the last comment, the self-serving-no-matter-what-happens-it-will-be-good-for-me attitude is what got you into this mess. I'd suggest you rethink whether or not you really will be OK either way. I don't think you are cognizant of the likelihood your name with Flexjet attached will just somehow lose its luster.


What planet are you living on?

It is very difficult to get on with a Major. Many great pilots do not get hired.
 

Peter_Griffin

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What planet are you living on?

It is very difficult to get on with a Major. Many great pilots do not get hired.

I responded yesterday but for some reason it was deleted.

Your comment is exactly my point.

There are plenty of good, qualified pilots left over from what the majors aren't swooping up. Pilots with hours and currency. Pilots with actual jet time to boot.

But that's not who Flexjet is hiring. Flexjet has reduced their hiring minimums and beyond that they are apparently so desperate for bodies they are hiring candidates once reserved for starter cargo and flight instructing.

There are a ton of pilots who are taking advantage of the "shortage" and coming back into the marketplace. That's awesome. But these people have no business being in the cockpit of a fractional jet as the first re-entry position. An incident or accident under those circumstances could kill a company.

As an old Flexer it kills me to see what my friends are up against. If the PMs and other inquiries I've put out to contacts is accurate, I'm not even describing half of what's going on.

If you don't want to view this as a serious problem that's your choice. However I think it's pretty damn clear what the market thinks about Ricci's chances of running a quality operation are and it's showing up in their lack of candidates. Getting rid of the union guarantees you will never get another qualified pilot free from other issues (like age or a bad personality) to consider Flexjet as a career opportunity.
 

Kermit_D_Frog

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Guess the likes of RH and all his buddies can go fly em all until it folds. Hope he's ready to retire after that. He'll never go anywhere worthy again. Maybe a lr24 for Kalitta.
 

rajflyboy

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I responded yesterday but for some reason it was deleted.

Your comment is exactly my point.

There are plenty of good, qualified pilots left over from what the majors aren't swooping up. Pilots with hours and currency. Pilots with actual jet time to boot.

But that's not who Flexjet is hiring. Flexjet has reduced their hiring minimums and beyond that they are apparently so desperate for bodies they are hiring candidates once reserved for starter cargo and flight instructing.

There are a ton of pilots who are taking advantage of the "shortage" and coming back into the marketplace. That's awesome. But these people have no business being in the cockpit of a fractional jet as the first re-entry position. An incident or accident under those circumstances could kill a company.

As an old Flexer it kills me to see what my friends are up against. If the PMs and other inquiries I've put out to contacts is accurate, I'm not even describing half of what's going on.

If you don't want to view this as a serious problem that's your choice. However I think it's pretty damn clear what the market thinks about Ricci's chances of running a quality operation are and it's showing up in their lack of candidates. Getting rid of the union guarantees you will never get another qualified pilot free from other issues (like age or a bad personality) to consider Flexjet as a career opportunity.

I see. Thanks for the explanation.
 

MOMOMOJO

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Joined
Apr 5, 2018
Posts
92
Guess the likes of RH and all his buddies can go fly em all until it folds. Hope he's ready to retire after that. He'll never go anywhere worthy again. Maybe a lr24 for Kalitta.

Nah even Kalitta has the sense the be unionized. I'm sure the guys in charge are smart enough to deny the existence of blacklist behavior but we all know the reality is quite different. If you choose to look at it as thugly that's your prerogative but most pilots I know choose to look at it as akin to putting up "information notices" when you find out there's child molesters in your neighborhood. Brutal yes but absolutely neccessary. Keep your trash outside of your kitchen and you stay free from rats.

Suffice to say I don't think RH, FW, PD, LK or MR have very good options outside of Flexjet at this point.
 

shanes123

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I would say they have Zero!!!! They are. infamous. Of course I don’t think those incompetent clowns had many options before Probably that’s how they see it
 

squawk

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Feb 17, 2014
Posts
137
Many Flexjet newhires are very hard working and good pilots. Most lack a college degree. This is why the fractionals seem like an opportunity for them. It is untrue that they are unemployable at airlines but for the lack of a degree.
 

EnFuego

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Joined
Mar 27, 2018
Posts
125
Many Flexjet newhires are very hard working and good pilots. Most lack a college degree. This is why the fractionals seem like an opportunity for them. It is untrue that they are unemployable at airlines but for the lack of a degree.

Is it true no one showed up for the last new hire class? Because I heard that from someone in the schoolhouse.
 
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