Virgin America may seek public offering next year, CEO says

[jayme]

VA is borrowing $ for day to day working capital at a very expensive rate, the full terms do not have to be disclosed because they're private..

Really? What's the "expensive" interest rate? What's your source?

I call BS.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

I love the analysis by pilot financial gurus. Thanks!

No kidding. If pilots they were smart they wouldn't be pilots, they would be CEOs, but they are not, so they are pilots. Thanks goodness they have web boards so they can post things that make them feel smart.

It's a great job but pilots are among the biggest bunch of self-aggrandizing, wannabe CEO, CFO, investment banker, hedge fund analyst (insert professional) dipsh1ts in the world.

I have read the same bullsh1t from the same web tards about so many different topics over the years, I am amazed I ever login. It's the same conversations and arguments over and over and over.

I remember was United was "going to liquidate" and Dal, and Cal and you name it. Who gives a sh1t.

Quit having the same conversations would ya?

 

[ualdriver]

No kidding. If pilots they were smart they wouldn't be pilots, they would be CEOs, but they are not, so they are pilots. Thanks goodness they have web boards so they can post things that make them feel smart.

It's a great job but pilots are among the biggest bunch of self-aggrandizing, wannabe CEO, CFO, investment banker, hedge fund analyst (insert professional) dipsh1ts in the world.

I have read the same bullsh1t from the same web tards about so many different topics over the years, I am amazed I ever login. It's the same conversations and arguments over and over and over.

I remember was United was "going to liquidate" and Dal, and Cal and you name it. Who gives a sh1t.

Quit having the same conversations would ya?

Actually, I think if many pilots weren't pilots, they would probably hold leadership positions like the ones you mention. Most pilots are pretty smart, educated, work hard to get to where they are, and certainly capable of holding positions of responsibility.

That having been said, you don't have to be a genius to look at the numbers VA has made public and see that something is terribly wrong.

 

[slavenaway]

Ya think?

 

[Flyer1015]

Actually, I think if many pilots weren't pilots, they would probably hold leadership positions like the ones you mention. Most pilots are pretty smart, educated, work hard to get to where they are, and certainly capable of holding positions of responsibility.

That having been said, you don't have to be a genius to look at the numbers VA has made public and see that something is terribly wrong.

If things were terribly wrong, this place would have imploded already. But every year since VA operated, there have always been predictions that it was going away 'very, very soon.' You, nor anyone else here, do not know what goes on in the minds of the investors of this airline. One thing that is fact is that the airline is making money on its matured routes. If they wanted to just post a profit, we'd stop growing (defer deliveries), stop new city growth, and focus only on mature markets and post a profit. But the Board and the investors have a vision for this airline, have the financial analysis done to support the ideas that they have for this place.

 

[ualdriver]

If things were terribly wrong, this place would have imploded already. But every year since VA operated, there have always been predictions that it was going away 'very, very soon.' You, nor anyone else here, do not know what goes on in the minds of the investors of this airline. One thing that is fact is that the airline is making money on its matured routes. If they wanted to just post a profit, we'd stop growing (defer deliveries), stop new city growth, and focus only on mature markets and post a profit. But the Board and the investors have a vision for this airline, have the financial analysis done to support the ideas that they have for this place.

Got it. Your Board and its investors have a vision so everything is OK. Thanks for straightening things out for me.

 

[Chairman]

Got it. Your Board and its investors have a vision so everything is OK. Thanks for straightening things out for me.

Sure hope things work out for you....Delta has a TA regardless of UAL's BK rates and years without a contract. I would not be so quick to keep throwing pies and the clown....For years now we have said if your right you have nothing to worry about as we will be out of business and it's such a bad place to work everyone will leave when my UAL recall comes. I will love to come back to the bottom feeding $32hr I was making..

 

[ualdriver]

Sure hope things work out for you....Delta has a TA regardless of UAL's BK rates and years without a contract. I would not be so quick to keep throwing pies and the clown....For years now we have said if your right you have nothing to worry about as we will be out of business and it's such a bad place to work everyone will leave when my UAL recall comes. I will love to come back to the bottom feeding $32hr I was making..

Chairman

Maybe this new UAL contract needs to keep those bottom feeding $32/hr rates so that we can better compete with nonunion, undercutting carriers like VA and others that will pop up in the future?

Let me ask you a question as a United furloughee who I assume is looking at the rates offered at airlines like SWA and Delta (and hopefully United)...... Knowing that VA is using undercutting, nonunion wages to help subsidize their low fares in an attempt to gain market share, do you hope that VA is successful in this undertaking? Do you hope that VA is successful in their new DCA route where it will compete directly against United? If you did come back to United or get hired at one of the better airlines out there, would you be OK with VA pilots coming in at payrates significantly lower than this round of pattern bargaining will likely yield for all of us? What if airlines like VA grew at your new airline's expense and that six figure narrowbody first officer job disappeared because your airline couldn't compete with an airline like VA and their discount airline wages?

I think we both know the answers to the above questions. Perhaps you shouldn't be attacking a guy who may be going out on strike (hopefully) in a few weeks in an attempt to raise those wages you are criticizing while your peers at VA sit on their collective butts and do nothing to further the profession?

 

[Tomct]

Chairman

Maybe this new UAL contract needs to keep those bottom feeding $32/hr rates so that we can better compete with nonunion, undercutting carriers like VA and others that will pop up in the future?

Let me ask you a question as a United furloughee who I assume is looking at the rates offered at airlines like SWA and Delta (and hopefully United)...... Knowing that VA is using undercutting, nonunion wages to help subsidize their low fares in an attempt to gain market share, do you hope that VA is successful in this undertaking? Do you hope that VA is successful in their new DCA route where it will compete directly against United? If you did come back to United or get hired at one of the better airlines out there, would you be OK with VA pilots coming in at payrates significantly lower than this round of pattern bargaining will likely yield for all of us? What if airlines like VA grew at your new airline's expense and that six figure narrowbody first officer job disappeared because your airline couldn't compete with an airline like VA and their discount airline wages?

I think we both know the answers to the above questions. Perhaps you shouldn't be attacking a guy who may be going out on strike (hopefully) in a few weeks in an attempt to raise those wages you are criticizing while your peers at VA sit on their collective butts and do nothing to further the profession?

And YET, once again UAL continues to talk out of his other HOLE! With your "All mighty knowledge" I thought for SURE you would know that a Union Drive is currently underway at VX. But of course, you are too stubborn and foolish to look much further than the end of your nose. I can't wait for the BS to start then....WHEN are you guys going to get a contract....blah....blah....blah! If the UNION (ALPO) had been doing its job in the first place, it would have become a NATIONAL Union for ALL CARRIERS and created ONE seniority list, but instead, just likes taking everyone's money (mine included at previous carrier) and NOT working for the pilots! It has become a business to them and nothing more. 8-10 times they are siding with mgmnt of the airlines and continually screwing with the pilots! I hope DALPA leaves and creates it's own union and lets ALPA fall into the fire! There needs to be a house cleaning at that place and a new and different Union started! One that actually works for the PILOTS!
Now....Back to your regularly scheduled "Pitty Party!" :crying:

 

[ualdriver]

And YET, once again UAL continues to talk out of his other HOLE! With your "All mighty knowledge" I thought for SURE you would know that a Union Drive is currently underway at VX. But of course, you are too stubborn and foolish to look much further than the end of your nose. I can't wait for the BS to start then....WHEN are you guys going to get a contract....blah....blah....blah! If the UNION (ALPO) had been doing its job in the first place, it would have become a NATIONAL Union for ALL CARRIERS and created ONE seniority list, but instead, just likes taking everyone's money (mine included at previous carrier) and NOT working for the pilots! It has become a business to them and nothing more. 8-10 times they are siding with mgmnt of the airlines and continually screwing with the pilots! I hope DALPA leaves and creates it's own union and lets ALPA fall into the fire! There needs to be a house cleaning at that place and a new and different Union started! One that actually works for the PILOTS!
Now....Back to your regularly scheduled "Pitty Party!" :crying:

The industry looks forward to VA showing us all "how it's done." I won't hold my breath.

 

[Flyer1015]

Chairman

Maybe this new UAL contract needs to keep those bottom feeding $32/hr rates so that we can better compete with nonunion, undercutting carriers like VA and others that will pop up in the future?

Let me ask you a question as a United furloughee who I assume is looking at the rates offered at airlines like SWA and Delta (and hopefully United)...... Knowing that VA is using undercutting, nonunion wages to help subsidize their low fares in an attempt to gain market share, do you hope that VA is successful in this undertaking? Do you hope that VA is successful in their new DCA route where it will compete directly against United? If you did come back to United or get hired at one of the better airlines out there, would you be OK with VA pilots coming in at payrates significantly lower than this round of pattern bargaining will likely yield for all of us? What if airlines like VA grew at your new airline's expense and that six figure narrowbody first officer job disappeared because your airline couldn't compete with an airline like VA and their discount airline wages?

I think we both know the answers to the above questions. Perhaps you shouldn't be attacking a guy who may be going out on strike (hopefully) in a few weeks in an attempt to raise those wages you are criticizing while your peers at VA sit on their collective butts and do nothing to further the profession?

The same could have been said about Southwest in the 90s. Did you share those same views? SWA even in the 90s had several hundred 737s competing with the majors/legacies all across the country for some of the cheapest fares ever. Look how times changed and where SWA is now. I do hope VA succeeds and offers higher wage/QOL increases as time goes on. There have been 3 raises to date, and as the carrier becomes successful/profitable, there is room for much improvements for pay, QOL, etc.

 

[ualdriver]

The same could have been said about Southwest in the 90s. Did you share those same views?

Yup. SWA screwed us legacy guys in the 90's as well by undercutting the prevailing narrowbody rates, work rules, retirement, etc., just like VA is doing now.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Yup. SWA screwed us legacy guys in the 90's as well by undercutting the prevailing narrowbody rates, work rules, retirement, etc., just like VA is doing now.

I guess I can deduce two things from your post.

It is all about you, and the rest of the industry is here to support your desired wage rates and lifestyle.

You are not big fan of capitalism.

I'm sorry but I think your anger is misplaced, Virgin nor Southwest caused the ills of the industry, Alfred Kahn and the ADA did.

 

[bri5150]

I guess I can deduce two things from your post.

It is all about you, and the rest of the industry is here to support your desired wage rates and lifestyle.

You are not big fan of capitalism.

I'm sorry but I think your anger is misplaced, Virgin nor Southwest caused the ills of the industry, Alfred Kahn and the ADA did.

I will also add that he must think it is not okay for more airlines to start up. Also, it is okay for a legacy to price a startup out of a market, but it is not okay for the startup to have a price lower than the established legacy price.

An earlier post incorrectly stated first year rate of $32. APC says $44, then $65, then $77 I believe. That would put me above my regional jet pic rate in 3 years (heck, 2 years after bk), and at an airline that controls its own flying. Unlike a regional that has been screwed time and time again by the legacies that are so highly toughted here. I would say more, bit I don't believe in burning bridges.

 

[Chairman]

I will also add that he must think it is not okay for more airlines to start up. Also, it is okay for a legacy to price a startup out of a market, but it is not okay for the startup to have a price lower than the established legacy price.

An earlier post incorrectly stated first year rate of $32. APC says $44, then $65, then $77 I believe. That would put me above my regional jet pic rate in 3 years (heck, 2 years after bk), and at an airline that controls its own flying. Unlike a regional that has been screwed time and time again by the legacies that are so highly toughted here. I would say more, bit I don't believe in burning bridges.

$32 is what UAL pays there first year guys...