"We aren't allowed to call NIL"

[DiverDriver]

Heard on the radio a pirep being made that said BA was poor to less than poor. The other voice said "You mean NIL?" The pilot responded with "We're not allowed to call NIL."

WTF...OVER!!! Have we all lost any sense of spine? And WTF ops spec has the "you can't call NIL" in it? I'm really curious. Can anyone produce such an ops spec?

 

[Groucho]

What company made that call? That is pure bullsh*t. Those BA calls are for the benefit of others and a safety call for other pilots. If you have already landed why not call it like it is.

 

[ImbracableCrunk]

No, no one can. And sadly some people think that you're doing others a favor by not calling BRAN.

 

[twighead]

Heard on the radio a pirep being made that said BA was poor to less than poor. The other voice said "You mean NIL?" The pilot responded with "We're not allowed to call NIL."

WTF...OVER!!! Have we all lost any sense of spine? And WTF ops spec has the "you can't call NIL" in it? I'm really curious. Can anyone produce such an ops spec?

There is no way someone's ops specs can say that. That would mean that it would be written in black & white that they are pontentially witholding information that could very seriously affect the saftey of other airplanes

 

[Oakum_Boy]

NIL will close the airport. ICAO reports don't use NIL. It could have been a foreign carrier, but that is unlikely since they used the words "less than poor".

This sounds weird. Was the FO wearing an IPOD?

 

[DiverDriver]

It was a US carrier. It was not on tower frequency and I should have so stated as this would probably get people riled up more. My bad.

This flight said they were waiting for a gate to open and couldn't stop even though the parking brake was set. The only option they had left was to kill the engines but they "didn't want to shut down the whole operation." What pure BS. I don't care if it's a runway, taxiway, or ramp if it's NIL it's NIL and wherever it's NIL it NEEDS to be shut down so someone doesn't have a mishap.

Hell, I called BA NIL on a taxiway this morning in PHL. It was right in a corner that most people take crossing 27R. Could have caused someone with more speed than a crawl to run off into the grass.

 

[CFIcare]

I called one nil the other day. I wish the guy in front of me had the nerve to call it instead of saying "poor to maybe nil". It would have spared me the pucker slide. So the airport was shut down while a convoy plowed the runway. Why do they have to wait until it's that bad to do something? Because no one wants to be the one to call it. Great, but what if you are the one who skates right off into the weeds because the guy in front thought he was doing you a favor?

 

[Chest Rockwell]

Anyone that thinks that they are doing one a favor by not calling it the way they see it has no business flying paying passengers, especially in an airplane.

 

[belchfire]

Dipstick! He might not be able to operate anymore if he called it nil and it might have shut down some operations for a while but WTF? Get the guys out there to clean the ramp off or shut down the airport and go to the hotel!

 

[MJG]

It's a tough call to make, but especially after what happened in MDW last year, we HAVE to make this call if we feel that it's warrented. Your buddies on the approach behind you are depending on these reports to help them make a land/go around decision. I agree that no one wants to be "the one" that causes everyone else to go around or divert, but our job is full of tough decisions and sometimes we just have to do the unpopular thing.

 

[JetPilot_Mike]

I'd rather the guy in front of me call NIL, than find out myself at 142Kts Vref.

 

[AWACoff]

Unfortunately we all have worked with people who are afraid to call braking action NIL or declare an emergency. The key here is that if you are in doubt as to whether it's poor or NIL....do us all a favor and call it NIL. We get paid no matter what. Let's be safe out there and error on the side of caution.

 

[PURPLEHAZE21]

Back in the 90's a commuter landed at BDL airport during a SN/ FZRA storm. The crew said BA was poor to "help" the UPS DC8 on the inbound (BA was nil). Guess what....the DC8 slid off the runway and took out alot of stuff...

Just remember...someone ahead of you might be calling the BA as "Poor"

 

[siucavflight]

I know that for me personally being behind an aircraft who called NIL I would be happy to find out while I still have other options.

 

[DrewBlows]

I agree with everyone, but let me add that all braking action is not created equal, just as all turbulance is not created equal. I've seen a Caravan call braking action "nil" after we were able to stop. We called the very same conditions "poor". We had anti-skid, he did not. In the DC-8 case it's very possible that the lighter airplane really considered the braking action "poor", but the same conditions were "nil" to the big boy.

I've also commuted in the back of an EMB-135 on the same day that I was to fly an ercoupe. After the turbulance experienced in the the EMB, I figured it was going to be a rough ride in the ercoupe, but it was mostly smooth. The difference was that the jet was going 250 KIAS and the piston was going 85 mph.

 

[HelloNewman]

If its NIL I would rather have someone call it than finding out when we hit the brakes and suck the seats up our asses!!

 

[blzr]

Had some DOLT call the B.A. Nil the other day at kCPS. We were on final, about to go around when the MU-2 truns off the runway and taxies to the ramp, no problem. So we ask if it was REALLY nil.. If it was NIL, i would have been expecting the aircraft to slide off the end and into the Missouri River. I mean, Nil means NIL, right?

We landed and in effect, the runway was Fair especially if you cheated to the left of center line. The Taxiways were a totally different story. They were ALMOST nil.

Please don't call it nil if it ain't nil.

 

[PURPLEHAZE21]

Just to clarify...The crew of the commuter knew it was Nil and decided to call it poor to "help out".

P.S. Whats this "Almost NIL" junk...call a spade a spade !!!!!!!!

 

[DrewBlows]

Just to clarify...The crew of the commuter knew it was Nil and decided to call it poor to "help out".

P.S. Whats this "Almost NIL" junk...call a spade a spade !!!!!!!!

Didn't catch that part. Helped them out a whole lot, didn't it?

 

[ASH]

Anyone land last night or early this morning into ORD 27L........yikes.....it's called a PLOW use it!!

On a side note, this may be a helpful time for the FI community to talk about braking techniques on icy/snow. i.e. the relationship of reverse thrust use to braking, etc. Discuss.

 

[atrdriver]

Anyone that thinks that they are doing one a favor by not calling it the way they see it has no business flying paying passengers, especially in an airplane.

OK, I've GOT to ask...as opposed to flying them in what?