VFR departure from non-towered airport

[deadstick]

I found this ICAO reference to "vicinity" as it applies to weather reporting, which takes it to 16km.

http://www.icao.int/icao/en/anb/met/divmtg/wp/wp019_en.pdf

I was looking at this from the standpoint that the FAA wouldn't have two definitions for the same word, right? :erm: Riiiiight.....

 

[pilotyip]

Cfi

But I have a question: what did the other CFI says was the proper departure procedure and what was his source?

I was flying the B-17 giving rides to passengers from an uncontrolled airport. We took off flew runway heading for about 1.5 to 2 miles and then turned right. After we landed a CFI came up and told me our procedure violated uncontrolled airport procedures. He told me you could not make right turns out of a left hand pattern. He said we had to start a left turn before turning right. I told him we were no longer in the pattern at our position and feel we were in complience at that time by making a right turn. He did not state a source and I thanked him for his concern. I just wanted some others input to this problem. As I said to Avbug, the term "fuzzy" defining vicnity fits here

 

[avbug]

I was looking at this from the standpoint that the FAA wouldn't have two definitions for the same word, right?

Not relevant, as that's an ICAO reference, not an FAA reference.

 

[deadstick]

Not relevant, as that's an ICAO reference, not an FAA reference.

Ok, US (NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE INSTRUCTION 10-813
December 19, 2008) reference had a 10 nm circle with a 5 nm doughnut hole.

No need to get snippy. Jeez. The only numerical reference that I have found has been with respect to these weather reports.

 

[avbug]

No need to get snippy. Jeez. The only numerical reference that I have found has been with respect to these weather reports.

A statement of fact is not being "snippy."

You won't find a reference, as there is none. The weather reports do not define the regulation, or provide definition regarding airport traffic patterns.

 

[SSDD]

I know its not regulatory, but at my company, we treat it the same as Class D. So if we're making a right turn, we go straight out for 5 miles before turning.

 

[midlifeflyer]

He did not state a source

...because he didn't have one.

As I said to Avbug, the term "fuzzy" defining vicnity fits here

Except that vicinity is irrelevant to the departure question.

But FWIW, "vicinity" in 91.126 has a situational-based meaning that might loosely be defined as "a distance that has a potential impact on other traffic in the pattern," or, like pornography, "We know it when we see it."

The best example is probably the Alaska Airlines cases. The later of the two is here. http://www.ntsb.gov/alj/O_n_O/docs/AVIATION/3523.PDF The earlier is before the NTSB started posting them on the website, but in the earlier one, the distance was 6 miles.

 

[nismo611]

I believe that meteorological conditions apply. If it is in IMC you don't have to worry about conflicts with VFR traffic if it is VMC follow VFR procedures until you are clear of the traffic pattern. Your ATC clearance should specify what heading to enter controlled airspace so it also depends where the controlled airspace begins. avbug can spout out regs all day he is a moron. Some people like avbug and that CFI will come up to you spouting off, who cares what they think!!!! Screw em do what you want as long as it is safe he is a dick and so is avbug.

 

[JAFI]

I believe that meteorological conditions apply. If it is in IMC you don't have to worry about conflicts with VFR traffic if it is VMC follow VFR procedures until you are clear of the traffic pattern. Your ATC clearance should specify what heading to enter controlled airspace so it also depends where the controlled airspace begins. avbug can spout out regs all day he is a moron. Some people like avbug and that CFI will come up to you spouting off, who cares what they think!!!! Screw em do what you want as long as it is safe he is a dick and so is avbug.

I beg to differ - See and Avoid REGARDLESS of weather conditions. If your statement was true, how come (when I was on an IFR flight plan) I was normally dodging slow VFR traffic in IMC at Instrument altitudes?

do what you want as long as it is safe

I would like to see your reference or legal interpitation for that statement......

As to who is a dick or a moron, I think you have had enough juice today. Put the juice box back in the fridge and let the sugar wear off before you post any more "intelligent" observations.

 

[avbug]

This also begs the question, of course, why one would introduce an incorrect application of IFR procedures, when this thread involves a question founded in giving VFR airplane rides at an uncontrolled field.

Absolutely see and avoid is the rule, and the law.

One is left to wonder how an ATC clearance applies here...seeing as we're discussing VFR uncontrolled flying at an uncontrolled field...and there's no clearance involved.