USAPA wins appeal!!!!!!

[BeCareful!]

The second trial will be much faster. It took the jury 5 minutes to decide in this trial. They only waited until the next day to get another day off work.

So enjoy the "victory" of this battle CRZ. But the war is far from over!

Judge Wake's instructions are mostly responsible for that quick jury decision. As you can see from the results of the appeal, those instructions were probably flawed. Not to bother a guy like you with facts, though....carry on with your important Internet hypotheses.

That war you're planning, will it be with the mighty Army of Leonidas? Where did they go? Quick retreat. Will there be a mighty new army to try to screw the majority?

We can move forward, or you guys can wage war. I guess that's your choice, just as not allowing a flawed arbitration to prevail was our choice. Whatever. As was stated, simply not using the Nic is not DFR. Perhaps y'all should look at the final product before screaming foul. Oh, wait....I forgot I was on FlightMisInfo.com....riiiight, OK, well then I'm sure someone will move in quick, call us all scabs, and tell us how a quick injunction and trial will follow and then Obama will force us all to the bottom of the list. (I just hope he fixes that oil spill first and secures middle east peace and fixes the economy,)

 

[Turtle21]

Yes the Judges did, ...

Dismissed.

"[T]he final product of the bargaining process may constitute evidence of a breach of duty only if it can be fairly characterized as so far outside a ‘wide range of reasonableness,’ that it is wholly ‘irrational’ or ‘arbitrary.’

U.S. Supreme Court

http://www.ca9.uscourts.gov/datastore/opinions/2010/06/04/09-16564.pdfOOXX:blush:

 

[Raoul Duke]

[8] Plaintiffs seek to escape this conclusion by framing
their harm as the lost opportunity to have a CBA implementing
the Nicolau Award put to a ratification vote. Because
merely putting a CBA effectuating the Nicolau Award to a
ratification vote will not itself alleviate the West Pilots furloughs,
Plaintiffs have not identified a sufficiently concrete
injury.2 Additionally, USAPA’s final proposal may yet be one
that does not work the disadvantages Plaintiffs fear, even if
that proposal is not the Nicolau Award.3


Indeed, the Supreme Court case that clarified that the DFR
was applicable during contract negotiations articulated its
holding in terms that imply a claim can be brought only after
negotiations are complete and a “final product” has been
reached. See Air Line Pilots Ass’n, Int’l v. O’Neill, 499 U.S.
65, 78 (1991) (“[T]he final product of the bargaining process
may constitute evidence of a breach of duty only if it can be
fairly characterized as so far outside a ‘wide range of reasonableness,’
that it is wholly ‘irrational’ or ‘arbitrary.’ ” (quoting
Ford Motor Co. v. Huffman, 345 U.S. 330, 338 (1953))).

Page 13 of 26 of the decision....

1The dissent asserts that “nothing would be gained by postponing a
decision, and the parties’ interest would be well served by a prompt resolution of the West Pilots’ claim.” Diss. op. at 8017 (internal alterations,
quotation marks, and citation omitted). To be sure, the parties’ interest
would be served by prompt resolution of the seniority dispute, but that is
not the same as prompt resolution of the DFR claim. The present impasse,
in fact, could well be prolonged by prematurely resolving the West Pilots’
claim judicially at this point. Forced to bargain for the Nicolau Award, any
contract USAPA could negotiate would undoubtedly be rejected by its
membership. By deferring judicial intervention, we leave USAPA to bargain
in good faith pursuant to its DFR, with the interests of all members
— both East and West — in mind, under pain of an unquestionably ripe
DFR suit, once a contract is ratified.

3We do not address the thorny question of the extent to which the
Nicolau Award is binding on USAPA. We note, as the district court recog-
nized, that USAPA is at least as free to abandon the Nicolau Award as was
its predecessor, ALPA. The dissent appears implicitly to assume that the
Nicolau Award, the product of the internal rules and processes of ALPA,
is binding on USAPA. See Diss op. at 8021-22.

Seems as though the court recognizes the fact, that negotiating for a contract including the NIC is useless. They task USAPA with negotiating within their DFR for a contract, with the fact in mind that ripeness will be reached WHEN A CONTRACT IS RATIFIED.

this does NOT mean, if the NIC isn't used, USAPA has failed it's DFR.


In Addition once a CBA is voted in, as long as what is contained within it, Including Section 22, is within a wide range of reasonableness (not the narrow band width of West pilots Ideas) that is wholly not irrational or arbitrary, the union will be determined to have upheld it's DFR.


so those of you that say this is BS blah blah, I guess you don't agree with the court system as a remedy to problems?

--------------------------------------------------------------------
The only paragraph that matters above is the footnote -
We note, as the district court recognized, that USAPA is at least as free to abandon the Nicolau Award as was its predecessor, ALPA.

At the end of the day the only thing that matters in this case is whether they have the right to abandon the integrated list. The Court's decision was solely based on timing. As soon as a contract is proposed that tries to change the seniority list, the case becomes ripe and the ultimate issue is back before the Court. Given the fact that USAPA lost to a jury it is very likely that they will lose again.

 

[TWA Dude]

We can move forward, or you guys can wage war.

Our war is a defensive war and it's a war we didn't start. Don't expect us to fly a white flag just because we lost a battle.

 

[Sandhawk]

So brave on the internet

Heya pot, did ya meet your buddy kettle?

 

[cactusboy53]

I am in the same boat. I do not work at either joint but the East guys are something else. Where can I send money to help with the west legal fees?

Sleeves;
Thank you so much for your support. You are not the first non-US Airways pilot to make this offer, and perhaps you won't be the last. Contributions can be made at:

Leonidas LLC​

PO Box 3362​

Tempe, AZ 85280

Again, thank you for your support and steping up. You can also go to: www.cactuspilot.org

CB
​

 

[Turtle21]

Sleeves;
Thank you so much for your support. You are not the first non-US Airways pilot to make this offer, and perhaps you won't be the last. Contributions can be made at:

Leonidas LLC​

PO Box 3362​

Tempe, AZ 85280

Again, thank you for your support and steping up. You can also go to: www.cactuspilot.org

CB
​

I sent a $20 bill in honor of ALPA John P. and Rez. Its the least I could do since you are paying the dues to fund USAPA's defense against frivolous lawsuits that get dismissed.

Heck, I think I'll set up a monthly contribution since you are making it so easy to donate.

Wait.. Why isn't ALPA John P. funding this $h!t! He made a pinky promise. What about his integrity.

 

[Ocity]

I sent a $20 bill in honor of ALPA John P. and Rez. Its the least I could do since you are paying the dues to fund USAPA's defense against frivolous lawsuits that get dismissed.
.

Your Scab union didn't win anything. It's back to square one except this time the scabs know that if they ratify, they blow their own brains out. Some win.

 

[PBRstreetgang]

http://articles.latimes.com/2007/jul/11/opinion/oe-fitzpatrick11

 

[CaptWidgeon]

wow, Alpa schrillers were up late last night...

nope, no alpa here. just an outsider's view looking in. i've seen info from both sides, call it propaganda or whatever, i've seen stuff from both sides. i'd never take an east's handshake or word on anything. still, amazed.

think i'll send a few bucks to tempe.