USA Today Pilot Pay article

[highsky]

Yea, you suck as a Martini Bar CEO. Thanks for proving my point, but don't worry, your employees at the Martini Bar will take it in the shorts so you can keep your Corvette. Now you understand. Jackass highsky.:smash:

Your irrelevant and incomprehensible reply clarifies that you're a narrow minded, self-absorbed hand job who is never going to get it.

 

[Green]

All I said was the pay at the regional is not the problem. For someone who is 23 and just starting out, 19K per year is not bad, get a roomate and share one of those oriental cars. Better yet, live at home with mom and dad. Figure upgrade at 3-4 years and one is making 50-60K as a 27 year old. I can't sneeze at that. Then off to Fedex/Swa 3-4 years down the road at 31 years. By second year he is making 85K at 32 yrs old. Upgrade 4 years down the road and I am making 200K at the ripe old age of 36. Sign me up!

Do us all a favor and change your attitude or quit. Please!

You are part of the problem not the solution. Unless you live in North Dakota 60k is not good money. Not even close....Let me guess you are either an Embry Riddle or UND guy. Those two schools have done a lot to ruin this industry.

 

[castle bravo]

If you don't like it or can't hack it, leave and let us new generation pilots in. 60K does go along way though. And you can pay a mortage, etc.....

$60k: minus $12k fed tax, minus $4.5k NY state tax, minus $3.6k social security leaves you with $39.5k. TRY (you mindless fool), just try to live in NY on $39.5k. Sales tax alone is another 8.25%, and we have not even started to talk about school and property tax. You have to be the dumbest clown I have ever heard.

 

[instructordude]

$60k: minus $12k fed tax, minus $4.5k NY state tax, minus $3.6k social security leaves you with $39.5k. TRY (you mindless fool), just try to live in NY on $39.5k. Sales tax alone is another 8.25%, and we have not even started to talk about school and property tax. You have to be the dumbest clown I have ever heard.

No, you really are the dumbest clown I have ever heard. New York City? WTFO? Why would anybody live there on that salary. How about Salt Lake City, Dallas, Atlanta, or Kansas City? 60K there does give you something. NYC?... Look who the clown is.

 

[instructordude]

Do us all a favor and change your attitude or quit. Please!

You are part of the problem not the solution. Unless you live in North Dakota 60k is not good money. Not even close....Let me guess you are either an Embry Riddle or UND guy. Those two schools have done a lot to ruin this industry.

Neither one. Worked my way up buddy boy. I have realistic expectations and quite frankly 60K for a 28-30 year old is pretty good. That is my goal and I am willing to work for that. Money aint everything its cracked up to be.

 

[PositionandHold]

No, you really are the dumbest clown I have ever heard. New York City? WTFO? Why would anybody live there on that salary. How about Salt Lake City, Dallas, Atlanta, or Kansas City? 60K there does give you something. NYC?... Look who the clown is.

Oh dear.

You didn't just miss the point. You aren't even capable of getting it.

 

[instructordude]

Oh dear.

You didn't just miss the point. You aren't even capable of getting it.

Getting what??

 

[757jetflier]

Several years ago this "dude" would have been the one waiting in the wings for Lorenzo's call.

 

[Caveman]

If you were offended, I apologize, but blaming SWA pay ratess for the legacy woes is nonsense in my opinion. Do LCC pay rates have an effect on those at the legacy carriers? I am certain that they do to some small degree. Much less effect than work rules that allow pilots at those carriers to fly less than 500 hours a year.

Fair enough and I agree. LCC pay scales are just one of the many challenges the legacies have to overcome.

 

[Dodge]

Maybe DL, NW, and UA will turn into pay for training to adjust to the changing times. They got the employees pay knocked down pretty good and the retirement is now worthless.

Soon, you will hear the SWA pilots complaining that their management is coming to them singing the "we just can't compete with NW, UA, and DL due to the higher wages we are paying you" song. What goes around comes around. It always does.

 

[PositionandHold]

Getting what??

Exactly.

I'll try again, anyways. Maybe more calmly this time:

Keep your standards high, kid. There is nothing better than somebody that has a passion for this job and loves to do it. You sound like you may have that passion. But there is nothing equally worse than letting that passion allow you to degrade the job by doing it for less than it's worth.

I will put this in better perspective for you with an example, because maybe we need to stop calling you an idiot and explain to you why you are wrong, first:

I like graphic design. I have done magazine covers for some of our University groups, and have done some corporate stuff. I also do it in my spare time because I plain enjoy making art. Let's say I wanted to make a career out of this, ok?

So, what we have are a few basic assumptions:
1. I enjoy graphic designing
2. I can make a career out of graphic design and potentially make it a business
...therefore, I start selling my designs.

The correct course of action for me to make this a livelihood is to take my graphic design skills (which I independently enjoy) and get the most money I can possibly get for them (because the alternative does not make rational sense--key word: rational). I have two options:
1. Ask companies to please use my graphics for their business, telling them I'll do it for less and less because I really like doing this and would love to see my artwork in their catalogs (gives me a hard on).
2. Sell my services to businesses (who need my services) and demand top dollar for my work because it is worth it and among the best they'll find.

The repercussions of choosing route 1: Management eventually paying less and less to me and others who were once lucrative at this venture, thereby bringing down the standard that was once held by the graphic design business.

This is not so different from your situation. You enjoy aviation, you love flying airplanes, and you have an option to make a career out of it, but you are choosing route 1. You cannot really believe that you are among the best pilots that Airline X can have if you believe that being paid substantially less than your older counterparts is acceptable because "19K is livable for my age group" or "60K after 10 years rox." Chances are, you don't live independently enough to come to that conclusion. And if you don't think this applies to you because you "know" you aren't among the best pilots Airline X will hire, this is not the profession for you. Find something that'll keep you on the ground and leave the responsibility to someone who truly try and believe they are among the best and responsible.

 

[DC8 Flyer]

Do us all a favor and change your attitude or quit. Please!

You are part of the problem not the solution. Unless you live in North Dakota 60k is not good money. Not even close....Let me guess you are either an Embry Riddle or UND guy. Those two schools have done a lot to ruin this industry.

A couple of years ago, that comment would have sent me into orbit. However, after spending some time in the real world I have to say I agree. Not because of the training or even the low time, but the mentallity that those of authority at UND put into students heads. You are basically told to take any job you can get, just to get the time. Don't make waves, don't ask questions, etc. Don't blame these poor kids though, someone of authority and a position of "power" is telling them this. We all need to do our best to educate and inform EVERYONE!.

 

[instructordude]

Exactly.

I'll try again, anyways. Maybe more calmly this time:

Keep your standards high, kid. There is nothing better than somebody that has a passion for this job and loves to do it. You sound like you may have that passion. But there is nothing equally worse than letting that passion allow you to degrade the job by doing it for less than it's worth.

I will put this in better perspective for you with an example, because maybe we need to stop calling you an idiot and explain to you why you are wrong, first:

I like graphic design. I have done magazine covers for some of our University groups, and have done some corporate stuff. I also do it in my spare time because I plain enjoy making art. Let's say I wanted to make a career out of this, ok?

So, what we have are a few basic assumptions:
1. I enjoy graphic designing
2. I can make a career out of graphic design and potentially make it a business
...therefore, I start selling my designs.

The correct course of action for me to make this a livelihood is to take my graphic design skills (which I independently enjoy) and get the most money I can possibly get for them (because the alternative does not make rational sense--key word: rational). I have two options:
1. Ask companies to please use my graphics for their business, telling them I'll do it for less and less because I really like doing this and would love to see my artwork in their catalogs (gives me a hard on).
2. Sell my services to businesses (who need my services) and demand top dollar for my work because it is worth it and among the best they'll find.

The repercussions of choosing route 1: Management eventually paying less and less to me and others who were once lucrative at this venture, thereby bringing down the standard that was once held by the graphic design business.

This is not so different from your situation. You enjoy aviation, you love flying airplanes, and you have an option to make a career out of it, but you are choosing route 1. You cannot really believe that you are among the best pilots that Airline X can have if you believe that being paid substantially less than your older counterparts is acceptable because "19K is livable for my age group" or "60K after 10 years rox." Chances are, you don't live independently enough to come to that conclusion. And if you don't think this applies to you because you "know" you aren't among the best pilots Airline X will hire, this is not the profession for you. Find something that'll keep you on the ground and leave the responsibility to someone who truly try and believe they are among the best and responsible.

Thanks.

 

[Scrapdog]

All I said was the pay at the regional is not the problem. For someone who is 23 and just starting out, 19K per year is not bad, get a roomate and share one of those oriental cars. Better yet, live at home with mom and dad. Figure upgrade at 3-4 years and one is making 50-60K as a 27 year old. I can't sneeze at that. Then off to Fedex/Swa 3-4 years down the road at 31 years. By second year he is making 85K at 32 yrs old. Upgrade 4 years down the road and I am making 200K at the ripe old age of 36. Sign me up!

That's until he gets black balled at both FDX and SWA for being a complete tool. Besides that, his plan sounds great.

 

[castle bravo]

Don't worry, even if he gets black balled he can still live in daddy's cellar for free in Omaha where his $7,000 after tax net annual income will go a long way.

 

[Green]

Neither one. Worked my way up buddy boy. I have realistic expectations and quite frankly 60K for a 28-30 year old is pretty good. That is my goal and I am willing to work for that. Money aint everything its cracked up to be.

I think D'angelo got tired of being on everyone's 'ignore' list and re-invented himself as instructordude.

Who needs to make more than 60k when a saturn costs you 10 grand and you can get a bag of Top Romen for under a dollar? Chicks dig poor guys in uniform...

 

[Hagar17]

OOOOhhhh, I love that! Can I make that my signature?

Sure! Can I get your number? Just playin'!

Looks like you already did! Rock on!

FO Ellefson