Upgrade at NJ?

[VmaxFlyR]

Fozzy:

So are you guess-timating 5 year F/Os at $48,000 per year (or whatever 5 year pay is under the new contract) in the year 2010? Hopefully not!

Could make recruiting interesting or at the least turn NJ into a type mill.

I actually meant to say "retention", not "recruiting".

 

[Pervis]

Taking 60 aircraft, IMO, is very optimistic. You still have to sell all these aircraft shares to owners who have become more intelligent over the years in a much more competitive landscape. Everyone now wants a piece of the pie. If you are new guy with wife and kids, plan for a loooooong upgrade, only to be rewarded with an "optimistic" 3-year upgrade. Don't be going after that 3 year interest only mortgage loan. Good luck.

According to the marketing gurus in March 2005 during company recurrent, we sold 125 airframes in 2004 while taking a net gain of 20 something. Our problem was an oversell situation which led to some major discontent among owners, since 50 or so of those were Marquis cards at 25 hrs/card. Equivalent of 1/16 shares.

Management has taken steps to limit Marquis effects, and manufacturers are finally stepping up production. We have a ways to go, but reliability has increased an average of 20-30% since the CBA. That helps as well. If the manufacturers stepped up, we'd gladly take double the projection for '06. Check out Sept '03 Aviation Week And Space Technology where a summation of NJA orders were listed. 1015 orders, and this before the announcement of 200 more. Some have gone away and some have been added, but we still plan on substantial growth in both the long and short term.

Yea, things change in time, and some older airframes will go away, like the CE650 and hawker 1000, but the owners keep coming. That's why I believe we can all benefit, as competition increases value of a product, and larger numbers make it better for all to reap the rewards, if we stand united.

 

[jrav8tor]

Thanks for the input so far everyone! It certainly provides a better picture for us looking to get on.

Anyone else have any opinions?

Thanks,

JR

 

[ashaman]

I interviewed at CS last month and they are telling new hires that upgrades will be 24 months.

 

[gunfyter]

Still better than 5 yrs.

 

[ashaman]

True. I'm not trying to make any judgements. Just posting info for those that might be interested.

 

[HAZ-MAT]

I came here with the impression of being an SIC for 5 years. If the upgrade occurs quicker, great, but if not... then I will transition to the F2000 and add that type to my list :beer:

 

[psysicx]

Isn't Falcon pay higher for newbies since there are only EX's?

 

[Qwertyuiop]

The last group of Captain bid awards went to pilots from late 2001/early 2002.

The most junior pilot to receive the latest upgrade bid has been with the company for about 4 years. However, there was at least one year in that period where there was virtually no hiring whatsoever. So, my best guess at upgrade time if future hiring continues at the present rate would be around 3 years, give or take a year.

 

[Qwertyuiop]

Isn't Falcon pay higher for newbies since there are only EX's?

Good luck trying to get a Falcon EX bid. Among the other aircraft types, the Ultra and Excel newbies will actually be paid $2,700 a year more than those on the other aircraft including the Falcon 2000 and Citation X etc. This is due to the additional crossover pay received for being qualified on more that one aircraft type (Ultra/Encore & Excel/XLS).